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March 28, 2024, 05:40:33 PM

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Bush bans gay marriage

Started by 23 Daves, February 24, 2004, 04:27:33 PM

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23 Daves

George Bush, right on the button for the issues that matter yet again I see:

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/040224/325/emtlh.html

Really, there's little that can be added to this, I suppose.  The very fact that such hysterical hand-wringing is happening at a time when far more serious events are rocking the world - both Iraq and the environment-  I think speaks volumes about both the mentality of middle America and George Bush himself at the moment.

To me, this is so strange. I can't remember the last time I was in the pub and somebody said "You know, gay marriage should be banned. It takes the fucking piss out of the sanctity of the occasion.  If a gay married couple were to walk into this pub now, I should tell them".  Even amongst the less liberated sectors of society in Britain, this is a non-issue.  In Bush-world, however, this is a big vote-winner, and solid firm proof that homosexuality will not be tolerated in the land of the free.

Vermschneid Mehearties

Another glowingly correct decision from Mr.Bush, protector of the free world.

smoker

gay marriage bans bush


aye arnie's cracking down on it in california as well. i did pick up a rumour somewhere yesterday that dubya tasted the fruit of man during his military service, i'll try and find it

Ambient Sheep

Via an amendment to the constitution, no less?!!!  Man's a fuckwit.

hencole

There's not really much difference between our own conservative party and the republicans on this issue. Depending of course which month it is and which voters they're after at the time.

Pinball

What a far right Christian fundamentalist warmongering global destabilizing greedy corporate whore nut job.

Vermschneid Mehearties

Actually, the sort of murmurs coming from our conservative party seem to be very liberal in comparison to what our government are doing at the moment. I can't help feeling they'll drop it all once they get in.

Quoteaye arnie's cracking down on it in california as well

Interesting, I wonder how San Fransisco will react. I almost feel a photomong coming along...

23 Daves

Quote from: "Ambient Sheep"Via an amendment to the constitution, no less?!!!  Man's a fuckwit.

This is what I don't understand.  Having an awareness of political procedures in this country and assuming in America they'd be relatively similar (you can't just change things like this overnight, it takes a lot of meetings, discussions and general agreement) it seems like an enormous waste of manpower.  This is going to have to go through tons of checks and balances, and will probably be given greater priority than the other major issues of the moment.  Doubtless it will also cost the American taxpayer a lot of money.

That latter point is none of my business, of course.

And if somebody would like to explain the 'sanctity of marriage' in general society at the moment anyway when divorce rates are ridiculously high and you can go and have a cheapo marriage in Las Vegas, I'd be all ears. If Bush plans next to outlaw divorce and weddings in gambling dens, it would show he's no hypocrite at least.

Pinball

Schwarzenegger turned into a right-wing nutter too, didn't he? So much for his "liberal republicanism" bullshit. Sieg Heil etc.

Blue Jam

Quote from: "smoker"i did pick up a rumour somewhere yesterday that dubya tasted the fruit of man during his military service

I thought Dubya dodged his military service, or was that just the draft to Vietnam? Was he like Terry Gilliam, who signed up for six months of service to avoid having to go to 'Nam?

I posted something about this on the old board, about Bush wanting to make a constitutional ammendment over something that really isn't a big issue, but I didn't think he'd get the support to take it much further as it sounded so ridiculous. We need a new Lee Harvey Oswald, now.

smoker

Quote from: "Blue Jam"I thought Dubya dodged his military service, or was that just the draft to Vietnam?

he did some time in the texas air guard to escape nam. all i can find is rumour about his old man though.

Quote from: "23 Daves"This is what I don't understand. Having an awareness of political procedures in this country and assuming in America they'd be relatively similar (you can't just change things like this overnight, it takes a lot of meetings, discussions and general agreement) it seems like an enormous waste of manpower. This is going to have to go through tons of checks and balances, and will probably be given greater priority than the other major issues of the moment. Doubtless it will also cost the American taxpayer a lot of money.

it's like his man on mars plan, a tactical vote winner is all


Quote from: "VM"Interesting, I wonder how San Fransisco will react.

they're not very happy by all accounts. there's been tons of gay marriages in sf over the last few years, this law threatens to invalidate them all. however, i think either two or three previous attempts to ban them in the courts have already failed so there's no telling. anyway, schwarzenegger can talk, junior, anybody?

If Blair said eg
"We are going to put the price of beer and fags up by 1000% and use all the extra revenue to address the 3rd world issues in the world, and pay for an entire iraq infrastructure. "
And then listed a plan of where every penny goes to, and that all seemed totally in order, would anyone vote for him?
Course not. People just aren't  bothered about other places (in the sense of being willing to hold down a job and then have a proportion of your money go to helping them).  My ass first, yours second.

Vermschneid Mehearties

Here's a transcript from a conversation I've been having with a friend I've met on the internet. He's a muslim, and extremely anti-Bush Administration, though his views on this issue are slightly more..err..well you'll see:

(Just like to remind people that I have had many in-depth discussions and the guy is really intelligent and well informed, just proof that people who think like this aren't all dumb)

theenoeffect.tk-Sympathy, where have you gone? I'm getting older, I need something to rely on.. says:
hey sul

Sul... [[ FireFox ]] says:

theenoeffect.tk-Sympathy, where have you gone? I'm getting older, I need something to rely on.. says:
ive just heard the best description of bush I've heard for a long time

theenoeffect.tk-Sympathy, where have you gone? I'm getting older, I need something to rely on.. says:
"What a far right Christian fundamentalist warmongering global destabilizing greedy corporate whore nut job."  

Sul... [[ FireFox ]] says: :D

Sul... [[ FireFox ]] says:
i prefer TWUNT!

theenoeffect.tk-Sympathy, where have you gone? I'm getting older, I need something to rely on.. says:
lol
t
heenoeffect.tk-Sympathy, where have you gone? I'm getting older, I need something to rely on.. says:
that was a comment one of my mate said on msn following his gay marriage Ban plans

Sul... [[ FireFox ]] says:
The
War
Against
Terror

lol

theenoeffect.tk-Sympathy, where have you gone? I'm getting older, I need something to rely on.. says:
The
Wanker
And
Twunt

Sul... [[ FireFox ]] says:
I agree with a gay marrage ban

theenoeffect.tk-Sympathy, where have you gone? I'm getting older, I need something to rely on.. says:
i thought you would

Sul... [[ FireFox ]] says:
lol  

Sul... [[ FireFox ]] says:
its not right

theenoeffect.tk-Sympathy, where have you gone? I'm getting older, I need something to rely on.. says:
im perfectly prepared to let people live how they want to

theenoeffect.tk-Sympathy, where have you gone? I'm getting older, I need something to rely on.. says:
i mean banning them from getting marriage is basically saying they're second hand citizens just because they're attracted to the same sex

Sul... [[ FireFox ]] says:
yep

Sul... [[ FireFox ]] says:
I think of them as worse than that

theenoeffect.tk-Sympathy, where have you gone? I'm getting older, I need something to rely on.. says:
you probably want to have them executed or something  

Sul... [[ FireFox ]] says:
killed

Sul... [[ FireFox ]] says:
then the bodies burnt

theenoeffect.tk-Sympathy, where have you gone? I'm getting older, I need something to rely on.. says:
oh my...

theenoeffect.tk-Sympathy, where have you gone? I'm getting older, I need something to rely on.. says:
do you have any gay friends?
Sul... [[ FireFox ]] says:
nope

Sul... [[ FireFox ]] says:
if they were they wouldn't be my friends

theenoeffect.tk-Sympathy, where have you gone? I'm getting older, I need something to rely on.. says:
why?
Sul... [[ FireFox ]] says:
why what?
Sul... [[ FireFox ]] says:
(i closed the window  )

Sul... [[ FireFox ]] says:
WTF is your avatar btw?

theenoeffect.tk-Sympathy, where have you gone? I'm getting older, I need something to rely on.. says:
i don't have any close friends that are gay, not to my knowledge, but i have a few acquaintances that are gay, and they're pretty sound people

Sul... [[ FireFox ]] says:
they may be 'sound' but they are frigging deviants

Sul... [[ FireFox ]] says:
kkj

Sul... [[ FireFox ]] says:
if the letters KKK get typed up it's because of my kid on my lap  

theenoeffect.tk-Sympathy, where have you gone? I'm getting older, I need something to rely on.. says:
yeah- though they aren't trying to shag me are they? what gays get up to, im not really interested in, but they're just the same as everyone else, you've got to appreciate that.


...The conversation splintered a bit after that.

Ambient Sheep

Quote from: "23 Daves"
Quote from: "Ambient Sheep"Via an amendment to the constitution, no less?!!!  Man's a fuckwit.
This is what I don't understand...This is going to have to go through tons of checks and balances, and will probably be given greater priority than the other major issues of the moment.
Exactly.  Misdirection, dear boy, misdirection.  Give the American public something else to get het up about and they might not notice the deteriorating Iraq situation and the climate-change bombshell that the Pentagon has just dropped.

daveytaylor

So Bush is banning gay marriage and Arnie is clamping down on it.

Sounds like they have sexuality issues of their own.

hoverdonkey

The novelty value of having Arnie as governor doesn't seem quite so much fun now does it? Land of the Free indeed.

Vermschneid Mehearties

Oh, bugger. Now we'll never get to see this:


Nearly Annually

Quote from: "daveytaylor"So Bush is banning gay marriage and Arnie is clamping down on it.

Sounds like they have sexuality issues of their own.
Hah, funny, I was just totting up how many closet case characteristics Arnie displays...


VM - you're right, nothing at all dumb-sounding there. Read it everyone, stop ignoring it.

Harfyyn Teuport

Michael Howard has personally tried to stamp out homosexuality as a legal possibility and even as an abstract concept. Section 28, which bans the 'promotion of homosexuality' in schools was supported vehemently by him and when it was eventually repealed - against stern criticism from him - in England and Wales, it remained in Kent. Not surprisingly, Kent is Michael Howard's constituency.

That's the leader of the opposition, ladies and gentlemen...

Pinball

What a bunch of illiberal fucknuts these politicans are. They give away their control-freak natures during issues such as these.

terrorist

They're just worried that getting raped in prep school has made them gay and now if they don't make it completely illegal they might stray from their sexless power grabbing wives and end up fucking their personal trainers in the locker room at the gym..

Vermschneid Mehearties

Quote from: "Harfyyn Teuport"Michael Howard has personally tried to stamp out homosexuality as a legal possibility and even as an abstract concept. Section 28, which bans the 'promotion of homosexuality' in schools was supported vehemently by him and when it was eventually repealed - against stern criticism from him - in England and Wales, it remained in Kent. Not surprisingly, Kent is Michael Howard's constituency.

That's the leader of the opposition, ladies and gentlemen...

He's the new Michael Howard now. Which most likely means he's going to say 'Everything is Ok' until he gets elected, and then he's going to turn into a Mecha-Tory and bring this country back to the stone age.

Spot the exagerration, or ignore it. Either way's fun.

european son

for me people are missing the most disappointing part of the story, after all, we all know bush is a reactionary type on such social issues.

what really upsets me is this

QuoteThe BBC's Justin Webb says that by coming down firmly on one side the gay marriage debate, President Bush is defining it as a political issue.

Mr Bush's main Democratic opponents for the presidency do not back gay marriage, but do not support a ban either - making the president seem firm and principled and the Democrats weak and vacillating, says our correspondent.

a Democratic party should wholeheartedly support gay marriage. the Democrats are fearful of voters and fence-sitting, which i don't like.

hoverdonkey

Quote from: "Harfyyn Teuport"...it remained in Kent. Not surprisingly, Kent is Michael Howard's constituency.

That's the leader of the opposition, ladies and gentlemen...

He's not the the MP for the whole of Kent though is he? And correct me if I'm wrong, but we're not like the States in that regard, with counties having their own laws under the 'federal umbrella'.

Not that I'm sticking up for the old turd.

Marcus Or Relius

Strange the way even though we're apparantly engaged in a global war on terror so severe that civil-liberties have to be trampled into dust - as he reminds everyone to justify every fucking dim-witted idea of his - Bush still has time to be 'troubled' at the idea of two men holding hands.

I'm all in favour of gay-marriage, albeit primarily because it annoys the shit out of Fundamentalist Christians. Anything that annoys them - gays, the French, Pretzels, child-proof tops on medicine bottles that are so gosh-danged hard to open - gets my approval.

Ambient Sheep

Quote from: "Harfyyn Teuport"when it was eventually repealed - against stern criticism from him - in England and Wales, it remained in Kent. Not surprisingly, Kent is Michael Howard's constituency.
How does that work then?  Has he somehow got Kent County Council to defy the law?

Bilko

Quote from: "Marcus Or Relius"I'm all in favour of gay-marriage.

I'm all in favour of gay marriage as well, just as long as it isn't anyone I know or meet doing it.

Ambient Sheep

Quote from: "Peter Hammill"I'm all in favour of gay marriage as well, just as long as it isn't anyone I know or meet doing it.
Yeah, those bummers are terrible, aren't they?  You only have to turn your back for a second and they've got you up against the wall, pumping away greedily.

Ambient Sheep

Quote from: "Ambient Sheep"
Quote from: "Harfyyn Teuport"when it was eventually repealed - against stern criticism from him - in England and Wales, it remained in Kent. Not surprisingly, Kent is Michael Howard's constituency.
How does that work then?  Has he somehow got Kent County Council to defy the law?
To answer my own question, it seems that KCC have issued some sort of guideline that is along the lines of part 1 of Section 28, but not the second.  A quick Google for section 28 kent gives plenty of info, including this:
QuoteThere has been a great deal of misunderstanding, and indeed misrepresentation, about Kent County Council's position on Section 28. In particular, it is incorrect to say that Kent County Council has maintained its Section 28.

In July 2000, Kent County Council agreed a policy about the use of our Budget which said "KCC shall not publish, purchase or distribute material with the intention of promoting homosexuality". This in no way was a statement against homosexuality, and it certainly was in no way against school sex education including an understanding of homosexuality. It was against the "intentional promotion", which is very different. This is particularly important in primary schools and has widespread support amongst parents. I have, however, said repeatedly that neither the County Council nor I myself have any view other than understanding about adult homosexuality, and that what two adults do is entirely up to them.

The second part of the Government's original Section 28 spoke about "not promoting the teaching of homosexuality as a pretended family relationship". This we regarded as an unhelpful statement, and we said that we would reject this and would clarify our views in a new Kent Curriculum Statement which we did in March 2001. For us, this was when we formally replaced the second half of Section 28. This says:

"Enable children to lead a healthy, fulfilling and meaningful life in which they respect themselves as individuals, whilst developing an understanding, tolerance and respect for others and their differences, treating all people as equal."
There is more, but you get the drift.  Doesn't seem particularly unreasonable, but then maybe I've missed something.

Hears the creaking sound of a can of worms being opened...

Pinball

Who cares who marries whom? It's not like we need the population to grow anymore a la Catholic dogma, is it? And lesbians can reproduce, by squirting in a syringeful of sperm (but only if I can watch).