Author Topic: Toy Story 4  (Read 3752 times)

Re: Toy Story 4
« Reply #30 on: June 22, 2019, 12:02:47 AM »
I've just looked up the plot, so my read on what's happening with the ending I've skimmed over is they're splitting the groups to diversify the brand some, they'll do a film in the Toy Story world around Buzz, maybe another around Woody, maybe one around whatever this fork thing is... try to find ways to introduce new younger voices to branch out into so they're less dependent on the living cast. If it all fails they can always still just do a Toy Story 5

Trouble is if they do that they'll be dependent on Hanks wanting to come back, also a film around Buzz would seem doomed just because Tim Allen's such a prick. Buzz is kinda sidelined in the film and part of me does wonder if that was an attempt to cut down Tim Allen's role. Disney also have such a hard on for these live action remakes that I can genuinely see this being remade and recast, probably with Avengers. I can see them easily putting Evans and Hemsworth as Woody and Buzz.

Re: Toy Story 4
« Reply #31 on: June 22, 2019, 01:21:12 PM »
Would a live-action Toy Story have the actors' faces mapped onto the toys, like genie Will Smith?

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Re: Toy Story 4
« Reply #32 on: June 22, 2019, 01:54:02 PM »
I meant with the ending of 4. I'm wondering if the intention was one last film with the  original cast, close off their story, then reboot it in live action.

Bit weird if they do this though since the recent glut of "live action" remakes have actually been mostly CGI.  Take Lion King, for example.  What's so very different, technology and appearance-wise, between that and Toy Story 4?

I mean they could use real actors for the humans but they have only ever been peripheral in the Toy Story films anyway.

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Re: Toy Story 4
« Reply #33 on: June 22, 2019, 04:09:53 PM »
Bit weird if they do this though since the recent glut of "live action" remakes have actually been mostly CGI.  Take Lion King, for example.  What's so very different, technology and appearance-wise, between that and Toy Story 4?

This is a very valid point.  The live action remake of The Lion King is not even live action, technically speaking.  It's just replacing lovely traditional cel animation with charmless CGI.  Whoop de fucking do.

Fuck you, Disney.

Re: Toy Story 4
« Reply #34 on: June 22, 2019, 04:48:09 PM »
Just saw it, its just a complete mesh of the previous storylines, no new ground, and yeah it could have ended with 3.

Re: Toy Story 4
« Reply #35 on: June 22, 2019, 05:03:00 PM »
Is it any worse than 3 basically having the same story as 2?

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Re: Toy Story 4
« Reply #36 on: June 22, 2019, 05:06:14 PM »
Would a live-action Toy Story have the actors' faces mapped onto the toys, like genie Will Smith?

Hope so!!

Re: Toy Story 4
« Reply #37 on: June 22, 2019, 05:24:02 PM »
I would only accept ageing and decrepit actors Hanks and Allen bursting out of their Woody and Buzz costumes, respectively.


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Re: Toy Story 4
« Reply #38 on: June 22, 2019, 05:49:03 PM »
Allen bursting out of their

I misread this as Alien at first, and now think a chestburster scene or two would fit the Toy Story world quite nearly.

Re: Toy Story 4
« Reply #39 on: June 22, 2019, 05:59:44 PM »
Bit weird if they do this though since the recent glut of "live action" remakes have actually been mostly CGI.  Take Lion King, for example.  What's so very different, technology and appearance-wise, between that and Toy Story 4?

I mean they could use real actors for the humans but they have only ever been peripheral in the Toy Story films anyway.

I think that Woody, Buzz, all the humanoid characters would be live action with CGI renderings of Rex, Hamm, etc. I mean, it's just about raking in money and making sure their copyright continues.

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Re: Toy Story 4
« Reply #40 on: June 22, 2019, 06:11:43 PM »
I think that Woody, Buzz [...] would be live action

How would that work?  They are meant to look like toys, not men in costumes.

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Re: Toy Story 4
« Reply #41 on: June 22, 2019, 06:14:36 PM »
Make it live action but just use CGI for all the characters and scenery.

Re: Toy Story 4
« Reply #42 on: June 22, 2019, 06:15:06 PM »
How would that work?  They are meant to look like toys, not men in costumes.

Stop motion or marionettes?

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Re: Toy Story 4
« Reply #43 on: June 22, 2019, 06:17:58 PM »
I thought this was a massive disappointment unfortunately. There's nothing bad about it and it has the odd amusing moment but most of the time it retreads old ground and doesn't have much of interest to say, or at least anything that hasn't been said in Pixar movies before. Worst of all was that I was actively bored at times and didn't give a fuck about any of the new characters bar Forky, and even he wasn't that great. 5.4/10

Re: Toy Story 4
« Reply #44 on: June 22, 2019, 06:19:56 PM »
I think as you're watching it though you're only really aware they're toys at certain times, when actual humans come into the room or they're using one of their features, all other times as far as they way they're presented to the viewer goes - they're human. I think the thing is even if they don't do it for a while, Disney are going to want to extend their copyright on this the way they have with Lion King, and Tom Hanks and Tim Allen are both getting on. They waited 11 years between 2 and 3 and 9 years between 3 and 4, so I think we'll see another one in a decade. But by that time both men will be in their 70s, a live-action cgi version seems the obvious way to go without recasting the voices for the animation.

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Re: Toy Story 4
« Reply #45 on: June 22, 2019, 06:31:58 PM »
a live-action cgi version seems the obvious way to go without recasting the voices for the animation.

Why wouldn’t they just do CGI for everything?  I just don’t get why they would suddenly start implanting live action elements into these films.  They can keep the same voices with the current format.

The recent remakes of Classic Disney films have been about updating traditional animation techniques to CGI, because that’s what the kids recognise.  There’s no precedent for taking CGI films and randomly replacing photo-realistic CGI elements with live action.

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Re: Toy Story 4
« Reply #46 on: June 22, 2019, 06:33:55 PM »
It would be especially stupid to go non-CGI with Toy Story, which is famous for being the first CGI blockbuster. It would be like saying "yeah we had to use CGI in the past because of limitations" which they would never say because going live-action with this is nuts.

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Re: Toy Story 4
« Reply #47 on: June 22, 2019, 06:48:58 PM »
They already did live action toy story anyway (it's actually quite a breathtaking labour of love):

https://youtu.be/5G0j_Huv2Fg

Re: Toy Story 4
« Reply #48 on: June 22, 2019, 07:39:32 PM »
Yeah maybe I was wrong to say live-action, but at the very least I'd say it'll be motion capture with a younger cast. The point of rebooting it would be to make money in a sustainable way and as much as I hate to admit it Tom Hanks isn't getting younger. Don't really give a fuck about Tim Allen getting older. Disney seem to be heavily focused on these reboots for the next few years. and I think Toy Story is inevitable.

Re: Toy Story 4
« Reply #49 on: June 22, 2019, 08:04:04 PM »
I’m very much in the “alright enough, but didn’t need to exist” camp.  If this is indeed the final entry (unlike others, I can see many ways for it to continue after that ending), then I think it’ll come to be seen as a bit of a misstep given how perfectly Toy Story 3 tied things up.

It may also be because Pixar’s work has become so homogenous (especially so in the decade or so since TS3 came out), so it was oddly predictable - twists and “feels” and all - and didn’t really do much to stand out from the crowd in the way previous entries always have.  Obviously it’s the most technically/visually impressive one, but that’s not surprising.

A lot of “OG” characters got pretty short shrift - including Buzz Lightyear - whereas the new characters (including the Badass Bo-Peep) were largely quite dull and uninspired.  I liked the dummies, mind you.

I didn’t think the Key & Peele characters were funny.

A+

Re: Toy Story 4
« Reply #50 on: June 22, 2019, 08:24:51 PM »
kids dont play with toys anymore. maybe it can fortnite story and the adventures of all their digital avatars in the era of late capitalism

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Re: Toy Story 4
« Reply #51 on: June 22, 2019, 09:40:17 PM »
I thought that was fantastic. I disagree that it was a rehash - to me it continued the Toy Story sequel tradition of making itself seem a completely natural and necessary addition. Every time you think they've completed it and that another sequel would ruin things, they prove otherwise. This to me felt even bigger and more existential than the last one even - looking at Woody's obsession with being there for a kid, and what happens out in the world to any number of toys who for whatever reason are discarded or unable to find one. I don't know, the whole set-up of him considering the idea of leaving that behind and living his life felt like such a huge shift in the films, something truly significant thematically rather than just being a hasty 'the further adventures of...' Even two days later I feel a little staggered by moments like Woody and Bo talking under the car, facing up to the likelihood that he will never see her again. It gave more substance to the whole idea of the franchise - the characters really have to deal with some fucking huge, very adult decisions in this world. And fuck me did it look good. The rain in the opening scene, the reflection off Bo's ceramic material, the cat, the characters in general. Toy Story 2 was on BBC today and it looks fucking piss compared to this - how amazing is that?

There were a couple of drags - the formula of 'wahey, we're almost where we need to be- wait, *turns around* where's Woody/Forky/Buzz?!' starts to get a little repetitive, and I almost wish they'd been bold enough to leave all the side characters at home, rather than have them milling around like spare parts - but overall it was a really worthy sequel. As always it feels like totally its own thing, with a really memorable new cast of characters. Gabby Gabby especially I really loved - kinda redoing the Stinky Pete thing with more empathy.

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Re: Toy Story 4
« Reply #52 on: June 22, 2019, 09:46:54 PM »
Yeah maybe I was wrong to say live-action, but at the very least I'd say it'll be motion capture with a younger cast. The point of rebooting it would be to make money in a sustainable way and as much as I hate to admit it Tom Hanks isn't getting younger. Don't really give a fuck about Tim Allen getting older. Disney seem to be heavily focused on these reboots for the next few years. and I think Toy Story is inevitable.

Why would they recast the voice actors unless they start suddenly sounding absurdly ancient and croaky?  And even then the characters are indelibly linked with the voices aren't they?  I think that Buzz Lightyear is no more likely to be recast than Homer Simpson.

As far as the main lives/quests of these Toy Story characters goes, how many more stories do you think could feasibly be told?  I think there's scope for a few more short stories with the main characters, side-quests if you like rather than part of their bigger arc.  But apart from that the only scope for expanding Toy Story's feature film potential would surely involve looking at different toys entirely, in which case recasting becomes a moot point.

Why do you think they'd go with motion capture rather than continue the kind of animation they've been doing all this time?  They're meant to be plastic toys, not uncanny valley creations.

Re: Toy Story 4
« Reply #53 on: June 22, 2019, 10:19:11 PM »
Why do I think Toy Story will inevitably end up on the slate for a live action version? Because they've already remade Alice in Wonderland, Cinderella, The Jungle Book, Beauty and the Beast, Dumbo, Aladdin and The Lion King and on the slate are Lady and the Tramp, Mulan, The Sword in the Stone, Pinocchio, The Hunchback of Notre Dame, Lilo and Stitch and The Little Mermaid. Thinking that one of their most popular properties, one that's already spawned three sequels, will get the same treatment just seems logical.

Why do I think the actors will be recast? Because both men are in their 60s and if Disney start the cycle again using the same basic characters they're unlikely to want to do it with two elderly actors who it couldn't be guaranteed would be around for multiple films. 

How many more stories could you get from the characters? If they do a reboot that tells the same basic first story as the original Toy Story that leaves them free to do sequels that aren't the same as Toy Story 2, 3, etc. They're already doing this with properties like Sleeping Beauty becoming Maleficent with a second outing planned and 101 Dalmatians being used for Cruella. Even Christopher Robin was Disney taking their takes on the Winnie the Pooh animations and doing a live action variant. I think there's every chance a Toy Story reboot could take that path. It's a huge money-spinner for them, they're going to eventually want to do more with it because Disney like money.

Why do it in a different style to what's already established? Because that's their thing now. Why are they doing this for so many other properties? All of them are moving away from what Disney established with the original films. Copyright is one answer. When a film goes public domain they're not going to make any more money from it. But if they can remake it, create a new definitive version, that version's copyright will exist with Disney long after the original has expired. Also, if it doesn't replace it and become definitive it still means money in the short term.

But I think it for exactly the same reasons I think that motivated them doing a film like Solo, and why I think eventually they'll reboot The Avengers and recast everyone. Because it makes them money and because they can.

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Re: Toy Story 4
« Reply #54 on: June 22, 2019, 10:58:46 PM »
Why do I think Toy Story will inevitably end up on the slate for a live action version? Because they've already remade Alice in Wonderland, Cinderella, The Jungle Book, Beauty and the Beast, Dumbo, Aladdin and The Lion King and on the slate are Lady and the Tramp, Mulan, The Sword in the Stone, Pinocchio, The Hunchback of Notre Dame, Lilo and Stitch and The Little Mermaid. Thinking that one of their most popular properties, one that's already spawned three sequels, will get the same treatment just seems logical.

All of those examples are 2D cel animation.  Toy Story, for the sake of this discussion, is already “live action” if we are calling the new Lion King “live action”.  In terms of technology and overall photo-realism, there is no difference is there between the new Lion King film and Toy Story 4.  So you can’t just transfer the same logic over from all those traditionally animated Disney films to Toy Story.


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Why do it in a different style to what's already established? Because that's their thing now.

Why redo Toy Story 4 in the style of the new Lion King film?  It’s not a meaningful difference is it.

I just don’t think it makes any sense, that’s all.

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Re: Toy Story 4
« Reply #55 on: June 22, 2019, 11:12:22 PM »
And doesn’t copyright last for 70 years?  I don’t think they have to worry yet about Toy Story entering the public domain.

Re: Toy Story 4
« Reply #56 on: June 22, 2019, 11:17:49 PM »
Oh I agree it makes no artistic sense. But I think the Disney execs are motivated by finances not money and by making the change they can say they are doing something artistically different because the style of technology has developed so much. Certainly much is being made of the technology behind this new Lion King being a game changer and like nothing that's come before, despite the effects they've said it'll be pushed as live action rather than animation at the Oscars.

In terms of copyright, why make The Lion King then? It came out a year before Toy Story. Lilo and Stitch came out later and that's slated for a remake. I don't think it's just about the originals falling out of copyright, I think it's about a remake having time to establish itself as the definitive take. Where they fail I wouldn't be shocked to see another version before the copyright expires, Dumbo for example, I wouldn't be surprised if they tried again in 10 years. Because there's no artistic reason to remake The Lion King, it's a beloved film that's only 25 years old, they could put this technology to telling a new story.

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Re: Toy Story 4
« Reply #57 on: June 23, 2019, 12:33:22 AM »
Before the next decade is done there’ll be a live action Frozen. Guarantee it.

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Re: Toy Story 4
« Reply #58 on: June 23, 2019, 09:33:53 AM »
There will be remakes of Pete’s Dragon, Mary Poppins and Who Framed Roger Rabbit with all the animated elements done as live action instead.

Re: Toy Story 4
« Reply #59 on: June 23, 2019, 10:33:20 AM »
There will be remakes of Pete’s Dragon

This has already happened.