Main Menu

Tip jar

If you like CaB and wish to support it, you can use PayPal or KoFi. Thank you, and I hope you continue to enjoy the site - Neil.

Buy Me a Coffee at ko-fi.com

Support CaB

Recent

Welcome to Cook'd and Bomb'd. Please login or sign up.

March 28, 2024, 08:59:47 PM

Login with username, password and session length

John Carpenter

Started by bgmnts, July 05, 2019, 01:45:52 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

a duncandisorderly

Quote from: Kryton on July 05, 2019, 09:05:05 PM
The thing with Carpenter films as that even the 'bad' ones are still fun films. I'm a massive fan of him - His music too!
I had the pleasure of watching him perform his tracks in Liverpool a few years ago, the atmosphere was electric. He also seems like a cool guy you'd be happy hanging out with.

In the mouth of madness and Prince of darkness are both genuinely creepy films. The Thing is the best horror movie ever made.

agreed on 'the thing'. even the later 'prequel' was a decent tribute.

I've always liked his music too, going back as far as 'dark star', & I'd planned to do an album of covers called "if I were john carpenter" (after that carpenters tribute album of the mid 90s, see?), so when he released an album himself, I was looking forward to it being all lofi & wobbly, like he'd done it on his prophet-5 & a couple of old tape-decks. but it was all clean & modern sounding. still good stuff, but where's the analogue? actually I think robert rodriguez did a decent pastiche of it for his bit of the grindhouse thing.

mothman

Quote from: BlodwynPig on July 05, 2019, 08:38:48 PM
Haven't seen Vampires but reading the blurb it looks like Near Dark did this far better a decade earlier

I've seen Near Dark, obviously, but it left me cold. It felt like it was trying too hard. "Look!" it seemed to be saying, "we're reinventing the vampire mythology for the modern age! Revel in our inventiveness!" I'd say it's a problem with many of Bigelow's films, they always feel like they're trying too hard to Make A Point.

Quote from: Kryton on July 05, 2019, 09:05:05 PM
The thing with Carpenter films as that even the 'bad' ones are still fun films.

See also: Sam Peckinpah. Well, sort of.

a duncandisorderly

Quote from: mothman on July 05, 2019, 10:15:50 PM
I've seen Near Dark, obviously, but it left me cold. It felt like it was trying too hard. "Look!" it seemed to be saying, "we're reinventing the vampire mythology for the modern age! Revel in our inventiveness!" I'd say it's a problem with many of Bigelow's films, they always feel like they're trying too hard to reMake A Point Break.


ftfy.

zomgmouse

Does anyone else just not get along with They Live? I love Carpenter but that just flops for me.

bgmnts

Quote from: zomgmouse on July 06, 2019, 12:54:36 AM
Does anyone else just not get along with They Live? I love Carpenter but that just flops for me.

It has one of the, if not THE, best fight scenes in cinema.

zomgmouse

Quote from: bgmnts on July 06, 2019, 01:50:22 AM
It has one of the, if not THE, absolute fucking dumbest fight scenes in cinema.

colacentral

#36
Halloween is a stone cold classic; probably the scariest film ever made, to me. I think though that Deborah Hill deserves much of the credit for it, as it's the least masculine of Carpenter's films and all the better for it. I find it to be pretty much perfect in every way.

Black Christmas is good, but an inferior film to me as its more nasty than scary, with some dumb humour laced throughout which deflates it a bit, and a less interesting villain. Obviously Halloween takes alot from it, but drastically improves on it, in my opinion.

The Thing is great. Big Trouble is a laugh, as is They Live. But I have to say that I find Escape From New York terrible. I don't get it at all. The dialogue is shite; the plot is non-existant; the action is boring; Isaac Hayes is a bad villain; its paced badly. What is there to like? Kurt Russell coming out with unfunny one-liners isn't doing it for me. Its a great premise executed horribly.

I can't say I'm too keen on Assault on Precinct 13 either - its another one of his many films which would be more tense and interesting without his overly masculine, cliche male lead.

Quote from: zomgmouse on July 06, 2019, 12:54:36 AM
Does anyone else just not get along with They Live? I love Carpenter but that just flops for me.

I can understand why. It starts extremely slowly (like Prince of Darkness it has a plodding bass driven theme tune which starts it off on the wrong foot), but I do think that once it really gets going towards the end the payoff is worth it. Rowdy Roddy Piper is no Kurt Russell either though. I do like it, but I can easily see why someone would hate it.

Blumf

Quote from: zomgmouse on July 06, 2019, 12:54:36 AM
Does anyone else just not get along with They Live? I love Carpenter but that just flops for me.

I like it, but it's easy to see why you don't; very bad pacing and the acting doesn't really cover for it.

But, oh boy, for the few bits that do work - the first time he puts on the shades being the prime scene - the film is iconic.

Blumf

Quote from: colacentral on July 06, 2019, 06:58:56 AM
I can't say I'm too keen on Assault on Precinct 13 either - its another one of his many films which would be more tense and interesting without his overly masculine, cliche male lead.

What's you view on the two women in the film?

gatchamandave

Oh come now, chums. We discuss what his worst film is and bat around They Live and Vampires ? Phooey, I say. Phooey.

Village of the Damned, the one film of his that is utterly useless. Every other film he does has son redeeming feature - a full on crazy James Woods opposite that other Baldwin brother, or the aforementioned fight in They Live, or how about the surfboard chase in Escape from LA ? But Village is joyless, turgid and dull.

mothman

gcmdave has mentioned That Which Shall Not Be Named, and must now buy all involved in this thread a drink.

Sin Agog

Quote from: Blumf on July 06, 2019, 10:16:28 AM
I like it, but it's easy to see why you don't; very bad pacing and the acting doesn't really cover for it.

But, oh boy, for the few bits that do work - the first time he puts on the shades being the prime scene - the film is iconic.

Gah, the pacing is one of the best things about it.  Well, in the first half (maybe wraps up a little too quickly and patly).  Rowdy Roddy Audience Vessel slowly getting red pilled is brilliant.  Fuck me does the female lead have disconcertingly dead, dead eyes, though.

Sin Agog

No mention of Star Man thus far, and that is quite a lovely little fatless capsule movie of the kind JC used to excel at. Jeff Bridges and Carpenter's commentary is equally sweet and charming as well.

Small Man Big Horse

Quote from: another Mr. Lizard on July 05, 2019, 07:20:03 PM
No mention of Starman yet?

I wish JC had done as many movies with Jeff Bridges as he has with Kurt Russell. And as many DVD commentaries.

Quote from: Sin Agog on July 06, 2019, 02:05:27 PM
No mention of Star Man thus far, and that is quite a lovely little fatless capsule movie of the kind JC used to excel at. Jeff Bridges and Carpenter's commentary is equally sweet and charming as well.

One film I haven't seen mentioned so far is Star Man, which is a lovely little movie and all rather sweet.

Sin Agog

Someone really should bring up Starman.  I bet it'd be even more relatable to people learning to walk and talk again after suffering a stroke.

magval

Quote from: colacentral on July 06, 2019, 06:58:56 AM
But I have to say that I find Escape From New York terrible. I don't get it at all. The dialogue is shite; the plot is non-existant; the action is boring; Isaac Hayes is a bad villain; its paced badly. What is there to like? Kurt Russell coming out with unfunny one-liners isn't doing it for me. Its a great premise executed horribly.

He's often said that what it's about is the idea of an incorruptible character - someone who is the way he is, and can't be worsened or bettered by circumstance or state. In that sense, it's executed excellently. He is morally void, and both inferior and superior for it.

But it's a rad boss film with class characters, music, photography and everything else as well. You know, you're the first person I've ever heard say they didn't like that film. No worries like, opinions and all that :-)

colacentral

#46
Everyone's lying. Snake stinks.

Quote from: magval on July 06, 2019, 04:21:02 PM
He's often said that what it's about is the idea of an incorruptible character - someone who is the way he is, and can't be worsened or bettered by circumstance or state. In that sense, it's executed excellently. He is morally void, and both inferior and superior for it.

That's a fancy way of saying he has no arc.

QuoteBut it's a rad boss film with class characters, music, photography and everything else as well. You know, you're the first person I've ever heard say they didn't like that film. No worries like, opinions and all that :-)

I'll give you music, though that's debatable, and outside of Halloween I find Carpenter's music hit and miss.

The set design is all bland - every location looks the same. The characters range from genetic to irritating, and I wouldn't class any of them as interesting. The main antagonist is ineffectual; the fight in the cage is forgettable; the finale is limp. I genuinely don't get it. Maybe you had to see it at the time. It's got 1/10th of the style, invention and excitement of Big Trouble in Little China.

mothman

Much as I love EfNY, I always feel like it could have been a lot better. Maybe not filming it all in Cleveland (or wherever) in the middle of the night might have helped.

The deleted scene showing Snake's nefarious bank robbery is particularly unprepossessing: https://youtu.be/Jlken5NO7Ew

The Fog is great; really atmospheric.

mothman

Yes! It's a movie about vengeful ghosts... which hardly appear at all. And when they do, they're basically mannikins standing in dry ice. Yet it works.

magval

Quote from: colacentral on July 06, 2019, 04:29:20 PM
That's a fancy way of saying he has no arc.

Agreed, I don't mind though. I'm not a creative writing tutor.

Perfectly happy to follow Snake about for a while, causing fuck and giving bad manners.

a duncandisorderly

I can't believe no-one's brought up 'star man' so far. proof that JC can do romance too. & the score... better than any of his own.

seriously made me wonder if it was the same john carpenter that made 'ghosts of mars', which is fucking dire even if you turn the pictures off so you can ignore the budget effects.

oy vey

The run of Assault through to They Live pretty much defines prolific. I would include Starman, Christine and even Elvis. Oh go on, let's add on Dark Star...

Carpenter's biggest issue was being too far ahead of his time. The Thing (my favourite) is pretty much perfect, isn't it?

Big Trouble proves he can define his own genre, and he can do comedy. I find The Fog underrated even among fans - a minimal zombie fest with a karmic undertone - the quintessential camp fire ghost story, which of course it opens with. The future-nightmare sequence in Prince of Darkness is one of the creepiest things I've ever seen for something that was presumably cheap to do.

Later work is spotty but as mentioned above who cares? Agreed on In the Mouth of Madness being the hidden gem here. The last hit for me is Cigarette Burns but The Ward, for all its issues, is worth one look. And here's where I lose all of you... I like Ghost of Mars. Yeah yeah I know it's shit, but what can I do?

Persistent rumours of new features in development. Does anyone know anything?

a duncandisorderly

Quote from: oy vey on July 06, 2019, 08:44:57 PM
And here's where I lose all of you... I like Ghost of Mars. Yeah yeah I know it's shit, but what can I do?


oh, I'll still watch it despite it being shit. some sort of cognitive dissonance kicks in, like when a band you like does an extremely ill-judged cover version.

e.g. the current king crimson doing 'easy money' with new "political" lyrics.

beanheadmcginty

Nothing more satisfying to do in real life than unexpectedly catch something someone has thrown or dropped and then calmly say "It's all in the reflexes."

zomgmouse

Can't believe no one's said Starman yet

St_Eddie

Quote from: Avril Lavigne on July 05, 2019, 05:13:21 PM
I checked it out for the first time either last Halloween or the year before, and for such a good horror movie premise with Carpenter directing I was surprised at how boring the whole thing was.

Yet another opinion on film which I share with your good self.  I'm starting to suspect that you're me.

Quote from: a duncandisorderly on July 05, 2019, 08:48:37 PM
nowt to do with carpenter though, is it?

Outside of a six degrees of separation thing, no, it's not.

St_Eddie

Quote from: Sin Agog on July 06, 2019, 02:02:05 PM
Fuck me does the female lead have disconcertingly dead, dead eyes, though.

Indeed.  Meg Foster has the eyes of a serial killer and worse than that, my ex-girlfriend.

oy vey

Quote from: a duncandisorderly on July 06, 2019, 09:49:28 PM
oh, I'll still watch it despite it being shit. some sort of cognitive dissonance kicks in, like when a band you like does an extremely ill-judged cover version.

e.g. the current king crimson doing 'easy money' with new "political" lyrics.

Spot on analogy. On a thread re-read I see it has its advocates. The ropy acting, the dodgy effects, the overbearing heavy metal score, the rehash of Assault... you have to fight through that shit.

Shaky

I'd like to be the first person to mention Starman - the stirring score and final scene used to make me bawl like a child.