What don't you join Extinction Rebellion?

[Zetetic]

I wasn't.

[garbed_attic]

Hair shirts to be made from fibreglass.

I think we've answered the question in the title though?

Do you not think the privations caused by climate chaos will not dwarf such privations in comparison?

[garbed_attic]

I wasn't.

Since Paul took you as satirical I also thought you were being so?

[Paul Calf]

Oh. I'm not though. I think people should pay the price for meat. But again, you have a black market problem and you have to deal with some kind of centralised economy, a model which hasn't so far been very successful.

I don't know how to solve that, especially without letting the wealthy just pay their way around restrictions.

[chveik]

The problem is this: if XR were a front for an extremist authoritarian organisation who wanted an excuse to inspect people's houses and punish them for minor infractions, how would it look different from how it actually does now?

you already compared them to a cult, now they're a potential fascist organisation. leftists parties have done fuck all for the environment, it's normal that people take matters into their own hands. are you afraid of democracy?

[Paul Calf]

No mate.

[Zetetic]

I don't know how to solve that, especially without letting the wealthy just pay their way around restrictions.

Hence why an early step is to fix wealth inequality and massively reduce income inequality.

Then we teach people which species of gulls are safe and sustainable to eat.

[garbed_attic]

I mean... ultimately I do think we're going to have to focus on de-growth, which will mean considerably less for most of us in the 1st world. Some of it is certainly liveable though. Like... I haven't eaten meat for the better part of two decades now and it hasn't taken much effort.

Like... you're/ we're all still going to be able to breathe air and wank, ultimately! What more do you want???

[The Boston Crab]

What about we stay exactly as we are and the third world eat cowpats and rubbish for a few years and see if that has any effect?

Since I decided not to have kids, I've become extremely optimistic about my own chances come armageddon. I will be tooled the fuck up because my father in law has several licensed guns. I know how to fish and I've got excellent fishing gear for salmon, trout and generic lake fishing. I have considerable experience with outdoor survival skills. I have just bought a second arcade stick and I will mod it with Sanwa buttons and a Seimitsu LS-32 stick. I feel like I'm probably gonna be runnin the show, basically. Worst case scenario, if the raiders try and storm my house, I'll wipe my arse on all the food and blow my head off.

[garbed_attic]

What about we stay exactly as we are and the third world eat cowpats and rubbish for a few years and see if that has any effect?

Since I decided not to have kids, I've become extremely optimistic about my own chances come armageddon. I will be tooled the fuck up because my father in law has several licensed guns. I know how to fish and I've got excellent fishing gear for salmon, trout and generic lake fishing. I have considerable experience with outdoor survival skills. I have just bought a second arcade stick and I will mod it with Sanwa buttons and a Seimitsu LS-32 stick. I feel like I'm probably gonna be runnin the show, basically. Worst case scenario, if the raiders try and storm my house, I'll wipe my arse on all the food and blow my head off.

I mean... I think that's why a lot of guys don't care or are willing climate chaos onwards... but at least you have real practical experience, unlike my brother who's mostly just played Fallout.

I should probably bone up on my survival skills more really... I've forgotten everything from Scouts apart from how to make a fire and then I probably wouldn't be able to start it.

[Fambo Number Mive]

you already compared them to a cult, now they're a potential fascist organisation. leftists parties have done fuck all for the environment, it's normal that people take matters into their own hands. are you afraid of democracy?

Lefist parties have never been in power in the UK, apart from Caroline Lucas in Brighton. The Greens and Labour have lots of good environmental policies.

[Icehaven]

Bit rubbish for night shift workers never being able to watch TV or use the internet because they were always at work when the electricity was on.

But that's the same for dayworkers (i.e. most people) if the electricity was off at night.

[JesusAndYourBush]

We need to stop making plastic.  It's arrogant for any of us to think we're so important that just to have one meal or one drink of water we're going to leave behind some pieces of plastic that are still going to be there in 1000 years.  We managed without it before, we can find a way of managing without it again.

And scientists should be working on some sort of bacteria that'll sort out the plastic we've got, I don't know...break it back down into it's separate elements or something.

[The Boston Crab]

 Just burn it all!

[Elderly Sumo Prophecy]

What about we stay exactly as we are and the third world eat cowpats and rubbish for a few years and see if that has any effect?

Since I decided not to have kids, I've become extremely optimistic about my own chances come armageddon. I will be tooled the fuck up because my father in law has several licensed guns. I know how to fish and I've got excellent fishing gear for salmon, trout and generic lake fishing. I have considerable experience with outdoor survival skills. I have just bought a second arcade stick and I will mod it with Sanwa buttons and a Seimitsu LS-32 stick. I feel like I'm probably gonna be runnin the show, basically. Worst case scenario, if the raiders try and storm my house, I'll wipe my arse on all the food and blow my head off.

Do you think you could kill a horse?

[sponk]

What about we stay exactly as we are and the third world eat cowpats and rubbish for a few years and see if that has any effect?

Since I decided not to have kids, I've become extremely optimistic about my own chances come armageddon. I will be tooled the fuck up because my father in law has several licensed guns. I know how to fish and I've got excellent fishing gear for salmon, trout and generic lake fishing. I have considerable experience with outdoor survival skills. I have just bought a second arcade stick and I will mod it with Sanwa buttons and a Seimitsu LS-32 stick. I feel like I'm probably gonna be runnin the show, basically. Worst case scenario, if the raiders try and storm my house, I'll wipe my arse on all the food and blow my head off.

http://www.myreligionislam.com/detail.asp?Aid=6096

[object-lesson]

There is a real danger of ecological authoritarianism, which is why it's essential that XR puts a lot of emphasis on participatory democracy - which it does to some extent - and on the responsibilties of corporations, which it doesn't enough.

Its website seems to have diluted some of its more socialist content which is a problem, and the links to concrete actions at the bottom of this page aren't really adequate.

https://rebellion.earth/the-truth/demands/

I do think more emphasis needs to be put on preparing for the catastrophe which is inevitable as well as doing what can be done to mitigate it, though the two can merge into each other to an extent. Also there doesn't seem to be nearly enough emphasis on the fact that the poorest countries are going to be hit first and worst.

[garbed_attic]

There is a real danger of ecological authoritarianism, which is why it's essential that XR puts a lot of emphasis on participatory democracy - which it does to some extent - and on the responsibilties of corporations, which it doesn't enough.

Its website seems to have diluted some of its more socialist content which is a problem, and the links to concrete actions at the bottom of this page aren't really adequate.

https://rebellion.earth/the-truth/demands/

I do think more emphasis needs to be put on preparing for the catastrophe which is inevitable as well as doing what can be done to mitigate it, though the two can merge into each other to an extent. Also there doesn't seem to be nearly enough emphasis on the fact that the poorest countries are going to be hit first and worst.

Thanks for this - nuanced feedback which I find myself in complete agreement with...

[garbed_attic]

http://www.myreligionislam.com/detail.asp?Aid=6096

There's always time to join Muslim Climate Action!

[The Boston Crab]

Mildly controversial question.

If the poorest, third worldest areas are going to be hit first, and they're mostly wiped out, won't that solve a large part of the problem for the first world?

Obviously Britain will be fucked by rising tides and stuff but in the broader sense, the West will probably be OK for longer than most, right? It's very likely to go all Fallout when a few nuclear reactors go under and start spraying space AIDS to every cunt who isn't wearing decent sunnies. That's just causality, though. Tough tit.

[Puce Moment]

If the planet can just hold out until I die of natural causes I would appreciate it greatly. I don't have kids you see.

[Zetetic]

If the poorest, third worldest areas are going to be hit first, and they're mostly wiped out, won't that solve a large part of the problem for the first world?

Less developed countries produces vastly disproportionately less greenhouse gas emissions. (Yes, yes, methane from rice farming in Bangladesh or whatever.)

I suppose they might knock out some major supply routes - coltan mining in the Congo? - and so cripple all sorts of manufacturing in the more developed countries. Not sure that's exactly a solution.

[Icehaven]

Double post soz.

[Captain Z]

And scientists should be working on some sort of bacteria that'll sort out the plastic we've got, I don't know...break it back down into it's separate elements or something.

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2018/apr/16/scientists-accidentally-create-mutant-enzyme-that-eats-plastic-bottles

[gib]

If the poorest, third worldest areas are going to be hit first, and they're mostly wiped out, won't that solve a large part of the problem for the first world?

Billions of refugees though, isn't it?

[garbed_attic]

Footage from our "die-in" protest outside Suffolk County Council yesterday:
https://www.eadt.co.uk/news/extinction-rebellion-stages-dramatic-die-in-protest-at-suffolk-county-council-office-in-ipswich-1-6168771?

Overall I'm pleased with how it went - kids shouting 'Wake Up' is inevitably effective and though arguably manipulative I think forcing people to confronting the kind of future we're currently consigning our kids too is necessary and fair enough really. The aesthetics don't do a good job of countering accusations of middle-class whiteness though. I think there was only one, maybe two, non-white faces amongst us... but then again this *is* Suffolk. idk

[The Boston Crab]

A few kids shouting wake up ain't gonna make the bad guys give up beef burger breakfast. They probley just eat da kids!!

[Icehaven]

Actually if protesting involves lying around motionless I can probably get on board with that.

[madhair60]

Alright joined what I do now.

[Elderly Sumo Prophecy]

Lie down in a road to block it.