Author Topic: Two mass shootings in America [split topic]  (Read 6682 times)

Two mass shootings in America [split topic]
« on: August 03, 2019, 10:12:18 PM »
Another mass shooting. Another "God be with you". This too is what America wants.

Re: Two mass shootings in America [split topic]
« Reply #1 on: August 03, 2019, 10:18:06 PM »
Another mass shooting. Another "God be with you". This too is what America wants.

Unconfirmed manifesto from shooter about the "invasion of Hispanics" being his motive.

Trump 2020

Urinal Cake

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Re: Two mass shootings in America [split topic]
« Reply #2 on: August 03, 2019, 10:28:10 PM »
You have heard of the British Empire? Putting uppity minorities and countries in their place was pretty much our brand for a couple of centuries. Still is in the heads of a lot of Brexit supporters.
After the World Wars and Britain became one of the 'good guys' I'd say the British establishment believed that they and the public had outgrown this. They still got the goods by being a capital of finance and commerce etc but owning HK wasn't as important as it once was.

Re: Two mass shootings in America [split topic]
« Reply #3 on: August 03, 2019, 11:49:14 PM »
This Walmart shooter says in his Manifesto we've "Not to blame Trump"; be interesting to see if he Tweets about his vindication. He probably will.

Re: Two mass shootings in America [split topic]
« Reply #4 on: August 04, 2019, 12:01:56 AM »
Unconfirmed manifesto from shooter about the "invasion of Hispanics" being his motive.

Trump 2020

I mean shootings are more about the absolute state of American gun culture than racist ideology. I dont think we've seen an increase in mass shootings have we? They happen every other week in the states.

Urinal Cake

  • -0/-0
Re: Two mass shootings in America [split topic]
« Reply #5 on: August 04, 2019, 12:11:27 AM »
Khan- Nobody who has committed knife crime has even bothered to mention me one way or another.

I mean shootings are more about the absolute state of American gun culture than racist ideology. I dont think we've seen an increase in mass shootings have we? They happen every other week in the states.
It's easier to get rid of guns than ideas. Apparently having lax gun laws really escalates the number of white males who successfully commit suicide the first time.

Re: Two mass shootings in America [split topic]
« Reply #6 on: August 04, 2019, 12:11:50 AM »
I mean shootings are more about the absolute state of American gun culture than racist ideology. I dont think we've seen an increase in mass shootings have we? They happen every other week in the states.

Well this was explicitly a racially motivated terrorist act, so I'm not sure what you're on about.

But in any event I think this type of mass shooting has greatly increased since right-wing white guys' mindsockets were splunged circa November 2008.

Re: Two mass shootings in America [split topic]
« Reply #7 on: August 04, 2019, 12:13:00 AM »
Well this was explicitly a racially motivated terrorist act, so I'm not sure what you're on about.

But in any event I think this type of mass shooting has greatly increased since right-wing white guys' mindsockets were splunged circa November 2008.

So before Trump then.

Re: Two mass shootings in America [split topic]
« Reply #8 on: August 04, 2019, 12:15:38 AM »
So before Trump then.

If you think a racially motivated attack on the "Hispanic invasion" of Texas was not influenced in part by Trump then you live in an alternative reality and probably it's not worth trying to debate things further.

Re: Two mass shootings in America [split topic]
« Reply #9 on: August 04, 2019, 12:16:57 AM »
This Walmart shooter says in his Manifesto we've "Not to blame Trump"; be interesting to see if he Tweets about his vindication. He probably will.

"Good guy. A really great guy"

Re: Two mass shootings in America [split topic]
« Reply #10 on: August 04, 2019, 12:18:45 AM »
That wasn't my point though. Aye aye aye.

Urinal Cake

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Re: Two mass shootings in America [split topic]
« Reply #11 on: August 04, 2019, 12:23:28 AM »
These are old ideas and in this case ideas the shooter grew up with. If anything this is a failure on Trump and the GOP to do anything paradigm-changing about immigration either way. Whatever he does isn't going to be enough for a few/some/most of his voters. He and the GOP promised something they would never deliver because even in the crimson-mist of the shooter's manifesto the shooter realised that the majority of the GOP always wanted cheap Hispanic Labor.


Re: Two mass shootings in America [split topic]
« Reply #13 on: August 04, 2019, 12:28:45 AM »
These are old ideas and in this case ideas the shooter grew up with. If anything this is a failure on Trump and the GOP to do anything paradigm-changing about immigration either way. Whatever he does isn't going to be enough for a few/some/most of his voters. He and the GOP promised something they would never deliver because even in the crimson-mist of the shooter's manifesto the shooter realised that the majority of the GOP always wanted cheap Hispanic Labor.

Like fuck is it an "old idea that the shooter grew up with" when you have the President normalizing the fringe ideology that Latino immigrants are dangerous rapists who are invading the country and must be stopped.

The US has always been racist and had racist immigration policy but it is still possible to differentiate that with what is happening now. Don't be dense.

gib

  • weak and wobbly
Re: Two mass shootings in America [split topic]
« Reply #14 on: August 04, 2019, 12:30:38 AM »
I mean, wasn't there an in-depth cover story a couple weeks ago about how he had violently raped somebody in the 90s? Nobody even remembers or can tell you about it.

I was just watching some old shit i'd recorded off the telly weeks ago and at the end it was the news but by then i had forgotten it wasn't the live news. There was some story about Trump and i immediately thought it was a huge deal and have already forgotten what it even was.

Re: Two mass shootings in America [split topic]
« Reply #15 on: August 04, 2019, 12:38:37 AM »
So was Crusius another mass-murdering incel, then?

Re: Two mass shootings in America [split topic]
« Reply #16 on: August 04, 2019, 12:49:22 AM »
They're all mass-murderin' blah blah...  finished with them.

Urinal Cake

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Re: Two mass shootings in America [split topic]
« Reply #17 on: August 04, 2019, 12:51:23 AM »
Like fuck is it an "old idea that the shooter grew up with" when you have the President normalizing the fringe ideology that Latino immigrants are dangerous rapists who are invading the country and must be stopped.

The US has always been racist and had racist immigration policy but it is still possible to differentiate that with what is happening now. Don't be dense.
I agree Trump legitimised 'replacement theory' and made it real on the national stage. But the manifesto points to the shooter's ancedotal (as warped as they might be) experiences in Texas. It's  not just racial theories as well. There's  pro-environmental (which Trump does does not support) and anti-corporate (which Trump says he supports but really is pro-Corporate) theories etc.

Obviously the shooter is fucked up and his manifesto is a mish-mash of a lot of stuff but it points down to, 'America is for Americans only. But with a wide social safety net and let's try to preserve the environment as well'.  I guess in short what I'm trying to say is this guy is a individual who probably warped Yang, Sanders etc. into a racist America First ideology he grew up with and given national legitimacy by Trump and the GOP.
« Last Edit: August 04, 2019, 01:06:45 AM by Urinal Cake »

Re: Two mass shootings in America [split topic]
« Reply #18 on: August 04, 2019, 01:20:02 AM »
Well it's not based on his experiences in Texas because none of what he is talking about it rooted in reality. Net immigration has been decreasing for years. He is responding to an imaginary "crisis" that can be linked directly to Trump's presidential campaign and presidency.

Obviously there are countless factors that contribute to an event like this (lax gun control, this guy's mental health problems, online extremism) but it seems irresponsible to me not to address the elephant in the room, which is that this shift in the national discourse has been directly caused by Trump, Fox News, and the Republican party.

Re: Two mass shootings in America [split topic]
« Reply #19 on: August 04, 2019, 01:21:57 AM »
And YES, THANK YOU I did intend that elephant pun.

Urinal Cake

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Re: Two mass shootings in America [split topic]
« Reply #20 on: August 04, 2019, 02:57:48 AM »
He lived in Dallas but went to El Paso an American city with a population which is
Quote
80% Latino. Its Mexican twin city Ciudad Juárez, sits directly across the large barrier that divides their downtown areas. More than 23,000 pedestrians cross from Ciudad Juárez to El Paso to work every day.
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2019/aug/03/el-paso-shooting-what-we-know-so-far
And then he decides to shoots up Latino families during the start of school year in Wal-Mart. A corporation that thrives on cheap labour and on selling useless plastic. 

To him it's not just symbolic. To him, in his warped mind it was an encroaching 'reality' he was scared of and wanted to stop.

Now obviously is that a whole multi-faceted truth? Of course not but it is the part he saw and experienced and decided to destroy.

 It's too late the gun-toting, mass murdering, racist and economic-nationalist genie is already loose.

Mr Banlon

  • If you're gonna go nog, you gotta go Mingus
Re: Two mass shootings in America [split topic]
« Reply #21 on: August 04, 2019, 08:30:23 AM »

BritishHobo

  • That is a really reductive impression
Re: Two mass shootings in America [split topic]
« Reply #22 on: August 04, 2019, 09:00:36 AM »
These things make me want to become a Ricky Gervais atheist. Asking people on Twitter just how many prayers God needs exactly before he stops this shit happening?

BritishHobo

  • That is a really reductive impression
Re: Two mass shootings in America [split topic]
« Reply #23 on: August 04, 2019, 09:20:30 AM »
Lots of people already boarding the false flag comspiracy train. Seen people feverishly argue that the shooter they were photographed arresting in El Paso is not the same guy as in the photo of the shooter entering the store, because the shooter's pants were a darker colour - ignoring that the footage is much fuzzier and darker in general.

Re: Two mass shootings in America [split topic]
« Reply #24 on: August 04, 2019, 10:01:29 AM »
Apparently less that 0.03% of gun deaths in the US are because of mass shootings too. Obviously they get more publicity than all the boring suicides and everyday homicides but it's worth remembering that

Re: Two mass shootings in America [split topic]
« Reply #25 on: August 04, 2019, 10:52:48 AM »
Yet again with fucking ‘thoughts and prayers’ (that exact phrase) on Twitter. Does he know that that platitude long ago became an ‘Oh The Humanity’ level meme to indicate impotent ineffectuality and/or not giving a shit? Does he care? Is he doing it on purpose? He doesn’t seem to have woken up to news of Ohio yet but I look forward to him copy and pasting last nights tweets with the location changed.

Mister Six

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Re: Two mass shootings in America [split topic]
« Reply #26 on: August 04, 2019, 01:17:11 PM »
"Good guy. A really great guy"

"There were good people on both sides of this racially motivated mass murder."

Mister Six

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Re: Two mass shootings in America [split topic]
« Reply #27 on: August 04, 2019, 01:29:44 PM »
Apparently less that 0.03% of gun deaths in the US are because of mass shootings too. Obviously they get more publicity than all the boring suicides and everyday homicides but it's worth remembering that

What's your source for that? Because there's no agreed upon definition for "mass shooting", so that "statistic" depends entirely on how the person coming up with it wants to portray such incidents.

And the damage from mass shootings isn't limited to fatalities - you've also got crippling injuries and disabilities, injuries that cause bankruptcy due to lack of healthcare coverage or lead or people losing their jobs because of time taken off work, PTSD for injured victims and witnesses alike, and emotional damage to the friends and family of all involved (including the shooters).

So no, it's not worth remembering what you said because what you said is bollocks.

Chairman Yang

  • life changing
Re: Two mass shootings in America [split topic]
« Reply #28 on: August 04, 2019, 01:42:25 PM »
So no, it's not worth remembering what you said because what you said is bollocks.

It's possible that sponk's reply was supposed to read as "so it's even worse than we think" and not "so it's not a real problem"

Mister Six

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Re: Two mass shootings in America [split topic]
« Reply #29 on: August 04, 2019, 02:10:43 PM »
Oh, right. Well if that's the case then apologies Sponk.