Wrestling: Probs mostly about AEW TNT debut and Smackdown on Fox

[Ja'moke]

No discussion of Dynamite this week? I thought it was a bit of a clunker at times. The Jericho celebration, Pac/Omega and Scorpio/Jericho were all good but there were some awkward moments throughout the show, including possibly the worst debut I've ever seen for an act: "That's the Blade! And the Butcher!" Fucking WHO, Excalibur? And Allie is aligned with them as an evil bunny?

There was some brief discussion further up this page (EDIT: Of course a new page would start. Discussion further up previous page!). Agree that The Butcher and The Blade debut was poorly done. But they do have a great look (a big hoss with a handle-bar moustache and a monocle!), so I'm intrigued. As I said before, I think they could be related to Marty Scurll's debut, if he starts the Villain Enterprises in AEW.

[Deanjam]

I can only hope this is a piece of merchandise and not what Bray will wear to the ring.

[BeardFaceMan]

Has Corey Taylor sued him yet?

[Ja'moke]

Has Corey Taylor sued him yet?

I think the mask was made by the same guy who made the Slipknot masks, if I'm remembering correctly.

[magval]

Who, Tom Savini?

[Deanjam]

Who, Tom Savini?

Yes. They worked together on the design.

[Ja'moke]

So many people are having problems with the WWE Network that they've had to stream Starrcade for free on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5z-2WLVOXG0&feature=youtu.be

[up_the_hampipe]

AEW shit the bed with the ratings last week, even by Thanksgiving standards:

NXT: 810,000
AEW: 663,000

[bgmnts]

RAW vs. Smackdown teams for Survivor Series. I feel like I've been watching these same men feud with each other for decades.

Maybe it's that particular photo but they all look really similar.

Wrestlers used to look quite unique in my attitude era memory.

[Deanjam]

Maybe it's that particular photo but they all look really similar.

Wrestlers used to look quite unique in my attitude era memory.

It's amazing how many wear black/red and have dark hair and a beard.

AEW shit the bed with the ratings last week, even by Thanksgiving standards:

NXT: 810,000
AEW: 663,000

Heads off to Twitter for the meltdown.

[hummingofevil]

During Mania week I watch Bloodsports on the Wednesday 3 2-hour indie shows on the Thursday, Starrdom, NXT Takeover, Mania and the MSG super  show. That was about 25 hours of 18 hours of wrestling + Mania. It was all kinds of fun but felt like I had been on holiday to my kitched to watch my laptop.

If you watch RAW, Smackdown, AEW Dynamite, Dark, and NWA that is 10 hours already plus last week you had a Takeover and Survivor Series. If you have any interestin NJPW or Beyond or Impact or GCW or AAA or CMLL you could easily watch in the amount of wrestling I did in my wresting week every week now. It is too much to keep up with.

AEW have their own issues as for me they are falling between giving PPV matches like Kenny PAC away too easily and have a mid-card and women's division that has consistently been at best, just as bad as the worst aspects of WWE TV. Will still watch AEW every week over giving Vince any money but the combination of wrestling fatigue and the dawning realisation AEW is quite a flawed product means I can totally see where a casual might be turning off.

[Ja'moke]

It'll be interesting to see if WWE's tactic of including NXT in this year's Survivor Series pays off long-term. Definitely helped with the boost these past two weeks with the go-home show and post-PPV episode, now to see if they can keep around 800k.

AEW's drop is a little worrying this time, but it's still early days, so I'm not going to be shouting Rest In Peace anytime soon. You have to remember, they've had what, 9 weeks of TV so far? The company is in its infancy and, in my opinion, has put out a high-quality TV show almost every week (with last week's been the first average episode). That makes me excited to think where it will be in say 6-8 months time when it has established more characters and storylines and hopefully built up its women's division.

[Mobius]

I think it was inevitable really that ratings would drop. Not many people watch telly, not many people watch wrestling. There is no Wednesday Night War.

I mean like 2 million people still watch Raw and Smackdown which is baffling...

Some of the criticism of AEW is fair. Like why the fuck do they keep cutting to audience reactions a split second after a spot? Everyone hates that shit. And why is the audio still so fucking shit? But other stuff like 'who are the Butcher and The Blade? omg the crowd was dead!!" ... well we don't have to be intimately familiar with every debut, or have prior knowledge via Twitter or having watched guys on the indies. Not everything is about the pop!

But yeah personally. far too much fucking wrestling. I've definitely tuned out in the last few weeks, tend to watch clips from Reddit instead...

[Ja'moke]

It's also a weirdly big drop that makes me think it's an anomaly. I mean, I could be completely wrong, but it seemed to have levelled out at an average of around 800k, and even bounced back to near 1 mil for its post-Full Gear show, so the fall to 663,000 seems strange to me. Like, what turned 200k people away? I'm intrigued to see if it is back around the normal figure this week or if it's really lost that much of an audience in a week.

In other wrestling news, I'm still working my way through Stardom (I started from the first 2019 Tag League show) and loving it. I think starting with the Tag League was a solid introduction point as you basically get to see the entire roster and can quickly get a grasp of the characters. Still not sure on all the different belts (especially confusing because a lot of them turn up with belts from other promotions), but I know all the different factions now (Oedo Tai being my favourites... ace entrance music).

[peanutbutter]

It's also a weirdly big drop that makes me think it's an anomaly.

They won every demographic other than old people.
My guess: a huge chunk of their audience was travelling home, whereas NXT's core was in the same seat they'll be in for the next 20 years


AEW definitely have a rough few months in front of them though, they need to find a sustainable voice and they need to feel different enough to break away from the huge fatigue that WWE are inducing atm.

[up_the_hampipe]

AEW's drop is a little worrying this time, but it's still early days, so I'm not going to be shouting Rest In Peace anytime soon.

I don't expect AEW fans to be saying that even if it dies. They'll be doing Weekend At Bernie's with its corpse.

Seriously, though, one low rating a day before Thanksgiving isn't an indication of anything really. It's quite a drop but I'm sure they'll even out again.

[Spode]

AEW should be buzzing that so many people missed that Jericho segment last week. Wasn't a patch on the Festival of Friendship and seemed to last five hours. Awful.

[Lost Oliver]

Anyone here watch the Reliving Wrestling stuff on YT? I used to be well into wrestling years ago and these videos are brilliant for someone like me. Basically takes a storyline, tells you the behind the scenes shizz, shows you fights and the pre and post story stuff. It's bloody brilliant.

If there's anything else out there that's similar I'd love to know.

Anyway, here's one he did on Perry Saturn

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gA5kSRKBVz8

[boki]

Anyone here watch the Reliving Wrestling stuff on YT? I used to be well into wrestling years ago and these videos are brilliant for someone like me. Basically takes a storyline, tells you the behind the scenes shizz, shows you fights and the pre and post story stuff. It's bloody brilliant.

If there's anything else out there that's similar I'd love to know.

I think some of Brian Zane's work on his Wrestling With Wregret channel would be along those kinds of lines.

[weekender]

Anyone here watch the Reliving Wrestling stuff on YT? I used to be well into wrestling years ago and these videos are brilliant for someone like me. Basically takes a storyline, tells you the behind the scenes shizz, shows you fights and the pre and post story stuff. It's bloody brilliant.

I have a few documentaries and a few books from that era.  Anything you want?

[sevendaughters]

obv they were going to do the long game with Kenny but they've made the hottest guy in the world look a bit of a fucking nerd (he hasn't helped himself) in a way similar to...no I won't say it

[hummingofevil]

AEW opening strong. If I was them I would "hot shot" this with a 30 min match.

I love Wrestling Observer more than I love wrestling but Dave doing 25 min ratings breakdowns is, ironically, a real ratings killer for me. I don't care about how many 40 year olds changed channels during a Kris Statlander match.

[Timothy]

Show was ok (some good some bad some incredibly boring, more detailed comment later today) but you'd expect a big company to have better production two months into their tv show. Dont know what was up with the sound but it was absolutely horrible.

[sevendaughters]

yeah the rise of AEW coincidentally has put me off wrestling and wrestling radio nearly completely. NJPW having a quiet final third always does this to be fair.

[Ja'moke]

I thought AEW was back on form this week. Two hours just flew by. Also it's so rare for wrestling to nail humour and AEW makes me genuinely laugh at least a couple of times each week. This time it was the Britt Baker shot and Jericho's list (sorry, lexicon) segment.

Also nice to see them building women's stories on TV now. And I said it before, I'll say it again, Kris Statlander is fantastic. I think her vs Shida was possibly match of the night. Though Trent v Fenix was ace too... and it's clever how they're using these personal tag feuds to do some single matches which helps Fenix and Penta stack up some single wins for a future singles run.

I still think Marty is behind The Butcher, The Blade and The Bunny too, especially after that promo video.

Also, on the audio issue, completely fine on Fite TV stream. And apparently was fine for those watching on TSN in Canada too. So it seems to be a TNT problem.

[Spode]

AEW back over 800,000 and beats NXT too. Good to hear, would have hated it to have gone down again. Seems to have a settled audience.

[Ja'moke]

AEW back over 800,000 and beats NXT too. Good to hear, would have hated it to have gone down again. Seems to have a settled audience.

I knew last week would just be a blip. It didn't make sense that it suddenly lost 200k viewers permanently, seeing as every other week was settled around 800k.

[Deanjam]

Very close this week.



Interesting success for NXT in key graphics.



Just hope NXT losing doesn't convince Vince to go back to importing Raw & Smackdown geeks.

[hummingofevil]

Just watch all of Dynamite. It's starting to annoy me as much as WWE. I've just deleted my full rant as, TBF the way they telling stories around Moxley and Cody is ace, the Dark Order stuff is fun and makes a lot of sense and hopefully Fenix winning means that LB will face Best Friends and put an end to that nonsense by destroying them soon (next week please). And Bucks winning is good. And I don't really see what everyone else sees in Statlander but I am happy enough she is there. But...

Urgh. Sports entertainment tastic with the rest of it. Brandi Rhodes is an impressive human being and but a very average wrestler and why the hell would you not just have her and Cody's character being the characters that are so likeable in their real life. If it's some huge meta rib on Stephanie then I hope they are enjoying it but no-one else is. Literally the worst thing in WWE is Stephanie and HHH's desperation to be heel characters and corportate babyfaces and they are doing exactly the same thing. The fuck?

And I am so sorry to say but Nyla Rose gurning the place up does nothing for me. The women's division is a mess. Why the hell they didn't go all out for the Impact women I really don't understand. Scarlett Bordeaux and Killer Kross would be excellent additions to the roster (and Tessa obviously if she becomes available). I want to see ace Joshi/Lucha matches from the women's division.

[hummingofevil]

Very close this week.



Interesting success for NXT in key graphics.



Just hope NXT losing doesn't convince Vince to go back to importing Raw & Smackdown geeks.

So does that prove AEW were actually in the pub with their friends last week? :)