Boris Johnson planning to prorogue parliament [split topic]

[Fambo Number Mive]

One of the replies to Andrea Jenkyns' tweet wants to take us all to "the Hague for treason": https://twitter.com/hlvincent15/status/1171042477702287361

It's scary how the country is sliding into outright civil war cheered on by the elite.

[Cuellar]

One of the replies to Andrea Jenkyns' tweet wants to take us all to "the Hague for treason": https://twitter.com/hlvincent15/status/1171042477702287361

It's scary how the country is sliding into outright civil war cheered on by the elite.

"That's it! Report to the Hague immediately!"

[Replies From View]

If there's no documented reason all it will take is for No. 10 to say 'no, we did it because Queen's Speech' - what can you do against that, from a legal perspective?

Say, 'I think you're lying'. Ok, well prove it.

There wasn't a Queen's Speech yet.  I don't understand what you're getting at.

[Cuellar]

The reason they've always given is that it's perfectly normal to do it before a Queen's Speech

[Replies From View]

The reason they've always given is that it's perfectly normal to do it before a Queen's Speech

And there is normally a Queen's Speech at this time is there?

[DrGreggles]

Maybe the docs they've been forced to released prove the real reason for proroguing?

[George Oscar Bluth II]

The reason they've always given is that it's perfectly normal to do it before a Queen's Speech

And the Scottish ruling points out that a five week prorogation before a Queen's Speech is not normal at all, and can only have been cooked up to limit scrutiny. I don't know if the UK Supreme Court is allowed to make logical jumps like that.

[Cuellar]

And there is normally a Queen's Speech at this time is there?

There's always a Queen's Speech, so why not now?

[jobotic]

Andrea Jenkyns MP says the British public should take "parliament & some parliamentarians to court for failing to honour & thwarting the democratic referendum."

https://twitter.com/andreajenkyns/status/1170960642964168705

Frightening. An MP calling for her fellow elected members to be taken to court for holding the Government to account.

How are Parliament failing to honour the referendum? They are trying to make the Government leave with a deal. The referendum didn't say leave with no deal.

Fuck me, the imbeciles commenting. One cunt has (of Johnson) #PeoplesPrimeMinister

[Buelligan]

No 10 Spokesperson - the courts are biased.

Pure and deliberate Trump tactics.

Link?  If this is real, it means no one in Britain needs to abide by the law any longer because the courts cannot be relied upon and their authority no longer exists.  Interesting new development there for the UK.

[Kelvin]

Fuck me, the imbeciles commenting. One cunt has (of Johnson) #PeoplesPrimeMinister

Guy at work today unironically called Johnson 'a modern Churchill.'

[DrGreggles]

Guy at work today unironically called Johnson 'a modern Churchill.'

[Clatty McCutcheon]

So this hinges on what the 'real' reason for the prorogation was - how can you ever prove what the 'real' reason was? Unless the Scottish court saw documents signed by Boris saying 'I want to prorogue parliament for 5 weeks so that there can be no parliamentary scrutiny', but if such documents existed surely they would have been seen by the English court too.

I mean, obviously it was the reason, but what is there that proves it

It's a reasonable inference which can be drawn from the circumstances - and an assessment of the credibility and reliability of the individuals involved.  Plenty of court cases of all types are decided on this basis.

My money would be on the Supreme Court dodging the need to have their judgment hinge on this specific issue by deciding that there are certain prerogative powers of the Queen which the judiciary cannot interfere with, and these include prorogation.  This was basically the reasoning in the initial Court of Session judgment from last week. 

However, I was pleasantly surprised by today's judgment so who knows. We're in totally unprecedented times.

[Clatty McCutcheon]

One of the replies to Andrea Jenkyns' tweet wants to take us all to "the Hague for treason": https://twitter.com/hlvincent15/status/1171042477702287361

It's scary how the country is sliding into outright civil war cheered on by the elite.

I've seen some Brexiteer comments this morning to the effect that the government should sack members of the judiciary - so basically fascism then.

[Cuellar]

It's a reasonable inference which can be drawn from the circumstances - and an assessment of the credibility and reliability of the individuals involved.  Plenty of court cases of all types are decided on this basis.

My money would be on the Supreme Court dodging the need to have their judgment hinge on this specific issue by deciding that there are certain prerogative powers of the Queen which the judiciary cannot interfere with, and these include prorogation.  This was basically the reasoning in the initial Court of Session judgment from last week. 

However, I was pleasantly surprised by today's judgment so who knows. We're in totally unprecedented times.

Yes, reading the summary of the judgement from the court in London that seems to be their key point - that the judiciary can't judge on political matters like this, and has no standard by which to judge what a excessive prorogation would be.

https://www.judiciary.uk/wp-content/uploads/2019/09/Summary-Miller-v-The-Prime-Minister-1.pdf

One of the government's arguments, however, that this has been the longest parliamentary session in 40 years and it's becoming 'increasingly difficult to fill parliamentary time with appropriate work' seems utter and blatant horseshit. But again, can the courts say 'Come off it, you need to be debating Brexit, isn't that work enough?'

[idunnosomename]

Guy at work today unironically called Johnson 'a modern Churchill.'

to be fair they are both fat tory cunts

[Famous Mortimer]

to be fair they are both fat tory cunts

With less-than-great policies towards non-whites (although Johnson never sat behind a machine gun mowing them down, as far as I can tell).

[danielreal2k]

Apparently a number of MP's are heading back to Parliament to "try and get through the doors" 

[Cuellar]

Some Labour MP already tweeted a selfie of him at the door to the empty chamber.

[BlodwynPig]

STORM PARLIAMENT

Where's Biggy? This is his cup of tea

[popcorn]

Link?  If this is real, it means no one in Britain needs to abide by the law any longer because the courts cannot be relied upon and their authority no longer exists.  Interesting new development there for the UK.

Here: https://twitter.com/tnewtondunn/status/1171726506772631553

Sources in No10 now hitting back at the Scottish judges, suggesting they are politically biased: "We note that last week the High Court in London did not rule that prorogation was unlawful. The legal activists choose the Scottish courts for a reason".

Guardian person doing live updates says this, which I think is fair enough tbh:

My view is that this No 10 source quote is not as incendiary as Newton Dunn implies. The Scots have their own legal system and, according to David Allen Green (see 10.34am), on constitutional matters the Scottish courts don't always take the same view as the English courts. The No 10 source is pointing that out. But that does not make the judges biased. "Biased" implies bad faith, which is different.

[phantom_power]

although Johnson never sat behind a machine gun mowing them down, as far as I can tell

Only in his most fevered wank fantasies

[brat-sampson]

Regarding documents of proof: (from the summary of the ruling)

On the eve of the hearing, in obedience of its duty of candour, the respondent lodged some partially redacted documents exhibiting some of the Government's deliberations regarding prorogation, going back to 15 August.

The Lord President, Lord Carloway, decided that although advice to HM the Queen on the exercise of the royal prerogative of prorogating Parliament was not reviewable on the normal grounds of judicial review, it would nevertheless be unlawful if its purpose was to stymie parliamentary scrutiny of the executive, which was a central pillar of the good governance principle enshrined in the constitution;

the content of the documents produced by the respondent demonstrated that this was the true reason for the prorogation.

So they've definitely got something.

[George Oscar Bluth II]

Boris Johnson rules out election pact with Brexit Party. Senior Tory source: 'Neither Nigel Farage not Arron Banks are fit and proper persons and they should never be allowed anywhere near government'

From the Daily Mail political editor on the twitters. So we can expect an election pact with the Brexit Party then.

[Cardenio I]

It goes to show how much of a credulous dolt I am that I still have, somewhere in the back of my mind, the lingering fear that this is all part of Cummings' 5D chess masterplan.

[George Oscar Bluth II]

Can we just imagine the reaction if a court ruled that prime minister Jeremy Corbyn lied to the Queen.

And cross reference that with what the reaction will be now that a court as ruled that prime minister Boris Johnson has lied to the Queen. Trump proves that political followers will throw out everything they claim to stand for to support their guy, so I doubt this will be any different. The Queen? Fuck her, stupid old bag.

[popcorn]

I personally would never lie to the queen.

[idunnosomename]

the queen is a gullible old fool. time for her to retire, and for JEREMY CORBYN to take her place!!!!

[Puce Moment]

the queen is a gullible old fool. time for her to retire, and for JEREMY CORBYN to take her place!!!!

Treason.

[Blue Jam]

From the Daily Mail political editor on the twitters. So we can expect an election pact with the Brexit Party then.

Is anyone else angry at how frightened some people are of Nigel Farage? We only got an EU referendum in the first place because David Cameron was afraid the Tories would lose seats to UKIP, and then when they won fuck-all he still had to go ahead an implement the referendum as promised. Now people are taking the serial failed MP seriously again... Why does he get so much credit and why are people this prepared to hand a bit of power over to him?