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Jojo Rabbit, Nazi comedy by Taika Waititi

Started by samadriel, September 04, 2019, 02:58:58 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

Dewt

Quote from: Mister Six on January 14, 2020, 06:03:11 PM
Yeah fair enough, I think he's an interesting bloke either way, and your version works too.
Also I watched this again with somebody and
when K is showing Jojo his uniform designs earlier in the movie, he describes his fun as a "gatling gun mounted with a radio which emits annoying music to disarm the enemy". You can see that's what he's using here (using a gramophone) media.discordapp.net/attachments/460856363577507840/667121223007993856/image1-1050x591.png
and I think the German Shepherd mixup was on purpose to waste time and so they didn't actually get dogs

.

Dr Rock

Just saw this, and loved it. The last ten or twenty minutes were fantastic and two bits had me laughing for ages
Spoiler alert
('Fuck off Hitler' and final bit where they start swaying from side-to-side before pulling more complex shapes then Heroes ends the movie.)
[close]

Kid was amazing too.

Sin Agog

Really like the choice of Love's fireside singalong Everybody's Gotta Live.  It makes up for yet another airing of Heroes, even if I did think it was quite a nice little ending overall.  Apparently both the kids were fastidiously imitating Waititi's own moves just off-camera.

Dex Sawash

This is now one of my favorite films. Really sweet. Can't watch with my wife as she can't see children or animals harmed, parents harmed, hangings or flowers

Dr Rock

Quote from: Dex Sawash on August 02, 2020, 06:43:43 PM
This is now one of my favorite films. [/s]

Same here I think.

I keep reading people calling it a 'satire' - it's not satirical is it?

phantom_power

No, it is a dark comedy. How can you be satirical about Nazis? Why would you be?

neveragain

Of course you can. You satirise all the idiots who followed Hitler. Or rather the mass stupidity of society at that time (and now) and the political situation under which it was allowed to flourish.

phantom_power

Quote from: neveragain on August 03, 2020, 02:49:16 PM
Of course you can. You satirise all the idiots who followed Hitler.

What would be the point of that though? We know they are idiots. Maybe the why is a bigger issue than the how

neveragain

I've just added a sentence to my answer which hopefully makes it more worthwhile.

And, sadly, there are still people out there who don't think the Nazis were idiots. Is the problem that only people who agree with the filmmaker are likely to see the film? That's possibly an issue.

Mister Six

Yeah, it's more about how young people can be radicalised by exploiting their limited experience of the world, and is applicable to more than just 1940s Germany.

dissolute ocelot

I still believe it's mediocre. Any attempt to be some kind of satire/denunciation of child radicalisation is undercut by the fact that the adult characters are so sketchily drawn. It attempts to do a "kids don't know what is going on" worldview by not bothering to make any of the characters rounded or psychologically believable, rather than trying to reveal other characters through the child's eyes. Such an approach will tend to make Nazism look arbitrary and accidental, and obscure who are the heroes and villains (other films like Grave of the Fireflies which take a similarly wide-eyed innocent approach to war focus more vaguely on a simple "war is hell" message which doesn't require psychological explanations). Lots of films offer much better accounts of radicalisation; lots of films do a much better job of presenting horrific things from an innocent child's point of view; and lots of films have better jokes about war.

Poirots BigGarlickyCorpse

Quote from: phantom_power on August 03, 2020, 02:44:51 PM
No, it is a dark comedy. How can you be satirical about Nazis? Why would you be?
Have... have you seriously never seen The Producers?

Dr Rock

Since asking if it's a satire I've seen a tweet and a clip where Taika refers to it as a satire.

phantom_power

Quote from: Poirots BigGarlickyCorpse on August 03, 2020, 11:42:29 PM
Have... have you seriously never seen The Producers?

That's not really a satire of Nazis is it. It is a comedy featuring Nazis

Sin Agog

Quote from: phantom_power on August 04, 2020, 09:30:22 AM
That's not really a satire of Nazis is it.

To Be Or Not To Be and particularly The Great Dictator are, and both of them excel at their job.

bgmnts

A satire is basically the same thing but with animals in it. I didn't see any pigs or ducks dressed in Nazi officer uniforms so it's not a satire as far as i'm concerned.

Sin Agog

Quote from: bgmnts on August 04, 2020, 03:24:31 PM
A satire is basically the same thing but with animals in it. I didn't see any pigs or ducks dressed in Nazi officer uniforms so it's not a satire as far as i'm concerned.

I know you're just being a bgmnts, but I wouldn't call Maus a satire.  It's Nazis but with animals in it, except it's so grimly realistic that I'm not seeing the satire there.

Puce Moment

I was greatly relieved to find that this did not try to be satirical after having more than enough of Iannucci's blank bullets output.

bgmnts

Quote from: Sin Agog on August 04, 2020, 03:33:09 PM
I know you're just being a bgmnts, but I wouldn't call Maus a satire.  It's Nazis but with animals in it, except it's so grimly realistic that I'm not seeing the satire there.

I find the idea of Nazi mice quite comical myself.* I suppose its just an allegory maybe? Whats the difference between allegory and satire? Just the comedy?



*I've not actually read Maus but definitely will get round to it someday.

QDRPHNC


Poirots BigGarlickyCorpse

Quote from: phantom_power on August 04, 2020, 09:30:22 AM
That's not really a satire of Nazis is it. It is a comedy featuring Nazis
Yeah according to Mel Brooks the point of Springtime for Hitler was to make Hitler and the Nazis look foolish and in doing so rob them of their power.

samadriel

Quote from: Sin Agog on August 04, 2020, 03:33:09 PM
I know you're just being a bgmnts, but I wouldn't call Maus a satire.  It's Nazis but with animals in it, except it's so grimly realistic that I'm not seeing the satire there.

I assumed he was talking about Animal Farm.

Sin Agog

I got that.  Just wanted to exhibit my extreme virility by pointing out an exception to the animal satire rule.

Poirots BigGarlickyCorpse

God I really want to read Maus. It's fascinating that Spiegelmann ends up acknowledging the breakdown of the animal metaphor within the text.

Dex Sawash


Page count lower than yet another batman movie that isn't out yet.

SavageHedgehog

Yes, this Oscar nominated, critically and commercially successful film owned by the company who have a borderline monopoly on the film industry is exactly the type of film that really needs more exposure.



OK, I'm being a dick, and I take your point and I suppose you could say this kind of lower mid-budget film is precisely the type at threat of becoming invisible. But this film's doing fine.

Dex Sawash


TBF,  there's plenty of Batman chat to be had in advance of production/release. I'm still fucked off they replaced Adam West though.