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Better Call Saul - Season 5

Started by lankyguy95, November 20, 2019, 04:27:18 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

druss

Spoiler alert
Wanted Nacho to make it out but also found myself cheering for Lalo there. Terrifying bastard but the last season wouldn't have been the same if he'd died in this one.
[close]

selectivememory

I guess we had an idea that Lalo would survive just because in Breaking Bad Jimmy/Saul mentions him[nb]although I guess that wouldn't necessarily mean that he does ultimately survive this show, just that Jimmy thinks he's still out there[/nb]... But still, a thrilling scene. Poor Nacho, it's been torture watching him navigate his position this season, trapped between two ruthless murderers and doing his best to survive and protect his dad.

Quite liked the misdirection with Jimmy and Kim, thinking that maybe there was going to be some retaliation from Lalo, and then the episode ends with them plotting against Howard. Kim has come quite far over the course of this season and Seehorn should be getting all the awards for her performance.

Seriously though, the last few episodes have been so intense. I have struggled to sit through them in one go. I'm constantly pausing and having to break. It's not exactly a pleasant viewing experience. I have a similar thing with Nathan For You, another amazing show that for a different reason always makes me uncomfortable.

NoSleep

#662
Quote from: selectivememory on April 21, 2020, 03:51:03 PM

Quite liked the misdirection with Jimmy and Kim, thinking that maybe there was going to be some retaliation from Lalo, and then the episode ends with them plotting against Howard.


I felt we were left wondering what Lalo had taken in from his meeting at Kim & Jimmy's flat; could have been several possibilities. Mike just wiped the slate clean this week with the "Kim saved your ass" comment.

I think Lalo took Nacho down to Mexico on account of what Kim had said about who he trusted. That went swiftly wrong for him.

up_the_hampipe

Quote from: Puce Moment on April 21, 2020, 01:08:41 PM
Ooops! Yes.

I agree that the only weak part of that episode was the ineptness of the hired guns. They could have at least made Lalo's tricksy bluff seem even more clear by making the assassins super efficient and professional.

The only weak moment in an otherwise mouth-watering finale.

Yes, they seemed oddly out of their depth for Gus hires. Lalo is awesome though, what a performance.

I'm starting to wonder if Slippin' Kimmy's fate will be a jail cell.

NoSleep

Quote from: up_the_hampipe on April 21, 2020, 07:10:23 PM
Yes, they seemed oddly out of their depth for Gus hires.

It was a rush job to cash in on Nacho being there, I guess. And subcontracted for security. Worked out nicely for Nacho.

Twit 2

If Banks dies before the next season, can they get a shaved Leonard Susskind in?

Gulftastic

Clay Davis!

And, in related news, the hitmen were shiiiiiiiiiiiii-iiiiitt

Puce Moment

Just rewatched that episode and it's definitely one of my favourites. All of the Kim scenes just jump off the screen. In particular, the hotel room scenes are wonderful. Like those rare upbeat moments in a Cassevetes film, all that stuff in the bed are so strong. The way Kim leads Jimmy into believing her Howard indignation so that she can pitch her Sandpiper idea is just great scripting.

Give that woman some fucking awards please.

Blue Jam

Married Kim and Jimmy are still adorable. Seeing them brought closer together this season was a nice surprise after they were drifting apart in season 4. Also a smart move because it will make their almost inevitable separation in season 6 unbearably heartbreaking.

Loved the hotel scenes. I guess I got my glimpse of what "Viktor" and "Giselle" living happily ever after in Monaco would look like.

lankyguy95

Slightly underwhelmed by this as a season finale. Even in a rush, Gus could surely organise better hitmen than that. I never really felt like Lalo was going to die either - there's no way they would finish his character off that easily, and his quick thinking savagery felt like it wasn't as stretched as it could have been because of what he was up against. I was much more tense watching Nacho stumble across Lalo as he was trying to escape than I was by anything afterwards.

I'd probably be more positive about it if it hadn't been the finale to be fair - it was still mostly solid. Good suggestion in here about Kim's reasoning for sabotaging Howard being to stop Jimmy, via the Sandpiper money, from getting further involved with the cartel. Didn't think of that while I was watching. She definitely hasn't (yet) broken bad so badly as to completely destroy Howard for the sake of it.

No idea how this final season goes. I've long given up seriously predicting how Gould, Gilligan and co. are going to do things. Often feels like they destroy most predictions within the first episode or two of a season. See, for example, the last run of Breaking Bad episodes when they sprung the Walt/Hank confrontation the first episode after Hank's realisation in the mid-season finale. Maybe we'll see a big death in the first two episodes of S6?

up_the_hampipe

There's a lot of changes Jimmy will need to go through in season 6 for the Saul Goodman of Breaking Bad to make sense. It's not just his descent deep into the world of crime, but his personality is a lot sleazier and ignorant. He's wiser to the crime world but also seems more naive in Breaking Bad than at the beginning of Better Call Saul. This is all to be expected when you flesh a character out in a prequel, but I hope they show the proper evolution into the scumbag he becomes. It's hard to imagine Saul Goodman went through the events of Bag Man or that Jimmy McGill would talk to Francesca in such a crude way.

lankyguy95

Quote from: up_the_hampipe on April 21, 2020, 08:33:38 PM
There's a lot of changes Jimmy will need to go through in season 6 for the Saul Goodman of Breaking Bad to make sense. It's not just his descent deep into the world of crime, but his personality is a lot sleazier and ignorant. He's wiser to the crime world but also seems more naive in Breaking Bad than at the beginning of Better Call Saul. This is all to be expected when you flesh a character out in a prequel, but I hope they show the proper evolution into the scumbag he becomes. It's hard to imagine Saul Goodman went through the events of Bag Man or that Jimmy McGill would talk to Francesca in such a crude way.
He also appears so comfortable in his own skin in Breaking Bad. It seems to me he's nowhere near that yet, certainly not in the crime world.

BritishHobo

I feel a little bad for daft Howard. I really like though the idea that if a terrible downfall does come for Kim it might not be a bloody cartel-based one, but instead the consequences of some truly petty Saul-inspired revenge, whatever her motivation for that is.

Truly terrified for Nacho as well. I can't see Fring being hugely interested in sticking his neck out for him again, even if it was Fring's guards who bungled it.

Petey Pate

The Jimmy/Kim storyline was a bit of a climbdown after the intensity of last week but I was still watching Nacho's scenees with my heart in my mouth. Did anyone else think he might have slipped Lalo a mickey?

The unspoken annoyance of Juan at Lalo's pandering to the Don was very well done, as was Nacho going through the motions in his 'job interview'.

Blue Jam

Quote from: up_the_hampipe on April 21, 2020, 08:33:38 PM
There's a lot of changes Jimmy will need to go through in season 6 for the Saul Goodman of Breaking Bad to make sense.

Not least the hair. There has been some noticeable wig shrinkage this season but at this rate we'll need a time jump with a hair loss montage in season 6. We're still a long way from the combover we will eventually see flapping about in the breeze of the New Mexico desert.

More good ponytail action from Kim this week. The perfect curl was gone and it was looking a bit dishevelled from all the stress. Either that or she forgot to pack her curling tongs. Maybe if she quits law she'll finally let her hair down.

Blue Jam

I loved the scene with Kim entering the room full of documents at the courthouse and being overwhelmed by how many boxes there were. That was a nice callback to her being overwhelmed at Mesa Verde when she realised how much work she'd taken on and had serious doubts over her ability to cope with it all.

Poor Kim. She's tried corporate law and that didn't work out for her, and now she's realised that trying to be a force for good is futile- she'll still be overworked, only this time she'll also be underpaid. Now she can see why Jimmy cuts corners, and she's tempted to try things his way.

Puce Moment

I'm surprised by some of the reactions to this episode, perhaps because Gus' men were so stinky.

But watch that scene with Kim and Jimmy under the covers as she watches a plan for Howard's downfall. It's great stuff.

Blue Jam

Quote from: Puce Moment on April 21, 2020, 09:03:56 PM
watch that scene with Kim and Jimmy under the covers as she watches a plan for Howard's downfall. It's great stuff.

Part of me would like to see an alternate universe spin-off where nothing bad happens and the show just mutates into a heartwarming screwball comedy where Kim and Jimmy pull the odd harmless prank on Howard before everyone laughs about it and then the giddy couple go home and order takeaway and watch sappy movies and live happily ever after.

Bob'n'Rhea have great chemistry, awwwww.

Non Stop Dancer

I love this show but I just don't buy Kim's motivation for putting up with Jimmy's shit. Why is she so willing to be dragged into the dirt by him when she's got so much going for her? So many times in the past she's looked to be on the verge of binning him off, perfectly sensibly, but now she's just willing to completely debase herself.

Blue Jam

I liked the bit where Jimmy asked Kim "What do we do next?" and Kim starred going through more revenge fantasies before Jimmy said "Or maybe we buy a house..." And all his sad puppy dog facial expressions before Kim brought him round with the room service menu.

Jimmy is adorable, but BB-era Saul really, really isn't. How is he going to become so repellent so quickly?

https://youtu.be/0yr-KJWLTUU

Twit 2

Quote from: Non Stop Dancer on April 21, 2020, 10:18:35 PM
I love this show but I just don't buy Kim's motivation for putting up with Jimmy's shit. Why is she so willing to be dragged into the dirt by him when she's got so much going for her? So many times in the past she's looked to be on the verge of binning him off, perfectly sensibly, but now she's just willing to completely debase herself.

I thought the answers to that had been ceded throughout? Namely, that beneath the classy, professional veneer Kim actually has more in common with Jimmy than not. She likes the risk and thrill. Before, Jimmy's shenanigans had been getting in the way of what she thought she wanted, but gradually she realised corporate law wasn't for her and instead of being as uptight she's now relaxing into their relationship. The wonderful irony being that just as she wants in on a bit more japery, Jimmy is put off and now scared of playing with fire, after his traumatising experiences with the cartel. They're actually still out of step with each other, only in a different way. The dynamics constantly shift. The attention to detail in the characterisation in this is truly exceptional.

Twit 2

The hitmen didn't bother me as much as Nacho being so morose and standoffish. He should know there's too much at stake to risk blowing things by acting suspiciously. Or was it a case of reverse psychology: Nacho impresses the Don by not being too try hard and sycophantic? With, Lalo, though, I get the feeling that Nacho should have been joining in with his joviality and attempts to relax. I suppose it all adds to the dolorous tale of poor young Nacho.

Lalo, lurching into the frame at the end like The Terminator, though, fucking hell.

Poobum

Re-watching Breaking Bad, I imagine Jimmy being a lot more upset by Mike's demise, rather than Saul's euphemistically referring to him being sent to Belize.

Blue Jam

I liked Lalo and family laughing at the introduction of Nacho as "a friend of Tuco's" and them finding the idea of that violent psychopath having actual friends so amusing.

...and then I remembered that Tuco will be out of prison in 11 months and I wondered if Lalo's revenge will be served cold... :(

samadriel

Quote from: Twit 2 on April 21, 2020, 10:37:34 PM
Lalo, lurching into the frame at the end like The Terminator, though, fucking hell.
I liked the echo added to him crunching through the grass, sounding like thunder. Ominous!

beanheadmcginty

Quote from: Gulftastic on April 21, 2020, 07:39:06 PM
Clay Davis!

And, in related news, the hitmen were shiiiiiiiiiiiii-iiiiitt

I'm afraid that wasn't Clay Davis. He's played by Isiah Whitlock Jr. (and I'm pretty sure is contractually obliged to say 'sheeeeeeiiiitttt' in everything he's in). The bloke you thought was him in this epusode was Roy Wood Jr. (who I'm pretty sure is not related to the Wizzard frontman).

Rev+

Quote from: lankyguy95 on April 21, 2020, 08:29:28 PM
Slightly underwhelmed by this as a season finale. Even in a rush, Gus could surely organise better hitmen than that. I never really felt like Lalo was going to die either

After two great episodes, this one just sort of shut up the shop for a while.  Eh, stuff,  Lalo wasn't going to die because He's alive in Breaking Bad so the tension needs to come from elsewhere.   I don't know why they keep doing this sort of thing, when they get tension between characters so right.

kngen

I really liked the fucked-up stilted atmosphere in the hotel, with Kim steely as hell, and Jimmy being piss-weak. Nice switcheroo that I didn't see coming.

However, I'm confused by the multitudes of folk 'coming around' to Kim being the sexiest being on earth. Surely that was established in the very first shot of her stood in the partial shadows of HHM's multistory parking, Bacall-esque, with fag in hand.

kalowski

Quote from: Rev+ on April 22, 2020, 12:06:58 AM
After two great episodes, this one just sort of shut up the shop for a while.  Eh, stuff,  Lalo wasn't going to die because He's alive in Breaking Bad so the tension needs to come from elsewhere.   I don't know why they keep doing this sort of thing, when they get tension between characters so right.
Jimmy believes him to be alive in BB, that's not quite the same. It does mean Jimmy will need to find out that the hit did not succeed because, judging from the contented look he had on his face at 3.30am he was happy Lalo was going to be killed (admittedly, if I was in a hotel room at 3.30am with Kim I'd look content too.)

phantom_power

Also, Nacho and Lalo are probably not uncommon names so it could be referring to someone else. I don't think the show runners will feel beholden to a minor bit of continuity from a different show with some characters that didn't exist when the original show was written