Labour Election Hustings:What Do They Know? Do They Know Things? Let's Find Out!

[thugler]

Let's stop pretending Starmer would do any more than business as usual neoliberalism with some social tinkering to start with.

What 'victory' would there be, if any victory at all. A less ghastly capitalist has emerged, yay.

Labour must become a vocally pro-environmentalist party that uses it as a wedge issue to claw back Liberal and Green votes and pray that Johnson presides over a decline they can capitalise on. Separately, in Scotland it has to capitalise on the growing discontent with the SNP over the next few years.

They can use the environmentalism as a base to attack corporate greed and so forth.

A universal basic income is an issue they should table early and spend the next 5 years buttering the public up for.

He's already committed to a bunch of big things from the manifesto which are far from business as usual neoliberalism. Exact same policies as Corbyn in many cases. That includes the green new deal.

[imitationleather]

Equally I think one of the most derided policies in the manifesto - broadband, was actually one of the best, it was just never explained properly and just made to look like "just another labour freebie" with no understanding of the wider implications for the economy.

Same. Something like that could actually alter the country from following its current course of terminal decline. Which I guess is why it will never ever happen.

[Leo2112]

How to back a policy without backing a policy.

[BlodwynPig]

WE WE WE WE WE WE WE WE

ALL THE FUCKING WAY HOME

[Shoulders?-Stomach!]

Imagine demonstrating your blissful ignorance like this. By your own admission, Labour lost 2.5M votes in less than three years.

It isn't really blissful ignorance is it when I'm posting knowledge that you then rely on yourself. Maybe you'd like to construct a post that makes sense, or preferably just fuck off.

[Shoulders?-Stomach!]

He's already committed to a bunch of big things from the manifesto which are far from business as usual neoliberalism. Exact same policies as Corbyn in many cases. That includes the green new deal.

Safer to do that 5 years ahead of an election and then find an excuse not to do it. Remember Nick Clegg.

As I said, Blair enacted several positive policies in his first term at a cost of not reforming the Lords, not reforming the press, not reforming market regulation, not taking on the long term enemies that stood against the empowerment of the working class.

Does anyone really think Starmer is going to confront those things or just make deals which heavily compromise Labour and the people they represent?

[NoSleep]

He's already committed to a bunch of big things from the manifesto which are far from business as usual neoliberalism. Exact same policies as Corbyn in many cases. That includes the green new deal.

I don't trust him like you do. He can say all he wants. As RLB implied, it was dodgy that he sprung ready to stand almost immediately after Corbyn said he was standing down, and had his campaign group all prepared from the off, presumably because (unlike RLB) he was spending time he should have been campaigning for a Labour GE victory, preparing for them to fail.

[Scrapey Fish]

I don't trust him like you do. He can say all he wants. As RLB implied, it was dodgy that he sprung ready to stand almost immediately after Corbyn said he was standing down, and had his campaign group all prepared from the off, presumably because (unlike RLB) he was spending time he should have been campaigning for a Labour GE victory, preparing for them to fail.

This was in no way a leadership campaign video:

https://labourlist.org/2019/11/rebecca-long-bailey-unveils-new-logo-in-campaign-video/

[NoSleep]

Not exactly equivalents; having a team and campaign all set up and ready to go from the off and asking someone to do a logo of one's name in standard Labour-style graphics. RLB has apologised for taking a while to get up to full speed for her leadership bid because she wasn't prepared. Doesn't seem to have taken Starmer by surprise in quite the same way. And the video is a GE manifesto ad by one of its architects.

[DeadJefferson]

It isn't really blissful ignorance is it when I'm posting knowledge that you then rely on yourself. Maybe you'd like to construct a post that makes sense, or preferably just fuck off.

Hahaha.  It's blissful ignorance if you refuse to acknowledge exactly why Labour lost the last election. They're talking about you, you know.

[holyzombiejesus]

What report are these images from?

[Leo2112]

What report are these images from?

The report put together by former deputy chairman of the Conservative Party Lord Ashcroft.

[Shoulders?-Stomach!]

Ah an image of a lost of disparate quotes that sound exactly what the pollster would write down if you handed them a pen.

Shitting my pants mate.

Shitting them.

Obviously all the right wing ghoul trolls are helping out of the goodness of their hearts.

[jobotic]

Again Paulie, the Tories didn't win the election because they deserved to then, with their fine policies and leadership? Its all down to Labour's failings. What are we, the natural party of government or something?

[holyzombiejesus]

The report put together by former deputy chairman of the Conservative Party Lord Ashcroft.

Ah, thank you.

[DeadJefferson]

What report are these images from?

From the Lord Ashcroft report. It was put together by professional pollsters and statisticians, it just has his name on it. Of course, if you're a stupid mouthbreather, you'll dismiss it out of hand for that fact alone, but that doesn't stop it from being reasonably accurate, as far as these things can be.
Of course, there are always the Opinium polls.

[holyzombiejesus]

Ooh, "professional pollsters and statisticians"! That's impressive. Haha!

[greencalx]

Just back from our nomination meeting. Was expecting Starmer / Murray but got Nandy / Murray instead. RLB got only 16 votes, which surprised me as a number of people near me gave me the impression they were voting for her.

[pigamus]

So this Newsnight thing was shit, was it? Were they all shit? Can't be arsed watching it.

What's this "zinger" that Thornberry is supposed to have come out with? Is it bollocks?

[Johnny Yesno]

'People don't want to be told they're idiots for considering voting conservative.'

The truth hurts.

[jamiefairlie]

'People don't want to be told they're idiots for considering voting conservative.'

The truth hurts.

Yeah but it's not wise to hurt people who can hurt you even more.

[NoSleep]

Time is on our side, then.

[thugler]

I don't trust him like you do. He can say all he wants. As RLB implied, it was dodgy that he sprung ready to stand almost immediately after Corbyn said he was standing down, and had his campaign group all prepared from the off, presumably because (unlike RLB) he was spending time he should have been campaigning for a Labour GE victory, preparing for them to fail.

Do you not see how you are doing the exact same thing so many did to Corbyn? Guilt by association and vague 'i don't trust him' type sentiment. Presumably he had his campaign ready to go because it was obvious internally that we were going to lose. Arguably even with a hung parliament he should still have gone due to suxh a huge number of people giving him as the reason for not voting labour.

[phantom_power]

From the Lord Ashcroft report. It was put together by professional pollsters and statisticians, it just has his name on it. Of course, if you're a stupid mouthbreather, you'll dismiss it out of hand for that fact alone, but that doesn't stop it from being reasonably accurate, as far as these things can be.
Of course, there are always the Opinium polls.

So that says that Brexit and Corbyn were the issues and that the policies weren't much of a problem. With Brexit DONE! and Corbyn gone that is great news for Labour and reason to stick with the manifesto as laid out in the conference. It seems people didn't believe Corbynism was an actual thing and just didn't think he was PM material, which may be right or wrong but is by the by now

[Armin Meiwes]

Also, hate to be cynical but who do we actually think is more likely to be electorally successful (ie the thing we all want).. someone who is ready and prepared for opportunities in advance [but in a way that did not undermine Corbyn!] or someone who cocks up their launch because they were massively underprepared.. the latter might make them a more decent person but what labour needs is someone that can win (and with most of the policies people want to see put in place).

[NoSleep]

Do you not see how you are doing the exact same thing so many did to Corbyn? Guilt by association and vague 'i don't trust him' type sentiment. Presumably he had his campaign ready to go because it was obvious internally that we were going to lose. Arguably even with a hung parliament he should still have gone due to suxh a huge number of people giving him as the reason for not voting labour.

It isn't the same though. Corbyn spoke openly about anything you asked him in a way that was exceptional for a politician. He was outstanding in this way. Starmer is a standard brand political suit.

[NoSleep]

Also, hate to be cynical but who do we actually think is more likely to be electorally successful (ie the thing we all want).. someone who is ready and prepared for opportunities in advance [but in a way that did not undermine Corbyn!] or someone who cocks up their launch because they were massively underprepared.. the latter might make them a more decent person but what labour needs is someone that can win (and with most of the policies people want to see put in place).

You don't seem to understand what's at stake here. Corbyn, or more accurately, Corbyn's supporters were a revolution in British politics and we should continue to build on what has been started. Turning back is closing a book on one of the greatest opportunities to have arrived in a lifetime. There has never been anything like this in the UK and we shouldn't lose out because of the fainthearted; it's never going to get easier.

Though cowards flinch and traitors sneer, we'll the red flag flying here.

[Blinder Data]

It is ridiculous that a chunk of the PLP suggests that they would leave Labour if RLB is elected leader.

Similarly, it is ridiculous that a chunk of Corbyn supporters are suggesting basically the same thing if anyone but RLB is elected leader. Whoever wins deserves the membership's full support.

[Replies From View]

Honestly at this point in the cycle who is most "electable" is basically just guessing isn't it.

Not least because we have no idea what kind of presence the electorate will deem valuable five years from now.  There is no unchanging universal concept of "electable" that we should continually aspire to, and anyone saying there is must be pushing an agenda.

[Lordofthefiles]

"We need to win (at all cost)" = "I want me Brexit"


The best thing for Labour is to Keep Left at the minute.
Unless something incredible happens in the next 5 years, the Tories, Establishment and media will steamroller the next election as they did this time.

The people in this country require a revolution of the mind, 10 years of totalitarian rule will see the majority of the populace on their knees begging for socialism.
If socialism has been reduced to a small(ish) breakaway party by then its got no chance.

RLB and Burgon need to be elected just to keep the rudder steering in the right direction.


If you would like to win at all costs, or disagree with what Corbyn stood for and the policies in the 2019 manifesto, I'd suggest you start supporting the Tories like the rest of the selfish, shortsighted CUNTS in the U.K.