Going apeshit at unisex bogs

[Shoulders?-Stomach!]

Just been witnessing a guy going apeshit at the bartender (who I'm pretty sure wasn't involved in the design of the bar) about the presence of unisex toilets.

To set the scene, there is a sign saying toilets, you open that, and then there is a room with various doors labelled Toilet, each of which contains a marvellous crap removal engine system called a toilet, and an equally marvellous water pumping system for hygiene which dispenses it into a marvellous water storage vessel called a sink.

But apparently IT AIN'T RIGHT and IF IT GETS BUSY YOU WON'T SEE ME IN HERE

I don't really understand this precise concern though. Many bars have 1 toilet for everyone. These one has several for anyone. There isn't even a unisex sink area (which I understand some terf's have confected bizarre angles of attack for like 'what if I am needing to wash my moon cup in the sink'). Everyone basically has a private compartment within which to piss, shit, bleed, cum and vomit in.

What's the issue there, on any level?

Anyway, the bartender slightly blotted his record in my book by placating this guy by mildly agreeing with him. He was up by one as you hardly ever see British Asians working in bars in Leeds, so fair play, but down one by mollifying some bigoted dweeb.

[Shit Good Nose]

Having been involved with the building of new academy schools, lots of them have gone down the unisex route (all cubicles, no urinals).  I'm not sure of the particular reasons behind it as the costs are pretty much the same, but I can understand girls (who are almost certainly less likely to have a shit at school than boys) not really being keen on the idea of having a dainty wee whilst some smelly teenage boy in the next cubicle is curling out a routine teenage boy shit.  And possibly having a wank at the same time.

Obviously that's a slightly different situation than the one given here.

I TOTALLY get "fully accessible" non-gender specific toilets but, I must admit, the idea of open fully unisex toilets is an odd one.  It's a very American idea I think.  I'm sure there are sensible reasons for it.

Not that I'd go apeshit mind - I've had wees in a couple of unisex toilets.  Never had a shit in one though.

[imitationleather]

Glinner to thread, Glinner to thread

[Ferris]

Just been witnessing a guy going apeshit at the bartender (who I'm pretty sure wasn't involved in the design of the bar) about the presence of unisex toilets.

To set the scene, there is a sign saying toilets, you open that, and then there is a room with various doors labelled Toilet, each of which contains a marvellous crap removal engine system called a toilet, and an equally marvellous water pumping system for hygiene which dispenses it into a marvellous water storage vessel called a sink.

But apparently IT AIN'T RIGHT and IF IT GETS BUSY YOU WON'T SEE ME IN HERE

I don't really understand this precise concern though. Many bars have 1 toilet for everyone. These one has several for anyone. There isn't even a unisex sink area (which I understand some terf's have confected bizarre angles of attack for like 'what if I am needing to wash my moon cup in the sink'). Everyone basically has a private compartment within which to piss, shit, bleed, cum and vomit in.

What's the issue there, on any level?

Anyway, the bartender slightly blotted his record in my book by placating this guy by mildly agreeing with him. He was up by one as you hardly ever see British Asians working in bars in Leeds, so fair play, but down one by mollifying some bigoted dweeb.

And how is graham linehan?

[gilbertharding]

Having been involved with the building of new academy schools, lots of them have gone down the unisex route (all cubicles, no urinals).  I'm not sure of the particular reasons behind it as the costs are pretty much the same, but I can understand girls (who are almost certainly less likely to have a shit at school than boys) not really being keen on the idea of having a dainty wee whilst some smelly teenage boy in the next cubicle is curling out a routine teenage boy shit.  And possibly having a wank at the same time.

Obviously that's a slightly different situation than the one given here.

I TOTALLY get "fully accessible" non-gender specific toilets but, I must admit, the idea of open fully unisex toilets is an odd one.  It's a very American idea I think.  I'm sure there are sensible reasons for it.

Not that I'd go apeshit mind - I've had wees in a couple of unisex toilets.  Never had a shit in one though.

I could look up precisely which part of the Approved Documents of the Building Regulations it's in (I design buildings including schools and churches for a living) - but I can confirm that if you're providing such unisex facilities, you have to have full height walls and proper doors - not just cubicles.

The last church I designed (Methodist) had four such toilets, each with its own basin, and two 'accessible' (what used to be called disabled) toilets - one of which also had an accessible shower in it.

There are all sorts of reasons for deciding to have unisex facilities. It can save on the total floor space you need to allocate for them, for instance.

[Lisa Jesusandmarychain]

1980s version of The Four Tops consider rewrite.

[Ray Travez]

Glinner to thread, Glinner to thread

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0z_Qqnq8pI8

[Shit Good Nose]

I could look up precisely which part of the Approved Documents of the Building Regulations it's in (I design buildings including schools and churches for a living) - but I can confirm that if you're providing such unisex facilities, you have to have full height walls and proper doors - not just cubicles.

The last church I designed (Methodist) had four such toilets, each with its own basin, and two 'accessible' (what used to be called disabled) toilets - one of which also had an accessible shower in it.

There are all sorts of reasons for deciding to have unisex facilities. It can save on the total floor space you need to allocate for them, for instance.

Oh yeah, they were (are) all floor to ceiling doors and walls (although the walls didn't touch the ceilings, there was a gap of a few inches at the top to allow for smoke detection and such) - I should have called them "traps".

In the schools cases it wasn't floor space as there was a massive space in between the rows of traps with double sided sinks and driers and a thick low wall separating the sinks but, as you allude to, there will be other reasons.  My bit was only sorting out power and water, so I never got the full picture.

[greenman]

Having been involved with the building of new academy schools, lots of them have gone down the unisex route (all cubicles, no urinals).  I'm not sure of the particular reasons behind it as the costs are pretty much the same, but I can understand girls (who are almost certainly less likely to have a shit at school than boys) not really being keen on the idea of having a dainty wee whilst some smelly teenage boy in the next cubicle is curling out a routine teenage boy shit.  And possibly having a wank at the same time.

Obviously that's a slightly different situation than the one given here.

I TOTALLY get "fully accessible" non-gender specific toilets but, I must admit, the idea of open fully unisex toilets is an odd one.  It's a very American idea I think.  I'm sure there are sensible reasons for it.

Not that I'd go apeshit mind - I've had wees in a couple of unisex toilets.  Never had a shit in one though.

I would imagine the main idea is to even up use, more cubicles for women than would be the case with separate male/female blocks although most of the time I'v seen though its a row of separate individual rooms each with their own sink not leading off of some larger room.

[Shit Good Nose]

I would imagine the main idea is to even up use, more cubicles for women than would be the case with separate male/female blocks although most of the time I'v seen though its a row of separate individual rooms each with their own sink not leading off of some larger room.

As someone who has ALWAYS been gun-shy at urinals, I applaud the use of cubicles or traps over urinals and troughs.  I always opt for a cubicle whenever possible, and have been known to go for holding onto it over standing at a busy trough.  Future bladder infections here I come.

[king_tubby]

Northern Monk taproom by any chance?

[gilbertharding]

Yep, that's definitely true (about evening up the practical numbers of bogs available).

I think also there's a kind of 'self policing' idea - The Kids might be less likely to hang around getting up to bullying and smoking and etc etc if they're mixed.

I mean, I 'm sure that was a reason I read once... it might have been something someone decided would work in theory.

Doesn't sound very fair on the kids, if that's the idea.

[jobotic]

Doesn't it avoid massive queues for the ladies while men are pissing all over the floor of the gents?

[Paul Calf]

Unisex toilets are a godsend for those who wish to do a bit of beak. Security staff can't see in.

[Shit Good Nose]

Yep, that's definitely true (about evening up the practical numbers of bogs available).

I think also there's a kind of 'self policing' idea - The Kids might be less likely to hang around getting up to bullying and smoking and etc etc if they're mixed.

I mean, I 'm sure that was a reason I read once... it might have been something someone decided would work in theory.

Doesn't sound very fair on the kids, if that's the idea.

The flip-side of that though, and something that always crossed our minds in these schools, is that it would encourage..."shenanigans", especially with there being no gaps.  But equally that's just adult supposition and, in reality, probably doesn't encourage it any more than separate loos and normal cubicles.

[Cuellar]

Hang on why are girls less likely to have a shit at school than boys?

[bgmnts]

Because girls don't poo thats disgusting.

[Shoulders?-Stomach!]

Northern Monk taproom by any chance?

Ha, no. Those have shared sinks. I can understand why anyone would feel uncomfortable having a shit there mind. The cubicles look like they cost about £1.75 and the absence of plop-absorbing acoustics is merciless.

[imitationleather]

Hang on why are girls less likely to have a shit at school than boys?

Because they're worried about Lisa Stansfield stalking the school corridors on the search for more samples to add to her frozen turd dildo collection.

[Shit Good Nose]

Hang on why are girls less likely to have a shit at school than boys?

That was always the case when I was at school.  Admittedly I'm just making an assumption based on 25+ year old experience but, without exception, ALL of my female friends refuse to have a shit at work or in public loos, whereas very few of my male friends care either way.

I cherry pick - no problem with shitting at work, will do one in decent shop toilets, but rarely in pubs and supermarkets.

Because they're worried about Lisa Stansfield stalking the school corridors on the search for more samples to add to her frozen turd dildo collection.

That too.

[Sebastian Cobb]

As someone who has ALWAYS been gun-shy at urinals, I applaud the use of cubicles or traps over urinals and troughs.  I always opt for a cubicle whenever possible, and have been known to go for holding onto it over standing at a busy trough.  Future bladder infections here I come.

Having been at events where there's a massive queue for lots of portaloos, then a small trailer that can allow more men to piss in a much smaller space thus freeing the cubicles , there is something to be said for efficiency.

Perhaps places where customers come in waves and space may be a premium (eg venues or theatres) a room with unisex cubicles and a room of urinals is the best way to reduce congestion.

Or just make your existing areas unisex and have a sign that signifies what lies behind. *


*if you're doing this please use brevity.

[Shit Good Nose]

Or just make your existing areas unisex and have a sign that signifies what lies behind. *


*if you're doing this please use brevity.

"Mate, go steady - shit and piss all over the floor, snots and spunk on the walls and taps.  Mate.  Also 20p to get in."

[phantom_power]

  It's a very American idea I think.

I would say it was a very European idea. Unisex toilets have been pretty normal in France and that since forever

[Sebastian Cobb]

I was at the academy recently and the bog attendant was hovering outside looking perturbed . Turns out someone was doing a smell.

[gilbertharding]

Hang on why are girls less likely to have a shit at school than boys?

Don't know - but a few years ago I was designing a big sports hall, dining hall and classroom block for an all girls school in South London.

In a meeting during construction the contractor was asking for more details about the showers in the changing rooms (not THAT kind of detail - what sort of drain, what sort of mixer valve etc). After the discussion had gone on for a while, one of the school governors piped up, "This is a girl's school: almost no-one is ever going to use these showers."

Don't know what they meant, but I remembered my own school days when an 'after-games shower' meant running as fast as possible through the communal shower while the teacher watched for some reason and hoping the other boys would laugh at someone else that week.

[Shit Good Nose]

I would say it was a very European idea. Unisex toilets have been pretty normal in France and that since forever

Interesting.  First time I ever saw one was in San Francisco.  Never saw one in France despite holidaying there lots, but then the only "public" loos I ever used over there were in the hypermarkets, and although they had the same entrance (typically manned by an old lady sat on a chair who took your 10centimes [or whatever it was] entrance fee), the men and ladies were still always separate.

Tell you what - NEVER complained about paying to go into hypermarket toilets.  Absolutely spotless, nothing was broken, the flushes flushed properly and there was always soap and hand towels.

[gilbertharding]

I would say it was a very European idea. Unisex toilets have been pretty normal in France and that since forever

My defining memory of public toilets in France was in the Musee D'Orsay a few years ago, where women were queuing out the door for their bogs to the point where lots of them were simply, and as if it were the most normal thing in the world, walking into the Gents to use the cubicles which were free because 80% of the men only wanted a slash.

In this country there are quite complicated formulas for calculating the number and types of facilities you need to provide - based on the average/maximum capacity of the building, and whether or not everyone is likely to want the toilet at the same time (eg during the interval in a theatre). The calculation even weighs the different average length of time taken by men and women to spend a penny or two, IIRC.

Of course - this only works for new buildings...

[Shit Good Nose]

My defining memory of public toilets in France was in the Musee D'Orsay a few years ago, where women were queuing out the door for their bogs to the point where lots of them were simply, and as if it were the most normal thing in the world, walking into the Gents to use the cubicles which were free because 80% of the men only wanted a slash.

Happens all the time at concert venues.  To seasoned gig goers - male and female - it is absolutely the most normal thing in the world.  If the queue for the ladies is a mile long and the gents cubicles are mainly ignored, then it makes sense.

But then, equally, mens toilets are usually in a much worse state, because most of us men are dirty, don't seem to be able to aim properly, don't bother flushing, and think it's fine to break the seat.

Sorry - airing a few of my public loo bugbears.

[imitationleather]

When I went to see Flying Lotus at the Roundhouse the ladies was empty because that music is for lonely male nerds and so I went in and a woman followed me and kicked the cubicle door open. As by that point I had my cock out she had just made it all seem a lot worse than it needed to.

[gilbertharding]

Happens all the time at concert venues.  To seasoned gig goers - male and female - it is absolutely the most normal thing in the world.  If the queue for the ladies is a mile long and the gents cubicles are mainly ignored, then it makes sense.

But then, equally, mens toilets are usually in a much worse state, because most of us men are dirty, don't seem to be able to aim properly, don't bother flushing, and think it's fine to break the seat.

Sorry - airing a few of my public loo bugbears.

I'm not an expert in ladies toilets, but my wife assures me that they're frequently appalling.

My defining memory of the bogs at gigs was seeing the JaMC at Brixton Academy in about 1994. There was quite a queue, which someone had decided to jump by pissing in the sink. The reason this was so striking was because without any effort at all on my part I could see his entire penis - which was pierced - in the mirror.