Author Topic: winning the lottery  (Read 4036 times)

Re: winning the lottery
« Reply #60 on: February 11, 2020, 09:12:50 PM »
Would a bank give you a mortgage on the strength of that? They should, it's more guaranteed than any wages.




Fucking right they would, guaranteed income for 30 years. They'd do anything to get every penny of it.

Re: winning the lottery
« Reply #61 on: February 11, 2020, 09:49:08 PM »
have you been tinkering with my lambo?
listen to the radio, don't you remember

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Re: winning the lottery
« Reply #62 on: February 12, 2020, 09:06:03 AM »
Wouldn't a ten horse accumulator be loads worse? The vig* on the lottery is 50%. Now, say it's 15% on a random horse race, wouldn't the overall return on a 10 horse accumlator be 85% of 85% of 85% to the power of 10, making it much worse than the lottery?

Yeah, you're right. You'd need to use oddsmatching software to get some decent matches- Betfred do a few boosts every day which are plus EV, so if you incorporated them that would help. But not as simple as I'd first imagined.

Re: winning the lottery
« Reply #63 on: February 12, 2020, 09:36:16 AM »
Fucking right they would, guaranteed income for 30 years. They'd do anything to get every penny of it.

Yup. Plus, even though it's £120k/year, there's no tax to be paid on the prize (you pay the tax on the stake), so it's actually the equivalent of being on a £206k/year gross salary. Guaranteed. Banks would be falling over themselves to give you mad low interest rates fixed for the full term.

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Re: winning the lottery
« Reply #64 on: February 12, 2020, 09:51:51 AM »
Yup. Plus, even though it's £120k/year, there's no tax to be paid on the prize (you pay the tax on the stake), so it's actually the equivalent of being on a £206k/year gross salary. Guaranteed. Banks would be falling over themselves to give you mad low interest rates fixed for the full term.

Is it right that you don't pay tax on lottery income?! And would banks really be that arsed about being able to offer a low interest rate? What's in it for the bank lads?

icehaven

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Re: winning the lottery
« Reply #65 on: February 12, 2020, 09:53:14 AM »
I got five numbers on the Wednesday lottery a few years ago. The prize was in the region of £1200 which me and Mrs TTT blew on a new dishwasher and cooker for her and a spiffing winter coat for myself. The remainder went on a slap up dinner out where I didn't have to stint by choosing the second cheapest bottle of wine on the list.

I remember I had to take the ticket to a post office as largish amounts won are obviously not paid out from your local shopkeepers till. It was paid in the form of a National Lottery branded cheque which caused the bank tellers eyes to light up when I paid it in.

My wife pointed out that had we got one more number we would have been richer to the tune of 1.4 Million though I pointed out that had it been one less we would have gotten £75.

I knew someone who got either 4 or 5 numbers and won a similar amount, and she was devastated because (real definition of probability aside) as far as she was concerned that meant her odds of winning the jackpot now were all but gone. Although that has happened:

https://www.national-lottery.co.uk/life-changing/winner-euromillions-breaking-news

And they aren't the only ones. You'd think once you won a lot you'd stop playing it, wouldn't you?

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Re: winning the lottery
« Reply #66 on: February 12, 2020, 10:30:57 AM »
four more chances to win this week: normal lottery and "thunder ball" tonight, then TWO entries in Set For Life on thursday. i am so excited and cannot wait to be filthy rich.

Re: winning the lottery
« Reply #67 on: February 12, 2020, 01:20:23 PM »
Is it right that you don't pay tax on lottery income?! And would banks really be that arsed about being able to offer a low interest rate? What's in it for the bank lads?

The near-guarantee that you won't be remortgaging with another lender five years down the line and that you're statistically highly likely to blow it all like a massive idiot somewhere down the line and be unable to keep up repayments so they get to repossess the property with a massive increase in value.

There is no income tax to be paid on a lottery payout as tax has already been paid on the stake. The only time tax comes into play is when dealing with the banking system and gifting large sums. Obviously, you'll be paying tax on any interest past £5,000. Camelot set you up with a special bank account to pay your winnings into, but I don't know what kind of tax/interest arrangements they have going on.

If you wanted to give someone a large sum of money they would have to pay tax on it as income. So, if I were to give you £2m from a Euromillions win, you'd have to self assess and pay the Inland Revenue £885,000 in income tax. When you figure that in, it's little surprise that families can be torn apart by a lottery win.

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Re: winning the lottery
« Reply #68 on: February 12, 2020, 01:32:11 PM »
The near-guarantee that you won't be remortgaging with another lender five years down the line and that you're statistically highly likely to blow it all like a massive idiot somewhere down the line and be unable to keep up repayments so they get to repossess the property with a massive increase in value.

There is no income tax to be paid on a lottery payout as tax has already been paid on the stake. The only time tax comes into play is when dealing with the banking system and gifting large sums. Obviously, you'll be paying tax on any interest past £5,000. Camelot set you up with a special bank account to pay your winnings into, but I don't know what kind of tax/interest arrangements they have going on.

If you wanted to give someone a large sum of money they would have to pay tax on it as income. So, if I were to give you £2m from a Euromillions win, you'd have to self assess and pay the Inland Revenue £885,000 in income tax. When you figure that in, it's little surprise that families can be torn apart by a lottery win.

Once upon a time, a long time ago, one way around that was to pay off other peoples' debts (i.e. mortgages, loans, HP and that) without any tax burden on either party.  But I am going back about 20 years.  Is that, or something like it, still doable under current regs?  (Like I'm ever going to win enough to be able to do that - as I said earlier in the thread, I'd have to play it first...)

icehaven

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Re: winning the lottery
« Reply #69 on: February 12, 2020, 01:55:08 PM »
The near-guarantee that you won't be remortgaging with another lender five years down the line and that you're statistically highly likely to blow it all like a massive idiot somewhere down the line and be unable to keep up repayments so they get to repossess the property with a massive increase in value.

There is no income tax to be paid on a lottery payout as tax has already been paid on the stake. The only time tax comes into play is when dealing with the banking system and gifting large sums. Obviously, you'll be paying tax on any interest past £5,000. Camelot set you up with a special bank account to pay your winnings into, but I don't know what kind of tax/interest arrangements they have going on.

If you wanted to give someone a large sum of money they would have to pay tax on it as income. So, if I were to give you £2m from a Euromillions win, you'd have to self assess and pay the Inland Revenue £885,000 in income tax. When you figure that in, it's little surprise that families can be torn apart by a lottery win.

Once upon a time, a long time ago, one way around that was to pay off other peoples' debts (i.e. mortgages, loans, HP and that) without any tax burden on either party.  But I am going back about 20 years.  Is that, or something like it, still doable under current regs?  (Like I'm ever going to win enough to be able to do that - as I said earlier in the thread, I'd have to play it first...)

Yeah couldn't you just buy them whatever they wanted and pay off their debts rather than giving them the money? And if you want to give someone actual cash, set up a separate bank account in your own name, deposit the amount you want to give them into it then give them the details and card so they can use it?

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Re: winning the lottery
« Reply #70 on: February 12, 2020, 02:15:07 PM »
Just give them the money and pay the tax. Fairs far, have to pay for The Bridge to Ireland somehow.
« Last Edit: February 12, 2020, 02:48:59 PM by FerriswheelBueller »

Re: winning the lottery
« Reply #71 on: February 12, 2020, 02:46:32 PM »
Once upon a time, a long time ago, one way around that was to pay off other peoples' debts (i.e. mortgages, loans, HP and that) without any tax burden on either party.  But I am going back about 20 years.  Is that, or something like it, still doable under current regs?  (Like I'm ever going to win enough to be able to do that - as I said earlier in the thread, I'd have to play it first...)

[tag]Slick Rick considers rewrite[/tag]

I suppose you could. It would need for the lender to not pay too much attention to the source of the payment. Our mortgage lender required that we pay ours from one of the accounts they audited for affordability, for instance, so we'd be unable to exploit such a loophole. On the other hand, I once paid off a loan from my partner's account and the woman on the end of the phone didn't seem arsed.

And if you want to give someone actual cash, set up a separate bank account in your own name, deposit the amount you want to give them into it then give them the details and card so they can use it?

That's money laundering and fraud. And you'd really, really need to trust the person you'd given the account to because they can do a lot of dodgy stuff in your name.

Another thing worth bearing in mind is  that if you bought someone something as a gift, if you were to die within seven years of the gift being made, the gift would then be subject to inheritance tax. So if you were to buy your brother a £500k house (ie, buy the property and transfer the deeds over for gratis) and then snuff it five years later, your brother would be hit with a tax bill for £70,000.

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Re: winning the lottery
« Reply #72 on: February 12, 2020, 03:05:12 PM »
Another thing worth bearing in mind is  that if you bought someone something as a gift, if you were to die within seven years of the gift being made, the gift would then be subject to inheritance tax. So if you were to buy your brother a £500k house (ie, buy the property and transfer the deeds over for gratis) and then snuff it five years later, your brother would be hit with a tax bill for £70,000.

Does the old "peppercorn rent" trick get around that one, or does the snuffing still result in inheritance tax regardless?


I'm only asking out of interest - none of this will ever even be something for me to consider as an option.

Re: winning the lottery
« Reply #73 on: February 12, 2020, 03:25:25 PM »
Does the old "peppercorn rent" trick get around that one, or does the snuffing still result in inheritance tax regardless?

Seven year rule still applies, even with renting.

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Re: winning the lottery
« Reply #74 on: February 12, 2020, 03:30:44 PM »
It seems like a lot of effort to win the lottery (not to mention the admin after) so I think I’m going to give it a miss

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Re: winning the lottery
« Reply #75 on: February 12, 2020, 03:33:36 PM »
It seems like a lot of effort to win the lottery (not to mention the admin after) so I think I’m going to give it a miss

Indeed. I'll never complain about how complicated it is to sign on ever again.

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Re: winning the lottery
« Reply #76 on: February 12, 2020, 03:47:33 PM »
pretty obvious HB is just trying to talk us all out of winning the lottery so he gets to win it the most out of everyone. pathetic, transparent and greedy tactics. to think i once considered him my best friend.

icehaven

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Re: winning the lottery
« Reply #77 on: February 12, 2020, 04:16:35 PM »

That's money laundering and fraud.


How is it money laundering? And who's being defrauded, the Inland Revenue?

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Re: winning the lottery
« Reply #78 on: February 12, 2020, 04:28:48 PM »
There's an old rumour that Adam Woodyatt (Ian Beale out of EastEnders, a serial television drama on BBC 1) scooped a massive win some years ago. That doesn't seem fair.  When will he get time to spend it?

There was also Tony Lambert keyboard player of the Irish folk band, The Saw Doctors who made a decent win on the Irish Lottery. He said he used to receive sacks of begging letters; many of them with just "Saw Doctor, Ireland' scrawled on the envelope,

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Re: winning the lottery
« Reply #79 on: February 12, 2020, 05:02:30 PM »
So did he choose to remain anonymous and got outed or did he choose to go public?

Re: winning the lottery
« Reply #80 on: February 12, 2020, 05:16:34 PM »
How is it money laundering? And who's being defrauded, the Inland Revenue?

You're moving money around to disguise who really owns it in order to avoid paying tax. And you'd be defrauding the Inland Revenue and the bank.

Re: winning the lottery
« Reply #81 on: February 12, 2020, 05:24:59 PM »
Your chances are better if you play the lottery in a bookies, if you get up to 4 numbers you can win 5 grand cause those are the odds statistically. If you get those numbers playing the actual lottery you would be lucky to get a fiver  back.

I know someone who had a win on the Irish Lotto.

My mum worked as a nurse in a health centre in Dublin treating people who were in palliative care, there was a lovely friend/colleague who was the most lovely decent kind and understanding lady you could meet.
When she retired as a gift she got a scratch card that won and entered her into the Winning Streak TV programme a bit like the British Lotto

She was picked out and went on the show, then went on to win 20 grand, spinning the wheel.
 Everyone who knew her was so happy for her.
« Last Edit: February 12, 2020, 05:35:42 PM by NoOffenceLynn »

icehaven

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Re: winning the lottery
« Reply #82 on: February 12, 2020, 06:17:51 PM »
You're moving money around to disguise who really owns it in order to avoid paying tax. And you'd be defrauding the Inland Revenue and the bank.

You're not really disguising who owns it though, you still openly own it, you're just letting someone else spend it. Or does that still count? And if it does what's the lower limit? If I give someone one of my bank cards and tell them to withdraw a tenner and buy themselves a nice dinner are we committing fraud?

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Re: winning the lottery
« Reply #83 on: February 12, 2020, 06:20:30 PM »
Then I suspect it counts as a gift and probably not declarable under a certain limit per year (so your lunch is alright). You’d technically be committing fraud against your bank as you are the only person authorized by them to use that card though.

That would be the setup in North America anyway, don’t do UK finance but they’re usually pretty similar.

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Re: winning the lottery
« Reply #84 on: February 12, 2020, 06:24:10 PM »
Casanova was the one who introduced the lotto to Europe, and he made a mint from it.  He then pissed it away gambling and paying off conquests he'd knocked up/moved on from.

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Re: winning the lottery
« Reply #85 on: February 12, 2020, 06:37:01 PM »
The world contains accountants and therefore the method to which you can get around exposing yourself to tax liability.

And the good news? You won the lottery so maybe the first thing you should do if you're a total cunt is hire the services of one so you can effectively defraud public services and state infrastructure.

Re: winning the lottery
« Reply #86 on: February 12, 2020, 06:39:16 PM »
There's an old rumour that Adam Woodyatt (Ian Beale out of EastEnders, a serial television drama on BBC 1) scooped a massive win some years ago. That doesn't seem fair.  When will he get time to spend it?


The character of Ian Beale won in EastEnders, so Adam Woodyatt(the human) turned up to collect the cheque in character and the lottery were none the wiser so have gave him the winnings.

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Re: winning the lottery
« Reply #87 on: February 12, 2020, 06:43:36 PM »
The character of Ian Beale won in EastEnders, so Adam Woodyatt(the human) turned up to collect the cheque in character and the lottery were none the wiser so have gave him the winnings.

Fair's fair though because EastEnders have been making out his paychecks to Ian Beale for decades and so he has been unable to cash them. Woodyatt ended up so skint that he had to keep buying drugs on tic from the guy who plays Nick Cotton, plying the guy who played Martin Fowler with them until he was so addicted and deep in debt that Woodyatt was able to force him to go on the game to pay him back. Effectively since 1998 his main income has been from pimp earnings.

The lottery money corrected the imbalance and also paid for a nice stint in rehab for James Alexandrou. Everyone's happy and it's all nice and legal.

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Re: winning the lottery
« Reply #88 on: February 12, 2020, 06:45:59 PM »
Insert Ibiza Big Potatoes vid here.

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Re: winning the lottery
« Reply #89 on: February 12, 2020, 06:53:52 PM »
There is no income tax to be paid on a lottery payout as tax has already been paid on the stake.

Paying tax on the stake is nothing to do with it. In the UK, all gambling winnings are tax free, whatever the source. In a private poker game, money will change hands with absolutely no tax being paid on any part of it, and it's all legal.

Quote
If you wanted to give someone a large sum of money they would have to pay tax on it as income. So, if I were to give you £2m from a Euromillions win, you'd have to self assess and pay the Inland Revenue £885,000 in income tax.

Completely false. As you later said, if the gifter dies within 7 years inheritance tax is payable, but that's the extent of the liability.

You're moving money around to disguise who really owns it in order to avoid paying tax. And you'd be defrauding the Inland Revenue and the bank.

That's not what money laundering is. Money laundering is disguising the source of money that is the proceeds of crime to make it appear legitimately acquired. And how are the bank being defrauded? What is their loss?

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