You Are Forgiven...?

[machotrouts]

Why is it the weekly Separating The Art From The Artist thread every forum has is always about paedophiles and not Rachel Riley on Countdown

[Shit Good Nose]

Because CaB is obsessed with nonces.

[massive bereavement]

Seeing that I've enjoyed work created by people who support Manchester United (Morrissey included), I don't think there's anything anybody could do or say which would be put me off something I'd previously thought worthwhile.

If you happen to be a victim, or something closely related to their crime, then obviously it makes sense but otherwise I just don't get it at all. Looks to me as though you're wrestling with your conflicted feelings or opinion which has very little to do with the people in question.
Anybody who doesn't like The Who is clearly a massive nonce.

[Elderly Sumo Prophecy]

Still waiting for Townshend's book on noncery to come out.

[machotrouts]

I really miss watching Countdown

[Cerys]

I think The Lost Prophets has to be way beyond the pale now. See how people get cancelled for racist language and stuff? This guy raped babies who would've been screaming in pain. If you can happily listen to this vermin's work now then you need to take yourself away from a position of moralising about anything.

There were another five or six people involved in the writing and performance of that song, none of whom were baby-raping cuntbeasts.  As I said, if he were a solo artist I would probably consign it to the cancelled reaches of my former playlists.  As it is, I still love the song.  My knowledge of the man whose voice I hear on it can't stop it being a great piece of music.

[buttgammon]

I really miss watching Countdown

Haha, yes - same here. I do wonder if I'm becoming more sensitive with age, but saying that I still like Woody Allen films.

[Poirots BigGarlickyCorpse]

There were another five or six people involved in the writing and performance of that song, none of whom were baby-raping cuntbeasts.  As I said, if he were a solo artist I would probably consign it to the cancelled reaches of my former playlists.  As it is, I still love the song.  My knowledge of the man whose voice I hear on it can't stop it being a great piece of music.

I'm the other way - it's because he's the singer. For some reason I find it easier to divorce the song from a musician because the singer is usually the frontman. Idk, it's like if the drummer or a guitarist did this heinous shit I can pretend it's someone else playing on the track but because it's the singer - I'm listening to a child molester. No judgement btw, just explaining my own train of thought.

And now I'm going to check out No Devotion.

[solidified gruel merchant]

There were another five or six people involved in the writing and performance of that song, none of whom were baby-raping cuntbeasts.  As I said, if he were a solo artist I would probably consign it to the cancelled reaches of my former playlists.  As it is, I still love the song.  My knowledge of the man whose voice I hear on it can't stop it being a great piece of music.

I wasn't replying to you specifically there, Cerys. Just saw The Lost Prophets being mentioned and thought I'd fart out my views on the matter.
Not having been a fan I can't say for certain, but having struggled with Iannucci since he dissed Corbyn I don't think I'd be able to listen to any of their songs now. I mean, he was the frontman!!

[Famous Mortimer]

Still waiting for Townshend's book on noncery to come out.

I made this mistake too, which at least makes me believe that this was the way the story was reported for a while. He wasn't doing it to research a book, but for a campaign about how easy it was to access that sort of thing. This campaign does seem to be rather quiet / non-existent, mind.

[peanutbutter]

It varies hugely, check out all these responses for some kind of consistency:

Cosby is very hard to stomach now cos his whole act depends so much on you buying him as likeable, but it's not as if I didn't know the shit about him years before it blew up either, it's his response to it that made it too hard to separate him from his work. If he had died without ever being confronted I may have felt very differently. Not sure if its just the strength of the allegations or his material just being too dated but I'm not sure there's even anything to mine from his material of value now at all.

CK currently doesn't work for me, but if he owned his shit in the right way I feel like he could absolutely dig himself out of the hole he's in with me. He's never gonna be the adored guy of liberals everywhere that he was but he never should've been that anyway.

If anything I might like Ansari a bit more now that his total lack of self awareness has been exposed. It's easier to deal with the con when I don't feel like everyone's buying it.

I frequently cite Polanski as the example of why guys like Aronofsky suck, seemingly crediting the kind of visceral unpleasantness he was able to achieve as being part and parcel of him being a fucking awful person, this seems like a bad take...

Langham always comes across as a totally fucked up human being, as far as I'm aware he never used his position or status to do anything awful (correct me if I'm wrong here though) so I'm totally okay still enjoying his work, although I've no real issues with his career being totally dead either.

Woody Allen never was an issue for me, but I wonder if I was alive before all the Soon Yi stuff if I'd've thought he was a likeable person and would the subsequent revelations colour my opinion of him and his work as a result.

[Famous Mortimer]

Perhas it's to do with how much of a person's public persona is tied to them being a decent person?

Also, re: the renaissance painters, if we're still talking about Louis CK in the 24th century, then I think it'll be fair for people then to just judge the quality of the work, not the quality of the person.

[Cuellar]

I haven't been able to watch an episode of Lewis since that Question Time debacle.

[Voltan (Man of Steel)]

I haven't been able to watch any WWII documentaries since I heard about Churchill's questionable views.

[Cerys]

I had problems watching Aquaman after finding out that Amber Heard is a husband-beating cunt.

[dissolute ocelot]

I had problems watching Aquaman after finding out that Amber Heard is a husband-beating cunt.

Bearing false witness against your husband is pretty much the worst thing in the Bible.

On the other hand, I'm running a one-person campaign to remind everybody how shit a human being George Orwell was, so nobody has to read his terrible books any more. (Liar, anti-semite, misogynist, would-be rapist, betrayed friends...)

[JesusAndYourBush]

I really like the "Manson Family sing the songs of Charles Manson" album, but that's not quite the same as we knew he was a bad lad when the album was first released, it's not like he had an exemplary career and then did something wrong sometime later.

[Cerys]

Would.

[weekender]

I'll be honest, I find some of Adolf Hitler's paintings to be really quite good.  Here's one as an example:



I don't know what he was thinking when he painted them, and that's arguably where I sometimes get confused with art interpretations.

I'm looking at this one thinking "That looks like a lovely place to take a dog for a run", and he was probably thinking "If I'm going to have to annex most of Europe, how the
Scheiße am I doing to deal with these sodding mountains?".

I still like it as a picture though.

For the avoidance of doubt he did other things I don't agree with.

[idunnosomename]

i could do that

[Shit Good Nose]

i could do that

Always about sex with you.

[weekender]

I don't think I could watch Langham in stuff now. Help! I'd love to see again, but.... nah, it would just depress me I think.

Help is a strange watch with hindsight, but it does prove that both Langham and Whitehouse are both brilliant comedy performers.

I can watch Langham in 70s stuff now and feel that it's OK, but what was he going through when him and Whitehouse were making Help 20 years later?  When did he - as a celebrity - cross what I consider to be a line?

Good thread, interesting discussion, I don't know the answers. 

I can probably upload Help if anyone's interested.

[moondogs]

To me that just sounds like a guitarist 1) who is jealous of a bassist that is a better musician technically, 2) wants a simple and unfussy foundation to play over, and 3) was driven up the wall by trying to battle with someone whose job should just be to drive the band (also cf. Robert Fripp and David Cross [ostensibly King Crimson's lead players from late 1972 to 1974] being overwhelmed on stage by their rhythm section of John Wetton and Bill Bruford).

Don't get me wrong - Pino Palladino is absolutely no slouch on the bass, but he is something of a journeyman session musician and as such customises his playing, style and tone to whatever he is paid to do.


Anyway, sorry - going a bit off topic there.

I think that's a little harsh. Palladino is in such demand as a session player due to his talent and versatility. He is a titan of the bass and in a different league to Townsend. Journeyman session player? The guy has played at the very highest level over the past 30 odd years for divers players both on the stage and in the studio, and continues to be one of the world's top first-call bassists.

[moondogs]

And he's not an uphill gardener.

[PlanktonSideburns]

Anybody who doesn't like The Who is clearly a massive nonce.

so pete townsend for one then

[Shit Good Nose]

I think that's a little harsh. Palladino is in such demand as a session player due to his talent and versatility. He is a titan of the bass and in a different league to Townsend. Journeyman session player? The guy has played at the very highest level over the past 30 odd years for divers players both on the stage and in the studio, and continues to be one of the world's top first-call bassists.

You've misunderstood me - as I said, he is "absolutely no slouch".  I used "journeyman" in the sense of him being a versatile hired gun session player, and adapting his style to whatever is required/he's being paid for.  So Townsend probably said to him "you know what John did with all those complicated runs and thundering power?  Don't do that and play more normal rooting bass, yeah?"