Doctor Who Series 12B: The Timeless Chibnall (Xmas special & pre-Series 13 chat)

[Replies From View]

Not the main thing to take from this - but as a side issue, that's a fair whack of the Eccleston/Tennant Era never to be shown on TV again then.

This is true.  Fingers crossed for Barrowman to be a tricksy dicksy as well then, so that the Chibnall years can be similarly swept asunder.

[Ambient Sheep]

Re. Barrowman, just stumbled across this:

https://twitter.com/ConductorKelly/status/1387850341211938819

Given that Eccleston is known to dislike Barrowman, and that we all know that Chris left because he felt that the people on the show weren't being looked after properly, I'm now thinking that maybe it wasn't just about flaming sofas, etc....


EDIT: And this: https://twitter.com/RassilonP/status/1387896765660139521

[Norton Canes]

Would it be implausible to say the ramifications of this could both bring down RTD, and give the BBC an excuse to rest Doctor Who?

[JamesTC]

It makes too much money to rest it.

[Mr Trumpet]

They're not going to can the show on the basis of dodgy stuff that may have happened years ago under a different team, both front and behind camera. I know they've brought Barrowman back in a bit recently, but until stories come out about him that are worse than him playing puerile pranks on his colleagues I think it'll just be Captain Jack who gets a rest and not the series as a whole.

[Jerzy Bondov]

Bet it annoys Barrowman so much that he never got the chance to put his cock on the Matt Smith and Peter Capaldi TARDIS consoles.

[Thomas]

Capaldi would've severed it with a swift chop of Venusian aikido.

Barrowman has always been deeply bitter about Moffat (which is funny considering that Moffat invented and wrote the best iteration of the character in the first place):



MAXIMUM SPEC-U-LATION: Moffat has claimed that he wanted to feature Captain Jack in A Good Man Goes to War, and that they were nixed by scheduling - but it's not hard to imagine that a showrunner might have other reasons for wanting to keep Barrowman off their set. You're responsible for all these actors in their early 20s, and suddenly you introduce a 45-year-old bloke who's pretty much guaranteed to flash them and tap them on the head with his dick. I'd leave him out, too. Especially if it was one of the factors contributing to Eccleston's unhappy departure.

But perhaps it was only down to scheduling.

[BritishHobo]

There's a truly bizarre clip here from a convention, where Noel Clarke's imitation of Barrowman's cock-exploits goes on for so long that it begins to feel dodgy in its own right - before he goes on to upset the whole audience by suggesting Barrowman got away with his behaviour because he's gay:

https://mobile.twitter.com/The66Ramblers/status/1140999393274814464

[M-CORP]

There was this spat between Moffat and Barrowman a few years back, when Barrowman basically encouraged fans to bombard Moffat with hate mail by implying he was blocking a new Torchwood series. At worst, an entitled git.

https://www.thesun.co.uk/tvandshowbiz/1831888/im-quite-cross-torchwood-boss-steven-moffat-slams-john-barrowmans-claims-he-is-blocking-the-return-of-the-sci-fi-show/

If I'd been Moffat, who was very clearly and rightly pissed off in his statement, I'd have just had my revenge by mentioning the allegations there and then.

(Perhaps awkwardly, there are currently rumours of a new Torchwood series.)


A lot of people also wondering if this was anything to do with Eccleston leaving and how much RTD knew.

I will mention something that's stuck with me since I saw it on the 2009 specials DVD.

Comic Con 2009.

A panel featuring David Tennant, Julie Gardener, Euros Lyn and Russell T Davies.

Someone asks:
'We heard John Barrowman stole bits off the TARDIS set. What have you guys stolen from the TARDIS?'

Julie responds:
'I think the only reason John Barrowman stole things was so he could be strip searched on the way out.'

Very telling reactions from ALL the panellists.

As can be seen at the start of this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TaDdWW2RmaI

[BritishHobo]

Wasn't Noel Clarke supposed to join Torchwood at some point, as well? Sure someone mentioned in an interview or something that he and Freema were meant to be in series 2or 3, and the Martha/Mickey relationship would have been more developed there.

Really interested in the sort-of venemous way Barrowman refers to Moffat in these quotes. I remember him being quite angry about not coming back for the 50th special as well, even though nobody else did either, really.

[Huxleys Babkins]

Wasn't Noel Clarke supposed to join Torchwood at some point, as well? Sure someone mentioned in an interview or something that he and Freema were meant to be in series 2or 3, and the Martha/Mickey relationship would have been more developed there.

Yes, Clarke and Freema Agyeman were supposed to be in the "series 3" that eventually became Children of Earth. Agyeman was tied up with Law & Order UK so couldn't do it.

[frajer]

Agyeman was tied up with Law & Order UK so couldn't do it.

Clarke soon to be similarly entangled.

[Kelvin]

Not related to this grotty stuff, but I had to laugh at this Moffat quote in that article:

"For the record, I really liked [Torchwood] (especially the third series) and would be very happy to see more – monsters and mayhem, why not?"

A (presumably unintentional) slight of Chris Chibnall, there.

[JamesTC]

"For the record, I really liked Torchwood (especially the series that wasn't shit)"

[Replies From View]

It makes too much money to rest it.

How the fuck are ten episodes every eight years written by an unscrupulously shit man making any money whatsoever.  It barely even counts as tokenistic these days.

[JamesTC]

How the fuck are ten episodes every eight years written by an unscrupulously shit man making any money whatsoever.  It barely even counts as tokenistic these days.

I don't really understand it if I'm honest. The Simpsons would apparently make less money if it wasn't airing new episodes despite the fact that it costs so much to make and they already have hundreds of episodes to repeat ad infinitum.

I guess they make new dolls with all the new characters that Chibnall churns out. But at the same time the Classic Who Blu-ray releases and stuff like Time Lord Victorious show you can easily cash in on the older series without any new episodes to fuel it. I guess the thinking is that the money from the new series stuff and the money from the old series stuff are kind of independent of each other and one wouldn't go up or down without the other.

[Huxleys Babkins]

Moffat had sod-all money for the 50th which is why it's mostly three blokes chatting in a gallery, a dungeon and a barn. Not sure where Barrowman saw himself in that setup. Maybe his knob could have been the big red button.

[Blofelds Cat]

Final episode of Noel Clarke drama `Viewpoint` pulled by ITV

https://entertainment-focus.com/2021/04/30/itv-pull-final-episode-of-noel-clarke-series-viewpoint/

[Thomas]

Barrowman's made the Independent:

https://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/tv/news/john-barrowman-doctor-who-noel-clarke-b1840218.html

The article cites just the one video - the widely circulated one of Noel Clarke's reenactment - but there are so many clips and interview snippets out there. Barrowman himself has gleefully recounted his dick-tapping, and James Marsters has spoken about his slightly horrified bemusement at the behaviour on Torchwood:

So I'm sitting on the first day on this set and I'm looking at John thinking, 'okay, I'm gonna kiss John, okay.' And he starts grabbing his cast members, the girls, and I mean by the boobs! And they're like, 'stop it, I don't wanna play today' and he keeps doing it. [...] And so I decided that I needed to communicate that I was not into this, so I leaned over to the actress that was getting all groped, her name was Naoko, and I said, 'Naoko, man, there's a little elbow jab in the back that'll stop him in his tracks, or just stomp him with your heel on the top of his foot and break two or three bones and that'll stop him. Or, you can sneeze when he's behind you, achoo!' (James snaps back his head suddenly) [...] They are all used to each other and this was a typical day for them, and John sort of went to himself, 'oh, okay.' He's not that comfortable with himself.

Barrowman's proclivities even appear in song-form in the cast's farewell tune to RTD and Julie Gardner, and they're mentioned in RTD's book (he hopes that Barrowman keeps his 'trousers zipped up' in the presence of Lis Sladen).

I foresee a sombre statement shot in portrait mode. But will he use his Scottish or American accent?

[BritishHobo]

Makes me wonder if there is a little undercurrent of irritation in Noel Clarke's impression of him in that clip, and that's why he's so relentless with it. He certainly feels that Barrowman gets away with stuff because of his sexuality, and he even makes a joke about how straight guys would be jealous that they can't get away with it.

[Replies From View]

I don't really understand it if I'm honest. The Simpsons would apparently make less money if it wasn't airing new episodes despite the fact that it costs so much to make and they already have hundreds of episodes to repeat ad infinitum.

I guess they make new dolls with all the new characters that Chibnall churns out. But at the same time the Classic Who Blu-ray releases and stuff like Time Lord Victorious show you can easily cash in on the older series without any new episodes to fuel it. I guess the thinking is that the money from the new series stuff and the money from the old series stuff are kind of independent of each other and one wouldn't go up or down without the other.

Even assuming it's all mostly now about shifting merchandise I can't see what really exists apart from a few cosplayers getting the latest sonic screwdriver long long after the show had any vitality and generated any excitement.

I work in a primary school and I can confirm that Doctor Who has no presence for any of the children I work with.  Think about this:  for anyone now near the end of their final year of primary school (10-11 years old), the most recent series was over a year ago.  Series 11, the first with Jodie Whittaker, aired in late 2018, when they were at the start of their fourth year of primary school (aged 8-9).  Series 10, Capaldi's final series, aired in the middle of 2017, as these children were reaching the end of their second year (aged 6-7).  Capaldi's second series, broadcast in late 2015, would have met these children at the start of their first year of primary school (aged 5-6).  Matt Smith and the energy around the 50th anniversary wouldn't even be known to them.

Think of how much of a span of time that is in the mind of a child, and like me you might struggle to appreciate how any child can have a meaningful relationship with Doctor Who now.  And with it, doubt that children have any interest in the show's action figures.  So who could be buying them in sufficient quantities to make Doctor Who still profitable enough to keep making?  I'm genuinely baffled.

[Replies From View]

Moffat had sod-all money for the 50th which is why it's mostly three blokes chatting in a gallery, a dungeon and a barn. Not sure where Barrowman saw himself in that setup. Maybe his knob could have been the big red button.

Press it for subtitles and gossip!

[JamesTC]

Even assuming it's all mostly now about shifting merchandise I can't see what really exists apart from a few cosplayers getting the latest sonic screwdriver long long after the show had any vitality and generated any excitement.

I work in a primary school and I can confirm that Doctor Who has no presence for any of the children I work with.  Think about this:  for anyone now near the end of their final year of primary school (10-11 years old), the most recent series was over a year ago.  Series 11, the first with Jodie Whittaker, aired in late 2018, when they were at the start of their fourth year of primary school (aged 8-9).  Series 10, Capaldi's final series, aired in the middle of 2017, as these children were reaching the end of their second year (aged 6-7).  Capaldi's second series, broadcast in late 2015, would have met these children at the start of their first year of primary school (aged 5-6).  Matt Smith and the energy around the 50th anniversary wouldn't even be known to them.

Think of how much of a span of time that is in the mind of a child, and like me you might struggle to appreciate how any child can have a meaningful relationship with Doctor Who now.  And with it, doubt that children have any interest in the show's action figures.  So who could be buying them in sufficient quantities to make Doctor Who still profitable enough to keep making?  I'm genuinely baffled.

I think we even commented on here less than a year ago that it seemed that Tennant was the current Doctor.

I dunno, I fucking loath Chibbers and the fact that he gets his bilge on the air but it does seem life merchandise ramps up when new episodes air. Some people are buying these children's toys.

[Huxleys Babkins]

They leave it running on fumes because it does really well for BBC Worldwide on syndication. Same reason they kept Top Gear going after Clarkson was sacked.

[Blofelds Cat]

The merchandise for Who has dropped---my local Forbidden Plant used to have a whole wall and half of the shop devoted to Who---now its a shelf approx 2ft wide...

the latest DWM has zero Jodie Whitaker content---tbh all the better for it--but this would have been unthinkable in Eccles/Tennant/Smith era...

That first episode of Whitakers the audience was there---they just didn`t like what they saw--viewing figures have dropped steadily---if the show was competently written and acted then it would have taken off again---all those kids that have been lost are watching Marvel and Star Wars...RTD never had that sort of competition--that`s why you need a show runner who is skilful and adept at capturing new and existing viewers with clever scripts and plots---you were never going to get that with Chinball...

[Deanjam]

Top twitter trends in the UK right now. A grim trio with quite the punchline.

[Ambient Sheep]

Wow.

[Pauline Walnuts]

Now that's a real hiding Behind A Sofa Moment




There's no way they'll go ahead with the new series with John Barrowman in it, will they?

[JamesTC]

There's no way they'll go ahead with the new series with John Barrowman in it, will they?

Aren't they already a fair way into filming?

Maybe they could re-shoot all his scenes with a new character called Admiral Mac who is a time travelling man from the future who can't die.

[Thomas]

It'll take longer for Chibnall to find a fag packet than it will to rewrite the entire series on the back of it.