Author Topic: Government coronavirus response thread  (Read 25239 times)

Fambo Number Mive

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Government coronavirus response thread
« on: March 25, 2020, 12:25:49 PM »
Corbyn is doing a good job of holding the government to account in PMQs, unlike most of the media.

I thought it might be worth having a thread for discussion of the government's venal response to the coronavirus. They have seen what has happened in many other countries and have left lockdown far too late and have allowed lots of non-essential businesses e.g. hand car washes to carry on. They should be bringing in a windfall tax on the UK's super-rich to bring in UBI for all and ensuring the self-employed don't lose money during the lockdown.

They also need to stop playing politics with the Tube network and make it easier to keep non-essential workers off public transport.

Re: Government coronavirus response thread
« Reply #1 on: March 25, 2020, 12:48:49 PM »
Can't believe that airports are still operating, seemingly as normal, including shitloads of flights from Italy. Mental.

Fambo Number Mive

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Re: Government coronavirus response thread
« Reply #2 on: March 25, 2020, 02:40:59 PM »
Quote
Off-licences have been added to the government's list of essential UK retailers allowed to stay open during the coronavirus pandemic.

The list was updated on Wednesday amid increasing reports of supermarkets are selling out some beers and wines...

Not sure how to feel about this, I suppose many people are addicted to alcohol so it helps them get their "fix", but I don't think people should have to go into work to sell booze to people.

Re: Government coronavirus response thread
« Reply #3 on: April 11, 2020, 12:36:22 PM »
The incompetence of these people while thousands are dying:

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The lengthy absence of Johnson’s chief aide Dominic Cummings, who is also battling the virus, has naturally added to the vacuum of political leadership, with no certainty over when he will return. Several government advisers told BuzzFeed News they had not heard from Cummings for some time, after he developed symptoms of COVID-19 12 days ago. His absence has created confusion over who is in charge on the political side, according to senior officials.

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A minister told BuzzFeed News: “There have been many competing command structures. No10, government departments, especially DHSC, NHS national level leadership, NHS trusts, Public Health England and groups of academic experts inside government. They are not integrated clearly, there is no real sense of who is in charge, they each have their own interests and they have spent weeks contradicting each other. I would be surprised to see Public Health England continue in its current form after this.”

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One Whitehall insider said they thought the relationship between Downing Street and the civil service was beyond repair. “Number 10 advisers think the civil service are a bunch of wets who failed to prepare and got us into the worst crisis since World War 2. The civil service thinks Number 10 advisers are a load of idiots and lunatics who shouldn’t be anywhere near power.”

https://www.buzzfeed.com/alexwickham/coronavirus-health-politics-economics-johnson-cummings

Re: Government coronavirus response thread
« Reply #4 on: April 11, 2020, 12:39:20 PM »
Alex Wickham, ugh.

There are no negatives about silence from Cummings - i hope he's gravely ill - but the rest is troubling.

finnquark

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Re: Government coronavirus response thread
« Reply #5 on: April 11, 2020, 12:54:41 PM »
Working Towards The Fuhrer doesn't work when the Fuhrer isn't around.

Re: Government coronavirus response thread
« Reply #6 on: April 11, 2020, 12:58:52 PM »
Blows all the misfits and weirdos, nudge unit, obsession with data out of the water. Data doesn't make decisions.

Johnny Yesno

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Re: Government coronavirus response thread
« Reply #7 on: April 11, 2020, 01:16:09 PM »
A lockdown wasn't taken seriously by the government until they perceived that the predicted number of deaths would be unacceptable to the general public:

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-britain-path-speci/special-report-johnson-listened-to-his-scientists-about-coronavirus-but-they-were-slow-to-sound-the-alarm-idUSKBN21P1VF

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As they watched China impose its lockdown, the British scientists assumed that such drastic actions would never be acceptable in a democracy like the UK. Among those modelling the outbreak, such stringent counter-measures were not, at first, examined.

“We had milder interventions in place,” said Edmunds, because no one thought it would be acceptable politically “to shut the country down.” He added: “We didn’t model it because it didn’t seem to be on the agenda.

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“The revision was that, basically, estimates of the proportion of patients requiring invasive ventilation, mechanical ventilation, which is only done in a critical care unit, roughly doubled,” [Neil Ferguson] said.

Edmunds had a different explanation for the policy shift.

What allowed Britain to alter course, said Edmunds, was a lockdown in Italy that “opened up the policy space” coupled with new data.

This article was mentioned on Record Deaths: Media Shrugs: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iFL7yY0ye_A

Fambo Number Mive

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Re: Government coronavirus response thread
« Reply #8 on: April 11, 2020, 01:29:11 PM »

Re: Government coronavirus response thread
« Reply #9 on: April 11, 2020, 02:41:37 PM »
Data doesn't make decisions.

He does in TNG sometimes.

Sebastian Cobb

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Re: Government coronavirus response thread
« Reply #10 on: April 11, 2020, 02:48:49 PM »


Dan Hodges really is quite thick isn't he?

Fambo Number Mive

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Re: Government coronavirus response thread
« Reply #11 on: April 11, 2020, 03:01:36 PM »
"negatively shift the narrative" don't you mean hold the Government to account as is essential in a democracy, Dan.

Wonder how Hodges would be reaching if Corbyn had won the election and was dealing with the pandemic (no doubt in a much better way than the Tories, we wouldn't have had this herd immunity crap for one thing).

Re: Government coronavirus response thread
« Reply #12 on: April 11, 2020, 03:04:06 PM »
i am convinced dan hodges really has no idea how he's an establishment stooge and is genuinely the dumbest fucker alive

Re: Government coronavirus response thread
« Reply #13 on: April 11, 2020, 03:35:17 PM »
Nearly a thousand deaths a day is a strategy that’s working?

Fambo Number Mive

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Re: Government coronavirus response thread
« Reply #14 on: April 11, 2020, 06:03:59 PM »
Quote
During questions, Ms Patel was pressed several times on whether she would apologise to NHS workers who have complained about a lack of protective equipment.

She responded that she was "sorry if people feel there have been failings" and repeated that answer when asked to clarify if she was apologising.

buttgammon

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Re: Government coronavirus response thread
« Reply #15 on: April 11, 2020, 08:06:38 PM »
"If you felt offended by my actions, I am truly sorry", said Mr Hitler as he responded to questions about his treatment of minority groups.

Re: Government coronavirus response thread
« Reply #16 on: April 11, 2020, 08:48:01 PM »
A lockdown wasn't taken seriously by the government until they perceived that the predicted number of deaths would be unacceptable to the general public:

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-britain-path-speci/special-report-johnson-listened-to-his-scientists-about-coronavirus-but-they-were-slow-to-sound-the-alarm-idUSKBN21P1VF

Quote
“The revision was that, basically, estimates of the proportion of patients requiring invasive ventilation, mechanical ventilation, which is only done in a critical care unit, roughly doubled,” [Neil Ferguson] said.

So the previous number, before it doubled, was perceived to be acceptable - presumably because it was in the same ballpark as the number of people already killed by their austerity policies, which doesn't seem to have stopped people voting for them.

Re: Government coronavirus response thread
« Reply #17 on: April 11, 2020, 09:18:28 PM »
priti patel says that three hundred thousand, thirty four, nine hundred and seventy four thousand tests have been carried out so far. sounds like loads! well chuffed.

Re: Government coronavirus response thread
« Reply #18 on: April 12, 2020, 09:16:23 AM »
priti patel says that three hundred thousand, thirty four, nine hundred and seventy four thousand tests have been carried out so far. sounds like loads! well chuffed.

Twenty thousand, one hundred and one are currently hospital.

That's a lot of people converted into hospitals and so a tremendous volunteering effort so far.

Re: Government coronavirus response thread
« Reply #19 on: April 12, 2020, 11:07:12 AM »


That is just shite journalism though and deserves the shit response. Why aren’t the media asking the 241 NHS CEOs why some trusts are doing well with good stocks of PPE and supply chains and pandemic disaster plans, while other trusts have well and truly fucked this right up.

Fambo Number Mive

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Re: Government coronavirus response thread
« Reply #20 on: April 12, 2020, 04:23:43 PM »

Fambo Number Mive

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Re: Government coronavirus response thread
« Reply #21 on: April 12, 2020, 06:30:34 PM »
Published today by Buzzfeed


Quote

Hundreds of logistics operators capable of delivering “millions” of boxes of personal protective equipment have been waiting weeks for direction from the government, BuzzFeed News has learned.

Health workers fighting the coronavirus pandemic continue to report critical shortages of crucial items, including in pharmacies and care homes, prompting the government to call in the Army for help. Some hospitals and local councils may now be taking the matter into their own hands — going directly to the private market to ask about the availability of equipment and essential goods, procurement data suggests.

Last week, health secretary Matt Hancock said that “the quantity of the stuff is not the problem with PPE,” but the process of delivering protective equipment from warehouses and into the hands of health workers posed “one of the biggest logistical challenges of peacetime”.

Yet over 1500 Logistics firms and haulage companies from across the UK have put their names forward saying they stand ready to help NHS Supply Chain, according to a database reviewed by BuzzFeed News...

https://www.buzzfeed.com/richholmes/coronavirus-uk-volunteers-equipment-delay?ref=hpsplash

Fambo Number Mive

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Re: Government coronavirus response thread
« Reply #22 on: April 12, 2020, 06:31:12 PM »
That is just shite journalism though and deserves the shit response. Why aren’t the media asking the 241 NHS CEOs why some trusts are doing well with good stocks of PPE and supply chains and pandemic disaster plans, while other trusts have well and truly fucked this right up.

Which trusts are doing well?

Re: Government coronavirus response thread
« Reply #23 on: April 13, 2020, 06:08:01 AM »
Which trusts are doing well?

I’ve got 6 relatives who work in 3 different East Midlands nhs trusts and are reporting that all is well and prepared for. They have high functioning senior staff and procurement fortunately. One is treating a lot of cv19 cases and the other 2 not so much.

I have another relative in the West Midlands working for a trust that has had the army deployments to sort out logistics. She is incredibly grateful as her senior management have always been crap and ill prepared. Chatting with the army officers apparently a massive warehouse full of PPE was not being used as it was too far away and the trust had also forgot they needed to stockpile locally. Also 30 % of the masks etc were being nicked by staff. She is very glad the army are sorting this out but really pissed off that the ceo will be able to blame it on the government and avoid scrutiny yet again.

All anecdotal so take it or leave it. Sadly I think little lessons will be learned in the post cv19 rush to score political points.

Norton Canes

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Re: Government coronavirus response thread
« Reply #24 on: April 13, 2020, 11:48:27 AM »
The BBC starts to break ranks


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UK government criticised as death toll passes 10,000

Criticism of the UK government's response to coronavirus is growing after one of its top scientific advisers said the country was likely to be among the worst affected in Europe.

The warning from Sir Jeremy Farrar came as UK hospital deaths passed 10,000 on Sunday.

Sue Hill, vice-president of the Royal College of Surgeons, said she believed UK deaths could rise to 30,000.

"Cabinet ministers are standing up every day, addressing us as if we’re on a war footing and giving Churchillian quotes when they could be doing a few simple things like getting more bits of plastic and paper [personal protective equipment for medical staff] on to wards,” Hill said.

Professor John Ashton, a former public health director, called on the government to be "completely honest", as the recorded number of deaths being put out is only those who have died in hospital, and does not include deaths in care homes and in the community.

"There's a lot of worry now on social media that we're not being given the full picture. People need to be treated like adults," he said.

Dozens of NHS workers are known to have died so far, with doctors who came out of retirement, as well as a disproportionate number of workers from black, Asian and ethnic minority backgrounds among those who have lost their lives.

The government faced serious criticism early on in the spread of the pandemic in the UK, after messages from officials led to confusion over the strategy being pursued, and the country was relatively slow to shut down non-essential businesses and public gatherings.

Inspector Norse

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Re: Government coronavirus response thread
« Reply #25 on: April 13, 2020, 11:51:44 AM »
Lucy Allan (who you may remember from such stories as faking death threats against herself) with a Twitter zinger this weekend:

https://mobile.twitter.com/lucyallan/status/1249006439038935043

People, real live people, actually voted this woman into a position of political authority.

Fambo Number Mive

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Re: Government coronavirus response thread
« Reply #26 on: April 13, 2020, 12:03:11 PM »
I think it's worth reminding people of this story from 2017: https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/watch-moment-tories-cheered-blocking-10707293

Re: Government coronavirus response thread
« Reply #27 on: April 13, 2020, 12:45:12 PM »
how would anyone read that Keir tweet and surmise it criticises the NHS at all

Zetetic

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Re: Government coronavirus response thread
« Reply #28 on: April 13, 2020, 12:49:01 PM »
Partly a product of how the English NHS (i.e. the healthcare system as a whole, in England, with hospitals and GPs and so on) brands itself "the NHS" and has an organisation within it called "NHS England".

NHS England is sort-of extension of the UK Government's Department of Health and Social Care, really, that enacts Government policy on the English NHS.

Johnny Yesno

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Re: Government coronavirus response thread
« Reply #29 on: April 14, 2020, 03:02:49 PM »
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/apr/14/coronavirus-uk-ireland-delay

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At the time of writing, 365 people have died in Ireland of Covid-19 and 11,329 have died in the UK. Adjusted for population, there have been 7.4 deaths in Ireland for every 100,000 people. In the UK, there have been 17 deaths per 100,000. In other words, people are dying of coronavirus in the UK at more than twice the rate they are dying in Ireland. Yet, despite being your closest neighbour, this has barely been mentioned in the British press.

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More importantly, the daily death toll released by the Irish government includes deaths in nursing homes and the community, whereas the UK daily releases do not. EU figures suggest that half of all deaths may take place in care homes, and their exclusion from the daily UK figures is puzzling. If we adjust the Irish figures so that they match the UK criteria, and include only deaths in hospitals, the differences between us are even more stark. In that calculation, almost three and a half times as many people have died of the coronavirus in the UK as in Ireland.

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