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Government coronavirus response thread

Started by Fambo Number Mive, March 25, 2020, 12:25:49 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

Captain Z

Interesting
choice of words
of the week

Quote from: Jeremy C Hunt"Of course 100,000 is in some ways an arbitrary number but setting a target like that is how you get things done in a big bureaucracy like the NHS," he told BBC Radio 4's Today programme.


Johnny Yesno

https://twitter.com/SteveBakerHW/status/1256312806896365568

Quote from: Steve Baker MP @SteveBakerHW
Few things never cease to amaze me.

One of them is that Dominic Cummings' opponents never learn that he uses controversy over numbers to keep the numbers in the news.

So that the numbers are widely heard by the public.

9:01 PM · May 1, 2020

Johnny Yesno


Bently Sheds

https://twitter.com/NicholasPegg/status/1256377284661051392

Tory bots active on Twitter and all over Facebook Groups.
Obey. Consume. Obey. Do Not Question.

Kelvin

Quote from: Johnny Yesno on May 02, 2020, 02:17:38 PM
https://twitter.com/SteveBakerHW/status/1256312806896365568

He's talking out of his arse, trying to make them seem more in control of events. They missed the target, so there would have been negative press whether they fudged the numbers or not. They might not care, because people may focus on them nearly hitting it, but that's not the same as Cummings actively wanting / creating a controversy over the numbers. That isn't something he could have avoided, all they could do was lean into it.   

Johnny Yesno

Quote from: Kelvin on May 02, 2020, 02:27:46 PM
He's talking out of his arse, trying to make them seem more in control of events. They missed the target, so there would have been negative press whether they fudged the numbers or not. They might not care, because people may focus on them nearly hitting it, but that's not the same as Cummings actively wanting / creating a controversy over the numbers. That isn't something he could have avoided, all they could do was lean into it.   

Oh, I know. These lies are actually good thing not bad like you thought, AAHHHHHH! #NotACult

chveik


Johnny Yesno

Quote from: chveik on May 02, 2020, 02:59:22 PM
I reckon it's time to change that to #NotADeathCult

I think you're right.

Fambo Number Mive


phantom_power

Cummings isn't a genius. He is just a sociopath willing to do what he wants to gain and retain power. Other people then retrofit all that 3d chess bollocks to make it seem like it was all intentional

Zetetic

I'm coming round to the idea that "just lie and don't try to hide it" isn't that complicated a strategy though.

It's a bit of a leap to come to terms with how ineffective most mechanisms to deal with outright falsehoods are, but once you've internalised that, there's not much ongoing genius required.

I suppose I reckon that it's not as purposeful as it's made out, but that it's a general tactic that they've had reinforced works well.

Schmo Diddley

Quote from: phantom_power on May 03, 2020, 10:59:31 AM
Cummings isn't a genius. He is just a sociopath willing to do what he wants to gain and retain power. Other people then retrofit all that 3d chess bollocks to make it seem like it was all intentional

His 'genius' is having 95% of the media acting as his PR team and being a remorseless psychopath willing to do anything to gain and consolidate power. Johnson's celebrity buys him forgiveness and acceptance from the bovine masses which is the perfect cover for Cummings' brand of ruthless disaster capitalism.


Johnny Yesno

Quote from: phantom_power on May 03, 2020, 10:59:31 AM
Cummings isn't a genius. He is just a sociopath willing to do what he wants to gain and retain power. Other people then retrofit all that 3d chess bollocks to make it seem like it was all intentional

The intentionality is trying all the available options at the same time to achieve a desirable outcome. That's the ability his data science gives him. It's technology driven opportunism, basically.

Johnny Yesno

Quote from: Zetetic on May 03, 2020, 11:03:54 AM
I'm coming round to the idea that "just lie and don't try to hide it" isn't that complicated a strategy though.

It's a bit of a leap to come to terms with how ineffective most mechanisms to deal with outright falsehoods are, but once you've internalised that, there's not much ongoing genius required.

I suppose I reckon that it's not as purposeful as it's made out, but that it's a general tactic that they've had reinforced works well.

Yes and it's the realisation of a genuine psychopath.

Quote from: Schmo Diddley on May 03, 2020, 12:19:48 PM
His 'genius' is having 95% of the media acting as his PR team and being a remorseless psychopath willing to do anything to gain and consolidate power. Johnson's celebrity buys him forgiveness and acceptance from the bovine masses which is the perfect cover for Cummings' brand of ruthless disaster capitalism.

That's it. Psychopaths do well when no one tells them to stop.

idunnosomename

lmao sarah vine's picture of here husband on the telly


buttgammon


Johnny Yesno


Norton Canes

I see the UK is rapidly bearing down on Italy's total coronavirus deaths. Expect it'll be a massive headline when we overhaul them.

jobotic

We're gonna fucking smash it! Rule Britannia

Fambo Number Mive

QuoteEmployers will not be required to maintain social distancing of two metres between workers under government proposals to reopen the UK's workplaces.

In one of the draft government strategy papers, seen by the BBC, employers are encouraged to do so where possible but where it's not, additional measures should be considered, it suggests.

These should include additional hygiene procedures, physical screens and the use of protective equipment.

However, the section of the documents marked PPE is currently empty, apart from a promise that "more detail" will follow.

Union leaders have expressed concerns, saying few firms currently have this equipment and efforts to acquire it could see them competing with the NHS for scarce and essential supplies...

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-52524344

QuoteTop scientists are setting up a shadow version of the government's Scientific Advisory Group for Emergencies (Sage), amid concerns about "dangerous" political interference in advice to the government.

Sir David King, a former government chief scientific adviser, has assembled a group of independent experts to look at how the UK could work its way out of the coronavirus lockdown.

He said the 12-strong committee had been created "in response to concerns over the lack of transparency" from Sage.

The body, which will hold its first press conference on Monday, will focus on seven key points, including how testing and tracing can work, and the future of social distancing...

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/coronavirus-sage-dominic-cummings-david-king-a9496546.html

Fambo Number Mive

Tone policing from Matt Hancock: https://twitter.com/DrRosena/status/1257644583158251522

He's replying to a shadow minister who is an actual Dr who has been working in a hospital.


mjwilson

Quote from: Fambo Number Mive on May 05, 2020, 05:24:59 PM
Tone policing from Matt Hancock: https://twitter.com/DrRosena/status/1257644583158251522

He's replying to a shadow minister who is an actual Dr who

She's a fictional character mate

scarecrow

Perhaps Hancock meant skin tone and was being a harmless racist Tory as opposed to the sociopathic murdering kind.

EOLAN

That last line as well by Mr Hancock about keeping the team spirit going. Patronising bullshit and anyway; all successful teams will be eager to challenge everyone within the team to make them successful; rather than just pandering each other with false niceties.

mr. logic

Quote from: EOLAN on May 05, 2020, 06:13:41 PM
That last line as well by Mr Hancock about keeping the team spirit going. Patronising bullshit and anyway; all successful teams will be eager to challenge everyone within the team to make them successful; rather than just pandering each other with false niceties.

Somebody else he who has been watching The Last Dance

Cuellar


Johnny Yesno

Don't give him a hard time. He's got his NHS badge on. What more do you want?

Norton Canes

the BBC again:

Quote
UK death toll passes Italy to be highest in Europe

This is a sobering moment. Italy was the first part of Europe to see cases rise rapidly and the scenes of hospitals being overwhelmed was met with shock and disbelief.

But we should be careful how we interpret the figures.

On the face of it both countries now count deaths in a similar way, including both in hospitals and the community.

But there are other factors to consider.

First the UK has a slightly larger population. If you count cases per head of population, Italy still comes out worse - although only just.

Cases are confirmed by tests - and the amount of testing carried out varies.

The geographical spread looks quite different too - half of the deaths in Italy have happened in Lombardy.

In the UK, by comparison, they have been much more spread out. Less than a fifth have happened in London, which has a similar population to Lombardy.

Then, how do you factor in the indirect impact from things such as people not getting care for other conditions?

The fairest way to judge the impact in terms of fatalities is to look at excess mortality - the numbers dying above what would normally happen.

You need to do this over time. It will be months, perhaps even years, before we can really say who has the highest death toll


How convenient.