Author Topic: BEERS #2 - Beyond the Pale  (Read 74774 times)

Shoulders?-Stomach!

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Re: BEERS #2 - Beyond the Pale
« Reply #1680 on: July 14, 2021, 06:59:20 PM »
Apparently lots of good Czech beers at the reopened Llandoger Trow in Bristol. It was a bit too busy when I visited the other week with England fans, but seems they have Cvikov and Krausened Budvar on tap, among others.

Re: BEERS #2 - Beyond the Pale
« Reply #1681 on: July 14, 2021, 11:38:00 PM »
Being from Bristol the Llandoger is a classic pub steeped in history but not somewhere I'd go for good beer (I remember it being a frequent place for christmas drinks in various admin jobs I had), good to see it stepping up it's offerings as it's a lovely building and just across the road from The Old Duke so you can hear some live jazz performed by old Bristolians if you're lucky.

Shoulders?-Stomach!

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Re: BEERS #2 - Beyond the Pale
« Reply #1682 on: July 20, 2021, 02:32:48 PM »
https://www.goodbeerhunting.com/blog/2021/7/20/pillars-of-tradition-how-a-new-generation-of-brewers-returned-to-decoction-mashing

Why is lager starting to be good again? It always was in places, but we just forgot, due to money and the corporate governance of mass produced lager treasuring profit above all else.

Heritage brewers in the US have shown the way for decades. Go to a German expat town in the Midwest and you'll find someone brewing Dunkels, Helles, Bocks and so on, but it goes further still. The more cutting edge craft brewers are starting to get bored of overclocking the latest juiceboi with pineapple enzymic mouthfeel and instead discovering good lager brewing. In the UK we have seen a natural delay due to our scene being so painfully reactive and uninspired, but it has been coming.

Since about 2015 Helles and the 'Crispy', 'crushable' pale lager has had a shy resurgence with beardos looking around at each other to check whether it's ok to say they enjoyed that lager and realising that yes, it is (at first, providing it was Augustiner Helles). Now everything from horribly sharp North German pilsner like Jever and Schultheiss (which are brewed for chain smokers palletes) to outright macro lager like Bitburger has their fanboys.

We have a glut of Franconian imports and Czech beer coming over from Czech Beer Alliance distributors. UK breweries like Newbarns, Pentrich, Donzoko, Utopian, Triple Point are starting to be known specifically for their lagers. Many of these dive deep into Lagerland (approx Bohemia and Bavaria) for inspiration, which shows they have tasted the magic I and some of you have, and want a piece of the action.

From what I've heard, double decoction is a process with skeptics as to whether it makes a great deal of difference. However when you look at the really great lagers, they nearly all use it. Makes you wonder...

FerriswheelBueller

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Re: BEERS #2 - Beyond the Pale
« Reply #1683 on: July 20, 2021, 03:02:13 PM »
Tremendously jealous of your lager selections, sounds like you have a real roster of stuff to get stuck into.

I think I have the regular macro stuff and 2 (3?) local craft options which are fine.

Started brewing again, and knocked up a pale ale I might cold ferment in the unfinished basement and call it a lager. Will I get away with it?

Re: BEERS #2 - Beyond the Pale
« Reply #1684 on: July 20, 2021, 03:07:52 PM »
As soon as Framconio is normalised among the peados, I'll be onto the next thing. What else is there? I can't have some bearded scumbag with a Pokemon sleeve tattoo lecturing me because they've just had their first Belsen bock. I'll probably just go onto Carling and pre-empt the ironic reclamation by these societal dregs.

phes

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Re: BEERS #2 - Beyond the Pale
« Reply #1685 on: July 20, 2021, 04:10:27 PM »
Since about 2015 Helles and the 'Crispy', 'crushable' pale lager has had a shy resurgence with beardos looking around at each other to check whether it's ok to say they enjoyed that lager and realising that yes, it is (at first, providing it was Augustiner Helles). Now everything from horribly sharp North German pilsner like Jever and Schultheiss (which are brewed for chain smokers palletes) to outright macro lager like Bitburger has their fanboys

The impression I get with Augustiner/Paulaner lager is that for several years it was an almost grudging concession to the popularity of lager. Like a vegetarian option in the year 2000. There will always be one and if you don't cater to them then you might lose the whole group. Those two beers have meant I've been able to keep year-round locals as I mostly drink lager in the summer. But nobody I met or know from these bars drank lager and ale/craft. Really fucking weird how tribal that is and pretty funny that part of what has driven this resurgence (I think) is that lager drinkers adopted micro pubs and craft bars as places they liked and wanted to drink at and owners found that catering for them wasn't actually the hellscape they thought, and that not catering for them would probably bankrupt them.   

Shoulders?-Stomach!

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Re: BEERS #2 - Beyond the Pale
« Reply #1686 on: July 20, 2021, 06:05:43 PM »
As soon as Framconio is normalised among the peados, I'll be onto the next thing. What else is there? I can't have some bearded scumbag with a Pokemon sleeve tattoo lecturing me because they've just had their first Belsen bock. I'll probably just go onto Carling and pre-empt the ironic reclamation by these societal dregs.

Josef Greif Zwickl and about 7 other Framco bottles are on sale at Brownhill & Co, a bar in the city centre. As the owner lives next door to me I reckon he's seen what I'm drinking in the recycling and been "Yeah, need some of that shit - pronto" (Or it could just been on a distribution list for a wholesaler he knows, meh).

I'll eat my hat if this isn't just a happy few years and they don't fade back into total obscurity in the UK (they probably still are very obscure) with only an ardent few hardcorers lecturing the bovine (or hircine, should probably keep this beer related) masses about their quality.

As to what to move onto, refuse to have anything that isn't Polotmavý ležák on tap.

purlieu

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Re: BEERS #2 - Beyond the Pale
« Reply #1687 on: July 20, 2021, 11:23:14 PM »
(Or it could just been on a distribution list for a wholesaler he knows, meh).
Yes, the chap who supplies my local offy said he supplies Brownhill, which would explain why Leeds started getting loads of Franconian beer around the same time as Hinckley did. I wouldn't be surprised if this guy's company is a big reason behind the appearance of this beer across the country, from what I know he supplies a couple of hundred places in the UK.

FerriswheelBueller

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Re: BEERS #2 - Beyond the Pale
« Reply #1688 on: July 21, 2021, 01:15:07 AM »
placeholder for me to post amusing brown ale anecdote when not on oculus

BlodwynPig

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Re: BEERS #2 - Beyond the Pale
« Reply #1689 on: July 21, 2021, 07:08:51 AM »
Got one of those deals with beer52 - must remember to cancel - 10 croatian beers for free (well postage). Was disappointed that they just look and feel (anyone else hate those rough surfaced tinnies?) like they could be from any hipster brewery in the uk or 🇨🇦

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Re: BEERS #2 - Beyond the Pale
« Reply #1690 on: July 21, 2021, 09:39:16 AM »
Were these all from the Garden Brewery?

Croatian brewing has had to be restarted almost from scratch. Unsurprisingly a lot of the new breweries are trend followers rather than trend setters, and to make any money they have to market their products in a different way.

Far more so than in the UK, the main brands Karlovacko, Ozujsko and their parent companies (Heineken, Carslberg etc) have a near total lockout on what is available in the Caffe Bars around Croatia, leaving very little space for small independent breweries to work with. Therefore you're looking at people with money in the major cities and tourists along the coast, both of whom are younger and looking for craft styles like they know from abroad. The price differential is similarly huge, and a grizzled old chain smoker isn't going to give up his £1.70 Ozujsko to try any of these new fangled things.

Zmajska Pivovara do a decent amberish APA, Nova Runda and LAB are just good full stop.

I would say Tomislav, a 7.2% dark ale is probably the best of the barely existing trad middle ground beers, especially when on tap. Pivovara Medvedgrad (Beartown Brewery) in Zagreb do more traditional European styles too and their strong dark one Gricka Vjestica is really good.




purlieu

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Re: BEERS #2 - Beyond the Pale
« Reply #1691 on: July 21, 2021, 03:01:55 PM »
Got one of those deals with beer52 - must remember to cancel - 10 croatian beers for free (well postage). Was disappointed that they just look and feel (anyone else hate those rough surfaced tinnies?) like they could be from any hipster brewery in the uk or 🇨🇦
beer52 is generally modern craft stuff, so yes, this is what you'll be getting from them most of the time, regardless of the particular month's theme.

Shoulders?-Stomach!

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Re: BEERS #2 - Beyond the Pale
« Reply #1692 on: July 21, 2021, 03:20:04 PM »
Just to say that while out in Croatia I was pleased to discover Staropramen featuring regularly. Unexciting normally - that's how bad the standard Croatian lagers are - but a step up.

Then I had some. Immediately thought something was up and checked the label. Brewed in Croatia. Using local water, not even trying to replicate the original Czech flavour and being so inspid it wasn't worth bothering with again.

This was part of a 2 week break and by the end of rotating between the major lagers, with a few moments of respite in Split, Trogir and Dubrovnik I was glad to head over the border to Montenegro and escape them. Mind you, not that Niksicko is much better.

FerriswheelBueller

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Re: BEERS #2 - Beyond the Pale
« Reply #1693 on: July 21, 2021, 03:47:58 PM »
placeholder for me to post amusing brown ale anecdote when not on oculus

Used to live by the province’s flagship liquor store, but it was a quiet area so never anyone in there. I on the other hand was in there a few times a week.

I went through a phase of brown ales, turns out the demand in this store drives the supply decisions for the rest of the province, after a month or two every other liquor store I visited was inundated[1] with brown ale which only really subsided after a couple of years. May have been coincidence I suppose.
 1. ok that’s an exaggeration, but there were tons more of them

Shoulders?-Stomach!

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Re: BEERS #2 - Beyond the Pale
« Reply #1694 on: July 21, 2021, 08:01:15 PM »
Have had a few days off the booze which has been tough in such great weather but it was a heavy weekend.

However, I had a Gutmann Hefeweizen (from Titting!) and there's never been a better day to drink one of those fuckers.

Thought that probably wouldn't be beat, but then Greif-Brau Zwickl comes along to steal the show. Don't ask me what a lump of charcoal that looks like the millennium falcon is doing there:



From Franconia and one of Forchheim's core historic breweries. Forchheim is one of the Lagerland meccas, easily on par with places like Plzen or Bamberg.

This is an aromatic, effervescent, grainy unfiltered pale kellerbier with fresh spice and floral notes that both excites the palette and refreshes, with a slightly drying hop bringing everything to balance.

With all the best Franconian beer we talk about how it tastes organic, still living and evolving which is key to its enjoyment, but also how drinkable the product is. This can be slain. A great example.

Pleased to say it's currently all around the UK thanks to a wholesaler/distributor who deserves knighting.

Greif-Brau's taproom in Forchheim is also a nice place, serving 1 beer, the less exciting Helles from the wooden barrel for around €2 a 500ml serving. They also do a schnitt serving which is a quick release 40% serving with loads of head, for those who want to be on their way in a few minutes. It's usually a rawer experience and at its most refreshing. The room itself, despite initial appearances is actually a bit of a modernist throwback, despite the rustic furniture, and I love the plants (which are also on show at Brauerei Neder's pub down the road). There's a sort of 70s chemistry lab vibe you'll get while you're there.



When you sample this brewery you are delving into the heart of Franconian beer culture. Cheers

BlodwynPig

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Re: BEERS #2 - Beyond the Pale
« Reply #1695 on: July 21, 2021, 08:07:01 PM »
beer52 is generally modern craft stuff, so yes, this is what you'll be getting from them most of the time, regardless of the particular month's theme.

Yes, im not really drinking these days but the zero cost offer was a little treat after weeks of pain and stress.

Shoulders?-Stomach!

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Re: BEERS #2 - Beyond the Pale
« Reply #1696 on: July 21, 2021, 08:22:17 PM »
Yes, im not really drinking these days but the zero cost offer was a little treat after weeks of pain and stress.

What brewery were the Croatian beers from!

BlodwynPig

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Re: BEERS #2 - Beyond the Pale
« Reply #1697 on: July 22, 2021, 07:23:35 AM »
What brewery were the Croatian beers from!

Looks like you said garden brewery. But i think its a mix, didnt check the bottles. I took no joy in drinking the first one. The snacks they included were nice

Norton Canes

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Re: BEERS #2 - Beyond the Pale
« Reply #1698 on: July 22, 2021, 12:37:38 PM »
Thought that probably wouldn't be beat, but then Greif-Brau Zwickl comes along to steal the show


Ordered half a dozen from Beersniffers, along with a couple of their Helles and Schlobberla Lagers.

Can't find a definition/translation for 'Schlobberla', any idea?

Shoulders?-Stomach!

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Re: BEERS #2 - Beyond the Pale
« Reply #1699 on: July 22, 2021, 12:42:45 PM »
Last week I would have had a bottle handy to check. Maybe it's the nickname of the dude on the label.

That one is more of an amber Franconian landbier but quite distinctive.

I see Beersniffers also have Goller and Nikl Brau beers, also, very unusually, Schneider Weisse Kristall which I have rarely if ever seen.


purlieu

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Re: BEERS #2 - Beyond the Pale
« Reply #1700 on: July 22, 2021, 10:45:05 PM »
Ah yes, the Schlobberla is lovely, and has the wonderful Franconian thing of having a silly name. It's the only amber lager my local currently has - they seem to sell out quicker than everything else - so I'm looking forward to having one tomorrow evening.

FerriswheelBueller

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Re: BEERS #2 - Beyond the Pale
« Reply #1701 on: July 22, 2021, 10:52:09 PM »
Started brewing again, and knocked up a pale ale I might cold ferment in the unfinished basement and call it a lager. Will I get away with it?

Mixed ale/lager yeast culture, fermenting at 20c in the (pretty cold) spare bathroom so I’m making my own lager. Take that, import taxes.

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Re: BEERS #2 - Beyond the Pale
« Reply #1702 on: July 23, 2021, 09:38:56 AM »
Mixed ale/lager yeast culture, fermenting at 20c in the (pretty cold) spare bathroom so I’m making my own lager. Take that, import taxes.

Shouting lagerlagerlagerlagerale hybrid

Chollis

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Re: BEERS #2 - Beyond the Pale
« Reply #1703 on: July 24, 2021, 01:11:31 PM »
Desperately trying to shift some pounds at the moment but I still love (alcoholic) beer. These low-calorie beers they have these days, anyone had them? Apparently Tennents does a 3.5% one with only 60 calories per 330ml.

Re: BEERS #2 - Beyond the Pale
« Reply #1704 on: July 25, 2021, 05:49:46 PM »
Enjoying a couple of my favourites this evening, currently swigging a Weißenoher Kloster Spezial/Klostersud and got a few Mahrs aU and Ayinger Urweisse to come.

I do love this Klostersud, it's pretty much all I want in a beer. Could drink the stuff all year round and it would always fit the moment and hit the spot. It's not my favourite by any means but it's such a good beer. I really enjoy the Altfränkisch Klosterbier as well, had a couple of them over the weekend, but I prefer this.

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Re: BEERS #2 - Beyond the Pale
« Reply #1705 on: July 25, 2021, 06:01:40 PM »
Sorry I can't help much with lo-cal beers Chollis, not something I pay much attention to. I imagine certain ones are reasonably ok without making a play of the calorie count.

Tank Pilsner Urquell is back at Headrow House, was nice but an occasion of feeling conspicuously old among the polo shirts, print shorts, shades n sandals. Back to Whitelock's in the bunker where grotesques like me belong.

phes

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Re: BEERS #2 - Beyond the Pale
« Reply #1706 on: July 25, 2021, 06:14:04 PM »
Very mixed weekend of beer. Poor beer at the Brudenell with an unusually scant selection of cask and cans, and dire choices of regular keg - Brooklyn Defender, the logical end point of macro IPA, tasteless with a lingering and nasty bitterness. The pub itself was magnificent, so presumably they're encountering supply/prediction difficulties. Dissolution at the kirkstall bridge was not at all right and all three of their keg craft beers are absolute zero juice. Their pilsner was also not good. Saviours of the weekend were Northern Monk Eternal on cask at friends of ham and Brass Castle Quench on cask at Sheffield tap. Both 3-4% sessions ipas and a completely different drink to a similar kegged beer. My faith in kegged beer has never been lower and absolutely everything excellent that I've tried in pubs in the last year (aside from lagers) has been cask

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Re: BEERS #2 - Beyond the Pale
« Reply #1707 on: July 25, 2021, 06:50:37 PM »
Kirkstall Pilsner is yet another totally redundant characterless UK lager. Also bizarre when they have Veltins as a permanent tap option, which even not being that great manages to cover enough of the pilsner essentials to beat that option into a cocked hat. At least force lager drinkers to have your pilsner.

Unsure why the keg stuff would be so bad but there's no doubt fresh cask is a distinct improvement for most ale unless carbonation is key for balance. Really plain dislike the hop choice in Eternal though. Always found it acrid, harsh and unpleasant




FerriswheelBueller

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Re: BEERS #2 - Beyond the Pale
« Reply #1708 on: July 25, 2021, 06:50:55 PM »
Desperately trying to shift some pounds at the moment but I still love (alcoholic) beer. These low-calorie beers they have these days, anyone had them? Apparently Tennents does a 3.5% one with only 60 calories per 330ml.

Alcohol is a complex sugar as far as I understand it, so higher ABV = higher calories. Low calorie beer will inevitably be low alcohol, and there’s no way around it. What that also means is a smaller volume of fermentable stuff in the grain bill and removal of any stuff that doesn’t ferment, so you will always get a beer that lacks body and tastes thin.

It’s an inherent problem of the targeted product. There are ways that sort of fix this (using non-fermentables that are lower sugar to boost the body[1]), but it’ll always taste a bit off.

All that said, people usually recommend ghost ship by adnams from what I’ve seen so that’s worth a go. If you’re after lower calorie stuff though, just stick to things 4% and under.
 1. I think rice hulls and/or torrified what or other cloudier grains like you get as adjuncts in weissbeers

phes

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Re: BEERS #2 - Beyond the Pale
« Reply #1709 on: July 25, 2021, 07:00:44 PM »
Unsure why the keg stuff would be so bad but there's no doubt fresh cask is a distinct improvement for most ale unless carbonation is key for balance. Really plain dislike the hop choice in Eternal though. Always found it acrid, harsh and unpleasant

They're not bad at all but they're dense, ice cold and lifeless.

What's the smell about with Three Swords. It's a really popular beer but all three of us agreed that it had exactly the same repugnant smell that had put us off it in 2013. It's tastes OK but the smell is unbearable

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