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Silent Hill

Started by aboutlastnight, April 29, 2005, 10:28:37 AM

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Quote from: "Frinky"
Quote from: "Munday's Chylde"what with the dialogue and everything.

Well I suppose you could take it off mute for that cack-handed 10 minute block where they explain the film away, yes. Who needs a plot when you can have a little girl voiceover?

"filiolus explicatus" I think the term is, its a recognised device as old as greek plays - these days mostly used in horror films since they tend to be the ones designed to be atmosphere enducing over story - Nightmare On Elm Street did it with Nancys mums freddy speech, Psycho did it with the jailhouse explanation  speech- final destination and silent hill both certainly did it - I'm not sure about 28 days later though, don't recall it in that. To be honest if the device was used deliberately then the director would probably agree that you could push the mute button, I get the impression Silent Hill was designed to be purely base - the sum up needs to be there to appease people who need such things.

Claude the Racecar Driving Rockstar Super Sleuth

Even if some decent films managed to get away with the last minute mega exposition chunk, it was still wrong for Silent Hill. The second game relied on a big twist revelation near the end but the games are still much more of a slow burn affair, with clues to the town's past being uncovered gradually. I really don't get why they couldn't have managed that with the film.

And the more I think about it, the more the film version of the sirens pisses me off. I read a nice theory on some SH fansite that the sirens in the games were Alessa's memory of the fire alarm being raised when she was trapped in the burning house. Considering Roger Avery's screenwriting Oscar and claims to have be a big fan of the games it's quite sad that he can't do better or even equal that.

sminkypinkybangbang

Three words: The janitor scene.

The siren sounded different to the one in game. Less effective. I remember shitting myself for some reason in SH2, when James is running down those long stairs, and all of a sudden out of nowhere is this air-raid siren. V.creepy.

Overall a good film, considering the raft of shite game-to-film adaptations. I loved it, at least it resembled the game it was meant to, and Gans is clearly a fan of the series.

Little Hoover

I doubt it'd happen but I wonder how they would adapt SH4:The Room.
Because about 75% of the plot is revealed through you reading letters, and even having a voiceover of Henry reading it would be a bit undramatic. It's quite odd how little in the game is actually spoken, Henry hardly says a word besides "What the Hell?"

Can I also just say the 4 while flawed is very underated and though nowhere near as good as 2, and probably not as good as 1, is a lot better than 3.

Claude the Racecar Driving Rockstar Super Sleuth

I haven't played The Room, but I thought there was definitely something off about 3. Aside from the mirror room in the hospital it all seemed like Silent Hill: Lite, a  dumbed down version made for a much broader audience. The story was little more than a simple revenge tale, Heather was too much the Buffy-esque 'sassy' teen character and the tone was far too focussed on bloody action rather than the slow creeping chills of the other two.

Still Not George

Yeah. 1 was seminal, pure concept with a fairly good game (for the time) bolted on. The street names and other references were wonderful, the end-game was brilliant, the character interplay was spot-on... just magnificent.

2 was like an exercise in mood control, from the ultra-spooky woods scene to the boat across the lake. I'm told Eternal Darkness manages psychological-string-pulling better, but I've not yet played it, so SH2 is the one for me. Also Maria was absurdly sexy for a game character.

3 just seemed... tiny. Not in size - it was pretty damn big - but in narrative scope. It was like the Big Ideas were already gone.

And then The Room was... a mixture. I actually quite liked it, it played with the genre staples quite nicely and the peaks (the chains on the doors, the room with the FUCKING GIANT SCARY HEAD ARRRRGGGHHHH) were very high indeed. But I can see the criticisms - in places it didn't quite seem to know what it was trying to achieve.

As for the film - I was disappointed by the places where it diverged quite so much from the game, as I still think there was no reason for many of the changes beyond laziness and "American audiences might not like it." But overall I thought it was an excellent approach. Sean Bean's character made for fantastic counterpoint, and neatly allowed them to get a lot of the "looking at newspaper articles" bits in without fecking about too much with the basic run-hide-explore model for the protagonist. Really quite well done, and of course the camera angles were fantastic.

Oh, and obviously anything in which someone gets their skin pulled off is cool by me.

Claude the Racecar Driving Rockstar Super Sleuth

I was also annoyed by the lazy reuse of locations from SH2 in 3. Having to go through the hospital again was just taking the piss.

Little Hoover

I didn't really mind redoing the hospital, it was probably the best part of the game, what with the letters from the stalker, the mirror room, the crashed wheelchair, and the phonecalls from leonrard and the guy wishing you a happy birthday.

Little Hoover

bump

Ok only just saw the film on Sky Box Office. And yeah all the criticisms people have made are true. But I feel quite stupid asking this, but what's with the very ending. don't read on if you don't want it spoilt.

Sharon and Rose (I think that's what they were called, you know the mum and the girl) arrive home, we see sean bean sleeping on the couch, he wakes up and suddenly they aren't there. So, what are they supposed to be dead or something and just haven't realised it, if so, why does that make any sense as an ending.

Still Not George

It was supposed to illustrate that they're stuck in "that world", wherever it is. It might mean they're dead, it might mean they're not, but either way they can't get back just by leaving Silent Hill.

meestermole

If memory serves, SH 4, towards the ends, has a child repeatedly calling "daddy?"

My god, I couldn't get past that part of the game quick enough.

Little Hoover

Quote from: "Still Not George"It was supposed to illustrate that they're stuck in "that world", wherever it is. It might mean they're dead, it might mean they're not, but either way they can't get back just by leaving Silent Hill.

Ok so I was sort of right , quite a depature from the game then.

Quote
If memory serves, SH 4, towards the ends, has a child repeatedly calling "daddy?"
Erm I think it was mum not dad,  one of the main plot points of SH4 was the boy coming to think Room 301 was his actual birth mother.  why did you bring this up anyway?

Dark Sky

Quote from: "Little Hoover"bump

Ok only just saw the film on Sky Box Office. And yeah all the criticisms people have made are true. But I feel quite stupid asking this, but what's with the very ending. don't read on if you don't want it spoilt.

Sharon and Rose (I think that's what they were called, you know the mum and the girl) arrive home, we see sean bean sleeping on the couch, he wakes up and suddenly they aren't there. So, what are they supposed to be dead or something and just haven't realised it, if so, why does that make any sense as an ending.

Whether they're dead or not is a mere technicality, as there's no real thing as "being dead" in the world of Silent Hill (the games and the film).  For the sake of sanity everyone who knows the games should forget absolutely everything they know from the games to appreciate the film.  It really incredibly pisses me off that so many Silent Hill fans who like / dislike the film seriously believe that it is based on the first game, despite the fact that the story and characters are all completely different.

Anyway...it's hard to explain the ending without trying to explain the whole film, but I'll keep it as brief as I can.  Basically the ending is signalled throughout the film and it DOES make sense and is a lot more interesting than a "oh they're dead" thing.

To start with, you have to think of the damned twisted fiery world Alessa has created from her imagination is Hell; the Kodak picture perfect life Rose, her husband Christopher and adopted daughter Sharon live in is Heaven; and the foggy dimension of Silent Hill is Purgatory, where people await justice.  (If Rose and Sharon's home is Heaven then that makes them 'angels'...note how at the start of the film they are roused from their slumber under the heavenly tree by a large truck roaring past a billboard with a quotation from Corinthians saying, "Do you not know that we will judge angels?"  Also note that unlike the children in Toluca Orphanage who chant the "if I should die before I wake I pray the Lord my soul to take" prayer before they sleep, when Rose wakes from her nap she heads straight to Silent Hill...to purgatory, to await her judgement.

But throughout the film it is established how wrong blind justice is, and how wrong faiths blindly followed are when it leads people to judge others...  Whether it is the Cult executing innocent people whom they think are demons, or Rose making a pact with the Demon to help Alessa gain revenge on the Cult, which she blindly believes will make the Demon let them go home (with the really unsubtle linkage at that point between Rose, whose dress has suddenly turned bright red, and the Red Nurse, who you see is literally blind... Blindness is a recurring theme throughout the film, from the foggy streets of Silent Hill, to the monsters within the film [who are all blind]).

Here's an extract from the end of an essay I wrote about the film (yes I am obsessed with it) which talks about blind faith, blind justice, the ending, and the links between "God", "Loyalty" and "Home" (which are seen on the placards in the school near the start of the film).

QuoteJustice and revenge comes at a price for all who practise it.  When the Cult try to halt an apocalypse through their judgmental burnings they actually cause the coming of the event they were trying to stop.  Anna's judgment on Dahlia brings her an early death at the hands of the Red Pyramid outside of the church.  And when Alessa gains revenge on the Cult she consigns herself to an eternity in the dreamscape hell of her own devising and damnation of her actions by her mother: 'Alessa, what have you become?' murmurs Dahlia as she witnesses the bloody massacre of the Cult from her daughter's hands.  
As Gucci [the police officer] tells Christopher, there are 'there are many different forms of justice...you got man's, God's...and even the Devil's'.  In the world of Silent Hill it is hard to know who is at work much at the time, whether it is God or the Devil, or if the Demon is in fact both.  All that is clear is that it is Rose's blind loyalty to her adopted daughter which led her (in the words of the Johnny Cash song playing in the bowling alley) 'down down down' into the 'burning ring of fire', as the 'flames went higher' in her attempt to get them home.  But according to the picture placards she sees in the school, the link to 'home' is through 'loyalty' to 'God', not to the Demon.  By helping Dark Alessa, Rose commits herself to being one of those in league with the devil Christabella mentions in her prayer, for whom 'earth and heaven fled away and no home was left to them'.  Unlike Christopher who isn't judged by Gucci (he is not arrested for his crimes of breaking and entering and is told to 'go home now'), Rose is not allowed that privilege by the Demon and remains confined to the foggy purgatory state of the town of Silent Hill, despite geographically reaching her house.  
For her all attempts to convince the Cult of their blind faith, Rose is still unaware of her own misperceiving.  As she drives away from the town she is oblivious to Sharon's apparent possession by the Demon and to the fact that she is not actually going to be able to get home.  Even upon reaching the fog drenched house she is still blind to the truth that she continues to be in purgatory for her choices.  Existing in different planes of reality (despite occupying the same geography) Christopher and Rose are blind to each other; even as the film ends the camera tracks away and the 'Heaven'-esque house is shrouded from view by the bushes just as it is shrouded from Rose.   Rose joins the Cult in their inability to see the truth of themselves and their own denials, being as blind as the hideous creatures which roam about in torment, as blind as the Red Nurse, as blind as the ever swirling fog which pervades and characterises every corner of the judgmental town of Silent Hill.

So Rose was not allowed home because she was blindly led and helped Alessa to practise unfair judgment on those who practised unfair judgment upon her.  Whereas Christopher, her husband, got home because Gucci declined to perform justice on him (by arresting him) even though he had commited several break ins and assault on the nun at the orphanage and told him to "go home".

I guess the whole film is open to interpretation but I've been trying as hard as I can to understand just what Roger Avary intended rather than come up with some far off suggestion only loosely connected with the clues within the film.  And I think I've cracked it, but...who knows.

Mr. Analytical

I think you're being ridiculously charitable.

Dark Sky

Eh?  What does that mean?

Little Hoover

I think he's saying, there really wasn't that much to it and that your over-analysing.

Dark Sky

Oh I see.

Well as I said in my post, I really am not.  

All the clues are laboriously laid out throughout the film.  It is a fascinating film from that point of view.

Not that I'm saying the film is very good, because I don't think it is at all.  But since working on trying to figure out what the film is about I have become obsessed with it and love it very, very much.  The stuff I posted above is only a small amount of the stuff in the film (which I've been compiling into a much longer essay), and none of it is wild and amazing conjectures I've come up with off the top of my head; it is simply just me piecing together the bits of dialogue and signage which crop up throughout the film.

Doesn't make it a good film, no.  But it is fascinating.  To me, anyway.

Claude the Racecar Driving Rockstar Super Sleuth

I think that's a good reading of the film. Whether the film really deserves such devoted scrutiny is another matter, but the irony of Mr. Analytical accusing someone of over-analysing is making my head shake rapidly.

Little Hoover

hmm.

http://uk.gamespot.com/pages/tags/index.php?type=news&tags=silent+hill+movie
Quote
Silent Hill 2 movie confirmed
[UPDATE] French director Christophe Gans tells magazine DVDrama that the movie is "well underway," though there's confusion over Neil Gaiman's possible contribution.
By Emma Boyes, GameSpot UK
Posted Dec 29, 2006 9:01 pm GMT
There are a slew of film adaptations of video games in production right now, Hitman, Alice, and Postal, for example. Now, according to director Christophe Gans, Silent Hill 2 can be added to that list.

Gans, the Antibes-born director of the first Silent Hill movie, has revealed that a second SH film is on the way and that it will correct the mistakes of the first.

The original Silent Hill, released on April 21, 2006, told the story of Rose Da Silva, a mother who sets out to find a town called Silent Hill, which her daughter Sharon calls to in her sleep.

Gans confirmed in an interview with French magazine DVDrama that "there will indeed be a Silent Hill 2 and it is officially ordered and is already well underway. Once he has finished his adaptation of Driver, Roger Avary will be [working on the script], helped by his friend Neil Gaiman."

Roger Avary is a Canadian-born director, producer, and writer. He has previously worked on the screenplays for the first Silent Hill and Killing Zoe and won an Oscar for his work on Pulp Fiction.

British author Neil Gaiman is most famous for his series of Sandman graphic novels and has also worked on screenplays for the TV series of his novel Neverwhere, as well as Mirrormask and Princess Mononoke.

However, Gaiman's actual contribution is now under some doubt, after a post on his own blog stated, "Yesterday I discovered pretty much all of my FAQ messages were people asking whether I was really going to be writing the Silent Hill sequel with Roger Avary. I'm afraid that I don't think I am--I mean, it's the first thing I've ever heard of it, and I'm sure that if they make a sequel Roger would want to write it himself."

Gans' original statement has since been retranslated, so until there is clarification from Gans or Gaiman, some mystery still shrouds the title's development.

Gans added that he may not have time to take on the project himself, due to his commitments on the adaptation of another video game project, Onimusha.

When asked who he would like to see direct if he were unable to, Gans told DVDrama that, "If I cannot take on Silent Hill 2 myself, the director who does would need to continue in the same style as the first film. One does not want to make a Hollywood-style movie, and I think that it makes sense if the director of the sequel is European--in the best case scenario, French."

He also revealed that he was planning a special two-disc collector's-edition DVD of the original Silent Hill, but that would be a long time coming, possibly not for two and a half to three years, and that he intends to start work on it only after finishing up Onimusha.

Not quite sure what to make of this, firstly it's not even clear if it's going to be a sequel to the movie plot or if it'll be based on the 2nd game. But I'm not sure which would be better, I absloutley love the 2nd game so I wouldn't want it screwed up, but at the same time, maybe it would lend itself better to a movie adaptation. So I'd love to see them try. And a sequel to the movie could go either way, because it would be more of their own thing rather than a sort of compromise between the two. (I actually just found the first game in a computer exchange a couple of days ago and I'm in the middle of it right now, but I've already read a lot of summaries of the story)

Claude the Racecar Driving Rockstar Super Sleuth

I'm in two minds about it as well. While I welcome the opportunity for them to try and get it right this time, I can't help but worry that they'll bugger it up again. After all, I'm sure they didn't intend for the first one to be as messy as it was.

While on the subject of adaptations, avoid the Silent Hill comics. They are crummy.

Little Hoover

Well now I've now completed the first game, it's definatley better than 3 and 4, in terms of gameplay it's probably tied with SH2, but the weaker story and terrible dialouge and voice acting mean it doesn't really match 2.

Claude the Racecar Driving Rockstar Super Sleuth

Ooh, controversial viewpoint there regarding 1 and 2. Which ending did you get?

Little Hoover

.....I'm not telling you.  I'd read what happens in all the different endings long before I got it anyway, so that didn't have any bearing on my opinion.
It's not that controversial a viewpoint is it, it's still a good story, I just prefer 2 for being more of a character driven story than 1 which is more about the history of the town and the religous cult stuff. I'm sure I've seen other people express similar views.

I suppose in terms of gameplay 1 has some better moments, It could feel quite fast paced at times, and there's bit more variety in the locations, and I like how there's more exploration of the town.
In a way I almost think the dated graphics helped make it scarier, (once you get over the stupid running animation) It all looks a lot dirtier and less clean cut.

Mister Six

Silent Hill 1 is so much more deserving of a remake than Resident Evil 1 that it's untrue.

The creepiest bit is when you enter the school and it's full of children's writing in paper on the walls saying "WHO ARE YOU?" Brr.