Civilisation Thread

[Zetetic]

I think they try to avoid those sorts of situations by (fairly aggressively) biasing the starting locations of Civs - which does a bit undermine the 'play a new way' aspect I think.

I think the increased complexity of the games makes total conversions like that harder to pull off.

Maybe a bit. I think also the general issue with the transition to high-detail 3D (and expectations around that) that the art 'costs' of a total conversion go through the roof. (Not that you don't get people adding new 3D assets into Civ VI, but it's often bits here-and-there around the base game.)

[The Culture Bunker]

I picked up Civ VI cheap-ish on PS4 about a year ago, played about 20 minutes and for whatever reason thought "I'm not sure I can be arsed with this right now" and have never gone back to it. I think it was the final time I tried playing what is really a PC game on console*, because it just never feels right without a mouse/keyboard.

*see also: Cities: Skylines, Stellaris, any kind of game with management aspects.

[Pink Gregory]

I played quite a lot of Tropico 3 on the 360 fairly successfully.  Didn't even notice that it ran like molasses.

[a peepee tipi]

The only thing that came close in the sequels was the excellent Fall From Heaven fantasy mod in Civ 4.

This (or rather, a few of the submods) and the Realism Invictus mod are all I've been playing for the past month or so. There are a few other mods I want to check out as well, but who has the time? Caveman2Cosmos sounds like a blast but could potentially ruin my life

[St_Eddie]

All this talk of Civilisation has got me hankering to revisit my childhood favourite Civ II.  I've had a bit of trouble getting it up and running on Windows 8, but have managed to get there eventually.  Now I'm trying to rip a ISO image of the disc so that I can enjoy music the way the game's meant to be played.

One of the things irking me is that I can only move my character in four directions.  Is my memory failing me; was it not possible to move characters in 8 directions with the keyboard's numberpad?

[Ignatius_S]

Has there ever been a game of civ where the first hundred turns or so isn't the most exciting? It does seem to suffer from that.

Not as a rule - I tend to play on slower speeds, but there isn't an approximate point where consistently the game stops being exciting. Early-game will have a lot going on if I'm playing aggressively or having to defend, but usually, I'm playing a leader whose abilities fit the mid or late game well and the earlier part of the game isn't always that interesting compared to ones who abilities suit that more.

Also, I can think of games where the mid-game was particularly tense - I think every time as Teddy Roosevelt that was the case and it was a job managing to hang in.

[Ignatius_S]

Nope, you save with the intention of carrying on another day, but it's more appealing to just start over again.  It's been that way since the beginning.

I've really fancied a go at Civ in recent months, but can't possibly buy Civ 6 after what they did to 5 on Steam.  They'll do the same thing again.

I missed that about 5 - what happened?

[Ignatius_S]

...I think they're an interesting idea, but I don't really like the doubling-down on Civ's weird concept of a 'civilisation' with innate characteristics.

I wish stuff like the terrain-related abilities were made available as difficult choices during the course of the game somehow. Maybe in the form of mutually exclusive expensive Science/Culture projects. (Even have them unique within the game, so there's a racing-other-players element, as with Religion - although I don't really care for that.)

The leader abilities weren't a concept that I was keen on initially, but now enjoy them. A big reason, I think, is that it's made me think more about how I'm going to play and to try out different styles - also, to a degree, it can make victory routes a little more interesting rather than relying on the same strategy.

Something I feel is well done is that the abilities and bonuses have varying degrees of complexity, so there are nations that are particularly beginner-friendly and a good way of easy of getting grips to the game. However, I would like there to be some kind of (optional) way of developing the abilities to come through some kind of evolution or good old fashioned random allocation.

I rather like the idea of making the kind of difficult choices you suggest - also, I think it could be interesting that there was some kind of trade-off with abilities, so there can be a downside.

[NoSleep]

Steam selling Civ IV Complete for £3.74 today. Having some of that.

[druss]

Steam selling Civ IV Complete for £3.74 today. Having some of that.

I played all of them religiously up to Civ IV and played Civ IV more than any other, felt like they perfected it with Civ IV and the expansions. I really tried with V but just couldn't get into it at all and didn't even bother with VI. Is VI worth it?

[Zetetic]

I think if you didn't get on at all with V (with Brave New World) then VI is unlikely to win you over.

[Cuellar]

Just bought III for 70p or whatever and it doesn't bloody work.

[NoSleep]

What platform and where did you buy it? I've even managed to get Windows Civ III to work on a Mac. I bought it from GOG.com.

[NoSleep]

That Steam version is Windows2000/XP only (how the fuck does that work?). The GOG one (£4.49) works on Windows 7, 8 & 10.

https://www.gog.com/game/sid_meiers_civilization_iii_complete

[Cuellar]

It was on Steam - I think I've fixed it by running the windows compatibility troubleshooter thing

[NoSleep]

Using Porting Kit (method for playing Windows games on a Mac) I've just discovered I can install Civilization II for free.

https://portingkit.com

Although it's one of those games you can play online nowadays:

https://playclassic.games/games/turn-based-strategy-dos-games-online/play-sid-meiers-civilization-ii-online/play/

[Ignatius_S]

Steam selling Civ IV Complete for £3.74 today. Having some of that.

Incredible deal - am tempted to go back and will have to keep out a more careful eye for when it's on sale...

[Ignatius_S]

I played all of them religiously up to Civ IV and played Civ IV more than any other, felt like they perfected it with Civ IV and the expansions. I really tried with V but just couldn't get into it at all and didn't even bother with VI. Is VI worth it?

I would give it a qualified recommendation - 5 and 6 have marked differences. Whereas 5 encourages taller empires, 6 is a lot more forgiving when it comes to expansion.

If you have just played the base game of 5, then the one for 6 is fuller - for example, city districts as a concept; religious victory is possible. I found 5 was fine but the two expansion packs were sorely needed and although I think far from perfect, I couldn't imagine have going back to the base game. With 6, I probably wouldn't return to the base game, but could see myself playing with just the Rise & Fall expansion (as mentioned above in my previous post, nations can have gameplay differences in the expansions). Quite a few aspects of 6, like the districts and the civics cards, were ones that I was wary of but think they add a lot. Personally, I've found 6 to be a lot more engaging - however, being played on an iPad is a definite bonus for me!

I don't know how representative the discussion I have seen is, but just about every time I've seen a 5 vs 6 discussion, just about everyone who said they didn't like 5 has enjoyed 6 - your mileage may vary obviously...

[Mr Trumpet]

6 is good, but i'd wait until the base game and expansions are on sale good and cheap (this is my advice for all games tbf)

[Pink Gregory]

6 is good, but i'd wait until the base game and expansions are on sale good and cheap (this is my advice for all games tbf)

Surely no one forked out £60 for the base game.  Insanity.

[Mr Trumpet]

People spend a fortune pre-ordering unreviewed games. People are still pissing money down the Star Citizen black hole. So yeah, insanity abounds.

[Ham Bap]

It/they are all quite cheap on CD Keys
https://www.cdkeys.com/catalogsearch/result/?q=civilization%20vi

[druss]

Civ VI plus expansions and six leaders is on steam for £13.49 at the moment. Base game for a fiver.

Bought it, played it for an hour and have since been playing Civ IV again for 12 hours. Don't know what it is about V and VI but just can't get into them like I always manage to for IV.

[Pink Gregory]

I don't think I could go back to V.  VI is a bit overstuffed but it's the best version of the one-unit-per-tile, hex grid based Civ.

I know everyone's favourite is IV and it's one that I've played a lot in a former life but going back to unit stacks, manual road building, the slightly underwhelming civics...I suppose I found it easy to move on from.