India/China border conflict

[Kryton]

Several dead on both sides of the LAC it seems. Hard to get an exact figure but it seems maybe 5 Chinese soldiers killed and 11 injured on the Chinese side, whilst others are saying an Indian officer and 2 soldiers were killed on the Indian side.

https://www.thehindu.com/news/national/one-indian-army-officer-two-jawans-killed-in-ladakh-scuffle/article31840687.ece?homepage=true

https://www.businesstoday.in/current/economy-politics/india-china-standoff-live-updates-casualties-on-both-sides-as-troops-clash/story/407070.html

The first casualties for both sides since 1975 apparently.

[Danger Man]

2020 just gets better and better!

[Danger Man]

Hmmm.... half my family are Indian but I do some work in China.....

[Danger Man]

Vote India

[Blumf]

However, Army sources said there was no firing during the face-off.

Well... if they say so. Soldiers must have died from shock or something instead.

[Kryton]

Well... if they say so. Soldiers must have died from shock or something instead.

I think it was a physical brawl?

[Blumf]

I think it was a physical brawl?

I think that'd be even more embarrassing for the two parties.

[bgmnts]

https://www.cookdandbombd.co.uk/forums/index.php/topic,80780.0.html

[steveh]

Thought this was interesting on the effect on the locals from both sides:

While the Galwan valley in uninhabited, nomadic communities depend on the pastures around Pangong Lake to feed their livestock. "The villages near Pangong are populated by nomads, who are solely dependent on livestock," said Rigzin Spalbar. "With their yaks, sheep, goats and tents, these nomads are always on the move. And it's these nomads who have been bearing the brunt of Chinese intrusion since so many years,".

This year's skirmish is no different. "The grazing cycle has been disturbed by three months due to this intrusion and the mortality of livestock is going to increase if nomads aren't allowed towards pastures," said Gurmet Dorjay, a member of Ladakh's autonomous council, representing Korzok constituency in eastern Ladakh. "This is a very difficult situation and the [Indian] army is not allowing nomads to move towards pastures."

The deployment of Indian troops has also disrupted grazing cycles, Dorjay claimed. "The army officers in these areas usually are deployed for small amounts of time," he said. "They don't have the local knowledge about grazing cycles and local traditions. This makes it more complicated for nomads."

https://scroll.in/article/963432/as-india-china-tensions-continue-communities-living-near-the-lac-risk-losing-their-livelihoods

[greenman]

Yak Lives Matter

[Kryton]

https://www.ndtv.com/india-news/20-soldiers-killed-in-face-off-with-chinese-troops-in-ladakh-sources-2247351?pfrom=home-topscroll

20 dead on the Indian side apparently.

[bgmnts]

North Korea just blew up its liason office in the DMZ.

All out war in Asia soon? Jesus.

[Mister Six]

Taiwan must be thanking its lucky stars that Beijing is too distracted to invade at the mo.

[Kryton]

Blimey reports of 40 casualties on the Chinese side too.
That's one hell of a brawl.

Both sides obviously blaming each other. India claiming they need the valley for patrol duties and blaming China for trying to change the status quo whilst China are saying India crossed the border and didn't respond to orders to go back.

[steveh]

Taiwan must be thanking its lucky stars that Beijing is too distracted to invade at the mo.

Though since the start of the Covid thing they've been flying fighter jets into Taiwan's air ID space every couple of weeks before being chased off by the Taiwanese air force. They've also been recently pushing their luck with Vietnam and Malaysia plus there was a confrontation with the US Navy in the South China Sea back in April.

[Pijlstaart]

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/jun/17/shock-and-anger-in-india-after-worst-attack-on-china-border-in-decades

It would be a hill war, through treacherous hills, so there's a lot of scope for being rolled down.

The importance of high ground has been recognised in warfare for millennia, it's in the Art of War, and it's been drilled into the heads of every soldier to the extent that they will expose themselves to pushing hazards in their quest for the high ground. This toxic values system will only result in further tragedy. I will only let myself be pushed in controlled environments and when wearing well-maintained snug-fitting protective gear, and even then from a seated or kneeling position. Whilst a soldier hungers only for high ground, I prefer the oxygen-rich arable lands further below, and I have prospered there. Would urge any CaBbers in the chinese military to keep to low-lying areas in the near future.

[Paul Calf]

Thought this was interesting on the effect on the locals from both sides:

https://scroll.in/article/963432/as-india-china-tensions-continue-communities-living-near-the-lac-risk-losing-their-livelihoods

No-one in the region gives a fuck about the nomads. India describes them as an 'Unscheduled Tribe' and gives them some concessions (cultural preservation, reservations in highly-desired jobs and universities and the odd grant) in return for continuing to fuck them royally, whereas China just wishes they'd cease to exist, and hurries it along with a campaign of light genocide. The Burmese Tat Ma Daw would probably be killing them if they were on the other side of the Indian Himalaya.

That's what happens when your MP is Ian McCulloch[nb]Let's see if anyone can penetrate that one...[/nb]