Lockdown is more deadly than the virus [split topic]

[BlodwynPig]

Child suicide might amuse you. Well done. Great parenting though. Swings & roundabouts eh.

Shuffle back to where you extracted yourself from...

[BlodwynPig]

Yup. The NHS death toll, that got the veggies foaming (Piers Morgan almost exploded with literal mindless rage) was one of funniest non-stories from the fear crazed month of April.

In the last 'pre-Covid' (although whether it was pre Covid, well. They've found it Milan sewage from 18 December, suggesting it had a significant presence in the community in late November) quarter, there were 120000 deaths in the UK.

1.4 milion people work in the NHS. 2% of the entire population. Age adjust it how you like. We would expect hundreds of "NHS deaths" per month. Deaths from all causes are up.

Your previous post and the remainder of the one I've quoted have nothing whatsoever to do with Covid.

If you want to look at purely what we do know, look at the stats. The median death age is 81. Eighty one. Do you know what UK expectancy is?

The danger to the U65s is anything from a day or two (for children) to 3 weeks (folks in their 50s) of being alive.

I note you offer no counter data. (There is no counter data, it's all data. But still.)

Why don't you take all this hot take 'science' through the peer review process. Or write a piece for the Conversation and share the responses here.

[TheReturnOfTheSonOfTPPH]

we are obviously concerned about what he is making of it all and what future problems could manifest.

At 8 a week is an age. Six months is an eternity. Imagine being told the world is frightening place. Other people are potentially deadly. You're potentially deadly. Going outside is wrong. Nowhere is safe.

And this in an era where people 'need' counselling because they couldn't cope with a post of Facebook criticising their hairstyle.

Also cases of domestic abuse have, as you say, shot up. Some kids dread the weekend, imagine what this has done to them?

Despite school places being available, the take up by "vulnerable children" was extremely low, down to 10% initially in some areas. These are the very kids who need daily checks. Yet they were shoved under the carpet in the name of fear porn. It's mass child abuse and those responsible should be held to account.

Being as the UK, despite Boris Johnson himself assuring us over month ago during a Daily Briefing fright fest they would, hasn't even published Covid recovery figures (because they're so hihi it'd further reveal how nonsensical the lockdown was/is) it's unlikely we'll hear much about the implications on young lives. Implications they may have to suffer indefinitely.

[TheReturnOfTheSonOfTPPH]

Why don't you take all this hot take 'science' through the peer review process. Or write a piece for the Conversation and share the responses here.

Did you highlight any factual inaccuracies in the stats from Sweden? Or in anything I've written here? Nah. So what exactly is your beef Pig?

It's hard numbers. Actual deaths (though not "from Covid" obviously, merely "with Covid"). You wanted data, you got it. For those about to head to the beach, we salute you.

Shuffle back to where you extracted yourself from...

You're attacking someone for highlighting dangers to children and sharing the sad fact that suicide is major cause of death among them. Mr Huntley not replying to your letters?

[BlodwynPig]

Did you highlight any factual inaccuracies in the stats from Sweden? Or in anything I've written here? Nah. So what exactly is your beef Pig?

It's hard numbers. Actual deaths (though not "from Covid" obviously, merely "with Covid"). You wanted data, you got it. For those about to head to the beach, we salute you.

Armchair scientists like you deserve nothing but scorn. I've seen the data. The long-term trends are not clear, the geographical and demographical effects need teasing out. Coming in here all bluster and full of self-assurance and diktats to all and sundry is dangerous and wrong.

Read wub's posts and weep.

[BlodwynPig]

You're attacking someone for highlighting dangers to children and sharing the sad fact that suicide is major cause of death among them. Mr Huntley not replying to your letters?

This is a vile slur. You've attacked QDRPHNC's parenting skills. I know him and his child and I find it utterly reprehensible that you make a joke out of it.

Take your plastic cape and go 'save' another world. Right-wing roleplay-pseudo-scientist.

[Mr Farenheit]

We can only realistically compare countries of similar latitudes.

Why?

[TheReturnOfTheSonOfTPPH]

I've seen the data.

Haha. Less than 12 hours ago you claimed the UK's death rate was higher than Sweden's.

And if you imagine letting a kid play Fortnite months on end is good parenting, you're at least being consistent with your apparent support for the nationwide act of mass child abuse that is lockdown.

[steveh]

People over 80 who got Covid lost 2-11 years of life. The majority were healthy and didn't have significant medical conditions.

https://wellcomeopenresearch.org/articles/5-75

[Zetetic]

Deaths from all causes are up.

Nope.

Deaths are up amongst the elderly with some non-COVID-19 "underlying causes", most obviously dementia. As far as we can tell, these are COVID-19 deaths where it's not being mentioned on the death certificate - this seems to be more common in some parts of the UK than others.

(Deaths amongst 10-49 year olds from causes other than COVID-19 are down.)

[BlodwynPig]

Haha. Less than 12 hours ago you claimed the UK's death rate was higher than Sweden's.

And if you imagine letting a kid play Fortnite months on end is good parenting, you're at least being consistent with your apparent support for the nationwide act of mass child abuse that is lockdown.

The UK death rate is higher than Sweden. But let's not celebrate government sponsored genocide, eh?

[BlodwynPig]

And if you imagine letting a kid play Fortnite months on end is good parenting, you're at least being consistent with your apparent support for the nationwide act of mass child abuse that is lockdown.

He is a better human than you will ever be. I pray your seed never bears fruit and continues to land barren on Battlestar Galactica fan-fiction and mouldy fedoras.

[TheReturnOfTheSonOfTPPH]

Nope.

We returned to 'normal' by week 23. I specifically mentioned "April". Though sure, I didn't mention it repeatedly.

are COVID-19 deaths

Priceless.

(Deaths amongst 10-49 year olds from causes other than COVID-19 are down.)

When we remove or severely lessen the likelihood of some of the major causes, especially transport accidents, then yes, that is likely in the short term.

As to the effects of lockdown of the longer term numbers on other major killers; breast cancer, heart disease and cirrhosis of the liver . And not lest suicide driven by, among other things, the strains induced by economic despair, we'll have to wait and see. Given the number of missed cancer referrals, we should tragically see a bulge down the road.

[Zetetic]

Cancer, for example, we can, and are, starting to pick up again now. Screening programmes being switched back on.

Won't pretend sorting that will be easy or complete, but having people terrified to approach health services because COVID-19 was completely uncontained wouldn't have been a better option.

the strains induced by economic despair,

Which, of course, are within our gift to alleviate as a society.

[TheReturnOfTheSonOfTPPH]

Cancer, for example, we can, and are, starting to pick up again now. Screening programmes being switched back on.

Just the 2 million referral and treatment backlog to work through.

Won't pretend sorting that will be easy or complete, but having people terrified to approach health services because COVID-19 was completely uncontained wouldn't have been a better option.

People were terrified, that's the point.

Which, of course, are within our gift to alleviate as a society.

Is that what'll happen? Just in case, we count those dead, just label them 'aspirationally dormant'.

[Zetetic]

People were terrified, that's the point.

I don't think this is accurate. I think mostly people stayed away from health services for altruistic reasons, rather than because they were concerned about putting themselves at risk. Mostly people believe that the NHS have been able to contain the virus, accurately or otherwise.

Just the 2 million referral and treatment backlog to work through.

Yep. (Mind you, in the UK, an awful lot of people presenting for cancer treatment were already within a year or two of death, unfortunately.)

Is that what'll happen?

I fear not.

[TheReturnOfTheSonOfTPPH]

Yep. (Mind you, in the UK, an awful lot of people presenting for cancer treatment were already within a year or two of death, unfortunately.)

Whereas the average remaining life expectancy of 'Covid victims' in Care Homes was? The median age for 'Covid death' is 81...(for those requiring clarity, that's off all 'Covid deaths' anywhere. In Care Homes, it's obviously higher)

[popcorn]

Im seeing a government scandal, a rogue state, a stir crazy nation, a descent into rabid nationalism and anti-communism, and a wind up merchant with a ulterior motive

just wanted to say how much I appreciate this series of words. "a government scandal, a rogue state, a stir crazy nation" sounds like a Paul Simon song.

[TheReturnOfTheSonOfTPPH]

I don't think this is accurate. I think mostly people stayed away from health services for altruistic reasons, rather than because they were concerned about putting themselves at risk.

They were terrified of placing further strains on an NHS whose 7 new pop hospitals have closed already. The London flagship, with 4000 beds, having treated all of 54 patients.

[BlodwynPig]

They were terrified of placing further strains on an NHS whose 7 new pop hospitals have closed already. The London flagship, with 4000 beds, having treated all of 54 patients.

Thanks in no small part to the kindly old care homes opening their doors with a wink and a smile

[TheReturnOfTheSonOfTPPH]

Thanks in no small part to the kindly old care homes opening their doors with a wink and a smile

There's little kind about private health parasites who gladly fleeced us for years, only to beg for state help when things got awkward.

[Bernice]

The Lancet vs A Thick Anti-Semite : whoever wins, we lose.

Ah no, hang on, the daft cunt loses.

[greencalx]

With this thread now de-twatted, I feel slightly more at ease venturing the opinion that Sweden is a really bad control group. Purely anecdotal, but all the Swedes I know tell me that they have effectively been following the same social distancing rules as everyone else, albeit voluntarily. So if the stats are similar between Sweden and another country, that's probably why.

[Funcrusher]

With this thread now de-twatted

What happened?

[Johnny Yesno]

With this thread now de-twatted, I feel slightly more at ease venturing the opinion that Sweden is a really bad control group. Purely anecdotal, but all the Swedes I know tell me that they have effectively been following the same social distancing rules as everyone else, albeit voluntarily. So if the stats are similar between Sweden and another country, that's probably why.

I've been using this site to see the comparisons of C19 deaths per million people:

https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/total-covid-deaths-per-million?tab=chart&country=BEL~BRA~IND~ITA~ESP~SWE~GBR~USA~OWID_WRL

You can add or remove countries from the graph. The countries you see there are ones that I have seen mentioned in the news for one reason or another. Sweden's graph doesn't look great to me.

[Fambo Number Mive]

Lockdown has really affected my already shit mental health, however I still feel it would have been better than the alternative. If it had been earlier and better enforced it might have been over sooner which might have made things easier.