Cancelled People Whose Work You Still Enjoy

[Sin Agog]

I'd still like to spend five minutes on the floating British Isles from This Morning.

My mum and dad did just that back in the '90s.  Gutted, mate. http://juggling.tv/16554

[Sherringford Hovis]

Now Warren Ellis.

https://www.somanyofus.com/

Can't anybody just not be an utter cunt any more? FFS.

[Pink Gregory]

I heard the name going around and was worried it was the big beard with the violin from the Bad Seeds

[Sin Agog]

He always did have cold little marsupial eyes, but I'm sorry to hear that.  FreakAngels is one of my most re-read comics.  Grant Morrison's still a good 'un, right?

[chveik]

it's been discussed in the comics thread if you're interested

[El Unicornio, mang]

He sounds like a manipulative person, but I feel like I'm missing something as a lot of the things on that "bad stuff" list are just regular modern dating techniques that pretty much everyone uses to some degree, it seems like they've been put in there to pad out the list a bit

Makes the target feel unique with constant compliments, interest, and, systematic, frequent contact, and other habit-forming techniques typical of operant conditioning

Tests the waters and pushes boundaries for receptiveness to sexual advances

In multiple cases: engages in sexual video and audio exchanges

In some cases: engages in in-person sexual interactions

Abrupt termination of relationship without communication (ghosting)

Welcome to the modern dating world.

[ProvanFan]

My mum and dad did just that back in the '90s.  Gutted, mate. http://juggling.tv/16554

Madeley looks fantastic in that coat

[Oz Oz Alice]

I'm aware that Douglas Pearce is a racist piece of shit but I played What Ends When The Symbols Shatter? by Death In June this morning and I still love it. Personal accounts of DI6 lead me to believe he was a uniform fetishist first and foremost and the SS fetish wound up taking over his life. He posted on Gaydar under the name Roehm for fuck's sake. It's all very grubby and grimly fascinating

[ProvanFan]

Hot off the press: Shane Carruth

[Dr Rock]

Now Warren Ellis.

https://www.somanyofus.com/

Uses self-deprecating statements, both privately and publicly, to elicit compliments and endear himself

The manipulative fiend.

[Lord Mandrake]

I think the Gaslamp killer had a spot of cancellation but I do enjoy his more Arabic influenced hip hop compositions.

[Pink Gregory]

Now Warren Ellis.

https://www.somanyofus.com/

Can't anybody just not be an utter cunt any more? FFS.

I read that as 'Son of My Anus'

Is that legally distinct, Chicory Tip?

[jobotic]

Now everytime I let one go I'm going to sing

"Song of my Anus"

[thecuriousorange]

Joan Rivers was hilarious.

[Brundle-Fly]

Harold Lloyd.

[NoSleep]

Fatty Arbuckle.

[Dex Sawash]

Did I do Luc Besson already?

[Famous Mortimer]

Now Warren Ellis.

https://www.somanyofus.com/

Can't anybody just not be an utter cunt any more? FFS.

I picked one of the testimonials at random and...it didn't strike me that Ellis was that awful a person from it. So much of it was this person's shitty friends and co-workers, like they were just desperate to get the story of their sad life out. It didn't strike me that Ellis was anything more than, perhaps, a famous guy who had sex with people who admired his work. Not the greatest person, possibly?

[EOLAN]

I quite like some of Jeremy Corbyn's policies and principled stances.

[Small Man Big Horse]

I picked one of the testimonials at random and...it didn't strike me that Ellis was that awful a person from it. So much of it was this person's shitty friends and co-workers, like they were just desperate to get the story of their sad life out. It didn't strike me that Ellis was anything more than, perhaps, a famous guy who had sex with people who admired his work. Not the greatest person, possibly?

I've mixed feelings about the Ellis case, certain aspects just suggest a shitty human being who fucked a lot of his fans, though the following set off alarm bells - "Insinuates he can help advance careers, sometimes follows through, thus obliging his target to continue sexual relations with him; being 'dropped' could mean major career consequences", "Attempts to control other relationships in the target's life, both romantic and aromantic; insisting he be the only man in their life" and "Distances his targets from other women with tactics such as triangulation" but without evidence of what actually happened I feel it's difficult to know how severe his behaviour was.

[JaDanketies]

Chrissie Hynde from the Pretenders bizarrely believes - like I guess some other 60-something women might also believe - that it can be rape victims' fault that they get raped. She even appears to go so far as to say it is not the rapists' fault. And she thinks that things as mundane as the clothes you wear can make it your fault that you get raped.

"If I'm walking around in my underwear and I'm drunk? Who else's fault can it be?"

"If I'm walking around and I'm very modestly dressed and I'm keeping to myself and someone attacks me, then I'd say that's his fault. But if I'm being very lairy and putting it about and being provocative, then you are enticing someone who's already unhinged – don't do that. Come on! That's just common sense. You know, if you don't want to entice a rapist, don't wear high heels so you can't run from him.

"If you're wearing something that says 'Come and f*** me', you'd better be good on your feet ... I don't think I'm saying anything controversial am I?"

Ain't no denying Brass in Pocket is a great song though

[Barry Admin]

Someone should remind her of when she met Kim Deal, said "you're not a chick, you're a dude" and grabbed Deal by the tit. Then she grabbed Deal's hand and put it on her own boob. Obviously a bizarre encounter, but not one Kim Deal could in any way be blamed for.

This isn't a brilliant point, but I was reminded of the encounter so I posted it.

[zomgmouse]

It's almost a case-by-case basis with these things, but depending on the severity it's either "I can't listen to/watch this anymore" to "I might watch it knowing what they did".

I also think the whole "cancelled" thing gets misinterpreted a little sometimes - not so much in the sense of that it's meant to be about transparency and accountability (which it is), but in the sense of "well, you now have this knowledge and it's up to you to see how you feel morally about this in light of that knowledge you now have". Personally I tend to err on the side of abandoning their works. Partly because the discomfort is too great and it becomes too difficult to sit with their misdeeds if I'm listening to/watching/reading/etc their work; partly because there's enough other people out there to enjoy. Woody Allen for example was a personal hero of mine during my teenage years, I thought he was incredibly funny and adored his writing and films, but now I am perfectly happy never reading another word of his. I've moved on. There's heaps of other people to fill the gaps.

I think it's also - in some cases, at least - about the fact that there are so many voices who don't have the opportunity to be heard in favour of the "cancelled" person. There are so many people who produce just as great work who are left in the shadows. Continuing to enjoy or consume the work of people who has done something unpardonable (again, a nebulous term but interesting to explore on a personal level) means they or their perception will carry on. Even if they're dead (and therefore not personally benefiting from it) or even if you get someone's work for free (and therefore don't contribute financially to them) it still means their public image and reputation have the chance to continue and spread. Talking about them maintains their relevance.

If you discard the work of every single "cancelled" person on the planet I guarantee there will be more than enough other work by other people to take its place. (Until they too get cancelled, probably.)

Also I'm not saying you get the right to be the arbiter of what should or shouldn't be acceptable, or that you personally become The Great Judge of people who mercifully decides who can and cannot continue their lives and careers, etc - it's more just, what are you personally okay with? And if so, and if not, then why?

As a thought, do you have any friends or family members who have done something so bad that you can no longer talk to them or support their endeavours? (Might be a topic for another thread.)

I dunno, tldr I reckon it's what you're comfortable with, and most times for me it's "not at all".

[Phoenix Lazarus]

Harold Lloyd.

What's he done!?

[Smeraldina Rima]

:(

[Jockice]

What's he done!?

Got people to make way for him.

[Smeraldina Rima]

:(

[boki]

"If you're wearing something that says 'Come and f*** me', you'd better be good on your feet ... I don't think I'm saying anything controversial am I?"

Finally I understand that hideous outfit in the video for 'Don't Get Me Wrong'

[lazyhour]

Andy Partridge has said several other gross and weird conspiracy theory things relating to Judaism (not just Israel) over the last year. Definitely too much to be batted away with a "cuh, everyone's getting cancelled nowadays!" response.

I'm struggling to find some of the examples I found first time I looked into this, but there's a tweet questioning the total number of Jews actually killed in the Holocaust for starters.

[TheBrownBottle]

Chrissie Hynde from the Pretenders bizarrely believes - like I guess some other 60-something women might also believe - that it can be rape victims' fault that they get raped. She even appears to go so far as to say it is not the rapists' fault. And she thinks that things as mundane as the clothes you wear can make it your fault that you get raped.

"If I'm walking around in my underwear and I'm drunk? Who else's fault can it be?"

"If I'm walking around and I'm very modestly dressed and I'm keeping to myself and someone attacks me, then I'd say that's his fault. But if I'm being very lairy and putting it about and being provocative, then you are enticing someone who's already unhinged – don't do that. Come on! That's just common sense. You know, if you don't want to entice a rapist, don't wear high heels so you can't run from him.

"If you're wearing something that says 'Come and f*** me', you'd better be good on your feet ... I don't think I'm saying anything controversial am I?"

Ain't no denying Brass in Pocket is a great song though

You might be cynical, but I followed Chrissie Hyndes's advice and I haven't enticed a rapist since.