Italian docs warn about long-term effects.

[Chedney Honks]

https://news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-warning-from-italy-effects-of-covid-19-could-be-worse-than-first-thought-12027348

Basically, to paraphrase, your whole body could be fucked up forever, you could have psychosis, chronic fatigue, stroke and renal fondant.

This isn't a mutation, this is just a realisation of what this actually may do. It ties into what Cerys posted about it being a blood disease ages ago. It affects the whole system, it seems.

How to respond to this potential detail? We have to be sensible about riding this out. Ignore this cunt tier government, slaves to the finance sector, and preserve human life as best you can. Get the mask on clever clogs and lockdown to the max until the vaccine, and then we'll talk.

[Cuntbeaks]

I have to admit I was in the "it's just like the flu" camp way back when it emerged, mainly because information was scant and i was putting 2 and 2 together and getting what i wanted to hear. As you have pointed out, it's becoming pretty clear that it's nothing like the flu and although its unlikely to kill you dead, it probably will shorten your life span and potentially making what you do have left, a painful misery.

So, to fuck with catching this and to fuck with putting myself in a position whereby my odds of getting it are increased. Fuck pubs, fuck beaches, fuck public transport, fuck the public, fuck offices, fuck air travel, fuck all the shit i never really enjoyed pre-lockdown anyway.

[BlodwynPig]

Thank you

[Buelligan]

I had it.  Since, I've had heart flutters, they seem to be getting less frequent.  I feel pretty tired most of the time (but I do hard physical work so maybe its just that).  I also feel a bit dizzy fairly often and my vision's gone a bit fucked.  Just hope I'm immune now.  Otherwise, worse than cigs.

[idunnosomename]

excellent news re: boris and cummings then

[BlodwynPig]

excellent news re: boris and cummings then

Boris never had it.

[His Name Is Death]

A few months ago, I was talking to my dad about the reports coming in from Italy and the US about the long-term effects and all he said was that they were being funded by Bill Gates and were all invested in exaggerating its severity. He hasn't taken the whole thing very well, to put it mildly.

Getting it myself, albeit in a mild form, and then my partner nearly dying from it doesn't seem to have budged him. The trouble is that we got it in Jan and Feb and were not properly tested and diagnosed. Maybe he'd take it more seriously if we had been. As it is, we won't take anyone's word for it but his own and certainly won't take mine.

[steveh]

Four months on since going down with it and the most annoying persistent effect now is the tinnitus. While not as omnipresent as it was during the worst of the illness, it ramps up when listening to music and impacts on its enjoyment. I had tinnitus slightly before in one ear but this is now much worse and has resulted in me listening to way less stuff than I would normally. I've seen other people reporting this as a symptom though it doesn't seem to be widely acknowledged.

[Uncle TechTip]

Could i ask, those of you who said you've had it, has this been confirmed by a test? I'm interested because you see such reports and it could indicate a high, unchecked level of infection but this doesn't seem to tally with the ONS on recorded infections and general rates modelled from that.

[steveh]

When I had it they were only doing PCR tests if you were admitted to hospital so it was diagnosed on symptoms by a doctor. When I later got to talk to my GP they weren't able to do antibody tests.

Pretty sure the tests used for statistics are entirely separate from those used for diagnostics and there were complaints before about the government testing count incorporating both to hit their target.

[Zetetic]

The ONS produce prevalence estimates based on random sampling (in England, mostly, but I think now extended to Wales and beyond). This involves relatively small numbers of tests.

Diagnostic tests - which includes asymptomatic screening in some cases and post-mortem tests - are also used to produce statistics (most obviously on the number of tests and confirmed cases).

[Zetetic]

My gut reaction to someone insisting to me that they had it in the UK in January and it was really bad but they weren't actually diagnosed would be to:
1. Assume that they're deluded.
2. Think COVID-19 can't be that bad if it's only as bad as the flu or whatever this chump had.

Which isn't particularly fair as a response and I'd try to check my initial reaction as grossly overconfident. Nevertheless, I still wonder if it might not have the effect that you'd hope for.

[BlodwynPig]

The ONS produce prevalence estimates based on random sampling (in England, mostly, but I think now extended to Wales and beyond). This involves relatively small numbers of tests.

Diagnostic tests - which includes asymptomatic screening in some cases and post-mortem tests - are also used to produce statistics (most obviously on the number of tests and confirmed cases).

https://sinews.siam.org/Details-Page/the-mathematics-of-mass-testing-for-covid-19

[BlodwynPig]

The ONS produce prevalence estimates based on random sampling (in England, mostly, but I think now extended to Wales and beyond). This involves relatively small numbers of tests.

Diagnostic tests - which includes asymptomatic screening in some cases and post-mortem tests - are also used to produce statistics (most obviously on the number of tests and confirmed cases).

ps. my proposal to UKRI on a novel method for estimating prevalence from excreta/wastewater sampling is under review now. If we can verify the method (mathematics, not the detection), we may have a non-invasive, close to real-time tool to track disease in a community/population. We are looking to link this work to a SEIR model from Belgium vis a vis intervention strategies.

[shiftwork2]

Our Trust has tested close to 6000 punters now for antibodies and the positive rate is 25%, which is slightly on the low side for primary care.  This includes myself (negative, expected, still annoyed though ha) and my colleague who tested positive on PCR in late April, spent two weeks in bed totally fucked by it, then tested negative for antibodies in late June.  Make of that what you will.

[Zetetic]

ps. my proposal to UKRI on a novel method for estimating prevalence from excreta/wastewater sampling is under review now.

Think WG has thrown a bunch of cash at some people to do this. Swansea, maybe? Cardiff? Edit: Bangor - https://gov.wales/pilot-programme-measure-coronavirus-prevalence-waste-water-treatment-plants

I have a vague idea that the Netherlands already have outputs from this approach on their website.

[Zetetic]

Yeah:
"Rioolwatermeting" at https://coronadashboard.rijksoverheid.nl/

Info in English: https://www.rivm.nl/en/novel-coronavirus-covid-19/research/sewage

(I appreciate your method may be novel, and I think all of these people are still trying to establish exact link to prevalence.)

[Barry Admin]

Chris Cuomo from CNN had it, and was talking about it last night with a woman whose whole family survived it. Her kids also got it. The main points I remember are the fucked up breathing - the woman says that, particularly late at night, she finds breathing a struggle and not so much of a natural process anymore.

Cuomo himself said he was having real problems recovering from workouts now, and also that he was suffering from clinical depression. He stressed that he had never suffered from it before, but is now unable to control his mood. Odd stuff going on with his bloods too, apparently.

[Puce Moment]

I have kidney problems now, plus a huge amount of fatique that I have never had before. Sort of feels like a hangover without the headache or self-hatred.

[BlodwynPig]

Think WG has thrown a bunch of cash at some people to do this. Swansea, maybe? Cardiff? Edit: Bangor - https://gov.wales/pilot-programme-measure-coronavirus-prevalence-waste-water-treatment-plants

I have a vague idea that the Netherlands already have outputs from this approach on their website.

yeh, a Prof in our group is working with Bangor and Edinburgh on this (or something similar), but we are proposing a novel method to calculate the prevalence - they will use a mass-balance approach where I am using a statistical distribution based on a fundamental theory of species diversity in nature (shown to occur in macro and micro ecology, but not yet virus populations). So, while there is good work going on elsewhere, this would either complement or supplant the methods they use.

[BlodwynPig]

Yeah:
"Rioolwatermeting" at https://coronadashboard.rijksoverheid.nl/

Info in English: https://www.rivm.nl/en/novel-coronavirus-covid-19/research/sewage

(I appreciate your method may be novel, and I think all of these people are still trying to establish exact link to prevalence.)

oh yes, we are partnering with a group from Notre Dame who have published the first work based on Australian data - however, they found prevalence estimates between 0.1% and 100%. There is also an issue with inhibition factors in the qPCR method used mainly by clinicians. But most people are aware of this. Our method strictly relies on data, the more data the more certainty (assuming some error rate in the sampling).

[Zetetic]

I confess I'm more prepared to see the value, as this increasingly looks like it might last forever.

[Blinder Data]

As someone who only got COVID toes and fingers, and whose wife now seems to be displaying the same symptoms, this a bloody sobering read. Really hope we're not all absolutely fucked by this.

[Chedney Honks]

ps. my proposal to UKRI on a novel method for estimating prevalence from excreta/wastewater sampling is under review now. If we can verify the method (mathematics, not the detection), we may have a non-invasive, close to real-time tool to track disease in a community/population. We are looking to link this work to a SEIR model from Belgium vis a vis intervention strategies.

Great work. Tell your guys they can rummage round my shit any day.

[katzenjammer]

Over half of coronavirus patients in Spain have developed neurological problems, studies show

"The brain is characterized for being isolated from the bustle of the world. If there is a pathogen in the rest of the body, the blood-brain barrier stops it from entering," explains Segura. This defense system allows oxygen-filled blood to reach the capillaries and even the neurons, but filters out toxins, bacteria and viruses that travel in the bloodstream. "The rupture of this barrier is an effect that we have not seen before," he adds. For Segura, finding the endothelial cells (the thin layer of cells that line the interior surface of blood vessels) in the samples of analyzed blood tissue could indicate that the coronavirus has overcome the blood-brain barrier, and that the neurological problems have not been caused by weakness from the immune system's response to Covid-19. According to Segura, the world is facing "a respiratory virus that is also neurotoxic."

https://english.elpais.com/science_tech/2020-07-17/over-half-of-coronavirus-hospital-patients-in-spain-have-developed-neurological-problems-studies-show.html



Well that's fucking terrifying

[BlodwynPig]

Great work. Tell your guys they can rummage round my shit any day.

Are you near Leeds, that's where I'm getting UK data.

[BlodwynPig]

https://english.elpais.com/science_tech/2020-07-17/over-half-of-coronavirus-hospital-patients-in-spain-have-developed-neurological-problems-studies-show.html



Well that's fucking terrifying

BORIS' RESPONSE: "OPEN UP THE FOOTIE STADIUMS! GET BACK TO WORK! AND DRINK YOURSELF SILLY! FOR ALBION!"

[Chedney Honks]

Are you near Leeds, that's where I'm getting UK data.

Lymm, but if I really push it out, I'm sure I can send it up the canal.

[Barry Admin]

https://english.elpais.com/science_tech/2020-07-17/over-half-of-coronavirus-hospital-patients-in-spain-have-developed-neurological-problems-studies-show.html



Well that's fucking terrifying

That's another thing Chris Cuomo and that woman I mentioned upthread referred to the other night on CNN. They talked of "covid brain", and said they now struggle to find the right words, and that their brain is cloudier in general.

It's pretty clear we still don't know the full extent of this awful shit, but it does just seem to reliably get worse and worse.

[Blinder Data]

That's another thing Chris Cuomo and that woman I mentioned upthread referred to the other night on CNN. They talked of "covid brain", and said they now struggle to find the right words, and that their brain is cloudier in general.

It's pretty clear we still don't know the full extent of this awful shit, but it does just seem to reliably get worse and worse.

This morning I literally spent a few minutes trying to compose a relatively simple sentence in a text to a friend. Really took me a while to put the words together. And all I had was COVID toe FFS :(