Star Trek - Deep Space Nine [split topic]

[oy vey]

That's the one.

Past Tense (Part 1). Fucking hell. In a very different way. Partner and I have been watching this over breakfast and she said it basically ruined her entire day. Set in 2024 and it really doesn't take that much imagination to picture it being real. Actively unpleasant stuff. 9/10.

Hehe. It's a bit flawed but for 2024 it's close to the bone. Hints of City on the Edge of Forever with a sprinkle of First Contact (the movie). My favourite line

Spoiler alert

Europe is falling apart

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.

Are we doing spoilers? I will be mindful not to jump ahead of your binge.

[Cloud]

I like the Enterprise opening.

I think that makes 2 of us in the world :)

[JamesTC]

I think that makes 2 of us in the world :)

Honestly I don't think it is too uncommon opinion these days. Many Trek fans appreciate it for kitsch value at least.

[purlieu]

My favourite line

Spoiler alert

Europe is falling apart

[close]

.

Yes, remarkably prescient.
Also, Bashir: "21st century history is not one of my strong points: too depressing."

[Obel]

I'm pretty much caught up with you now perlieu so I look forward to engaging in the thread a bit more. I'm following the Trek chronology thing so am currently bouncing between DS9 and Voyager. Going to take some time to get used to Voyager though.

Past Tense is a cracking pair of episodes. It took me aback with how prescient the plot is, nicely highlighted by oy vey before. When Trump got in I hoped it would actually cause a backlash which would lead to a more positive future down the line, I hope much like they mention in the episode we will experience a similar turning point in real life.

(doubt it though)

[dr_christian_troy]

Honestly I don't think it is too uncommon opinion these days. Many Trek fans appreciate it for kitsch value at least.

I liked it more when I thought it was Scott Bakula singing. When I embark on a more active viewing of Enterprise I may keep that in mind!

[purlieu]

Past Tense (Part 2). I think that very slightly dropped in quality, almost entirely down to B.C. turning into a bit of a goof when he was previously a threatening character. Kira and O'Brien's brief forays into time travel were a bit jarring, tonally, although acted as a bit of a breather. Avery Brooks was utterly tremendous throughout, maybe my favourite performance of his so far.

[purlieu]

Life Support. A couple of huge plot elements there, both for the Cardassians and Bajorans, and also for Kira. The kind of episode that should feel more momentous, but it ultimately feel completely flat for me, very little tension, surprisingly unemotional. Disappointing.

[crankshaft]

Life Support. A couple of huge plot elements there, both for the Cardassians and Bajorans, and also for Kira. The kind of episode that should feel more momentous, but it ultimately feel completely flat for me, very little tension, surprisingly unemotional. Disappointing.

Yes, it's a funny one - it should be, as you say, momentous, but it's just feels really one-note. A shame. There are better Bajoran episodes to come, though - some of the series' best, in fact.

[purlieu]

Heart of Stone. Both the Nog and Odo plots in this really shine in their final acts, some really emotional character stuff, but fucking hell does it take a long time to get to them. The first two thirds just drags and drags without much humour, action, drama, anything.

[oy vey]

Heart of Stone. Both the Nog and Odo plots in this really shine in their final acts, some really emotional character stuff, but fucking hell does it take a long time to get to them. The first two thirds just drags and drags without much humour, action, drama, anything.

Yeah, fake-Kira's plight seems a little too contrived and the crystal stone thing looks shit. I swear she's standing behind a cardboard prop in some shots. Nog is yet another recurring gem to add to the growing list.

[JamesTC]

I discovered an AI remastered HD version of DS9 exists called Project Defiant. It can be found via reddit if you google Project Defiant. I downloaded Season 3-7 as 1-2 need to be redone according to the team.

Tried the episode Statistical Improbabilities on the big 4K TV yesterday and it was okay. If it were released on Blu-Ray you would just about say it is worth it. Really though it just makes me sad that they'll never do a proper restoration.

[oy vey]

Never heard of this machine learning upscaling lark. Let's have a look...

[Sin Agog]

Finally got around to watching the What We Left Behind doc, and it's well good, innit?  Would make the perfect After Seven [series] mint for anyone doing a rewatch/first-watch.  It definitely reflects on some of DS9's best elements in the way it's made- the comparatively real feeling banter, strong female characters, alien species that felt clannish while still getting their mingle on, occasional format-breaking daring (for network teevee)- to the point where it's made every other Trek doc look like the driest, most blistery of desultory wanks.  Although The Captains was kinda fun as part of Shatner's continuing quest to use peripheral people in his life as therapists he then swiftly ignores.

[dr_christian_troy]

Finally got around to watching the What We Left Behind doc, and it's well good, innit?  Would make the perfect After Seven [series] mint for anyone doing a rewatch/first-watch.  It definitely reflects on some of DS9's best elements in the way it's made- the comparatively real feeling banter, strong female characters, alien species that felt clannish while still getting their mingle on, occasional format-breaking daring (for network teevee)- to the point where it's made every other Trek doc look like the driest, most blistery of desultory wanks.  Although The Captains was kinda fun as part of Shatner's continuing quest to use peripheral people in his life as therapists he then swiftly ignores.

Excellent documentary. I did find Marc "Gal Dukat" Alaimo's comment about being in love with Nana Visitor (and then a cut to her eye-rolling) relatively intriguing. I also loved the fact that the actor who played Gowron is in one talking head clip and just stares at the camera.

[Malcy]

Apparently there was around 8 hours of stuff they could have used. They said they hope to release more at some point. The US Blu-Ray has extra stuff the other region releases don't as well.

[purlieu]

Destiny. It's taken a while for Sisko's Emissary position to really come around again. I enjoyed the sense of not really knowing what was going to happen in this episode; undoubtedly enough elements of the prophecy would have come true to make the characters consider its ramifications, but otherwise it had a certain tension which I liked. O'Brien's Cardassian girlfriend was also an entertaining touch.

Prophet Motive. Speaking of the Prophets, that's not how I imagined meeting them again. On the whole I tend to enjoy comedy Ferengi episodes, but that was just way too much.

[Phil_A]

Finally got around to watching the What We Left Behind doc, and it's well good, innit?  Would make the perfect After Seven [series] mint for anyone doing a rewatch/first-watch.  It definitely reflects on some of DS9's best elements in the way it's made- the comparatively real feeling banter, strong female characters, alien species that felt clannish while still getting their mingle on, occasional format-breaking daring (for network teevee)- to the point where it's made every other Trek doc look like the driest, most blistery of desultory wanks.  Although The Captains was kinda fun as part of Shatner's continuing quest to use peripheral people in his life as therapists he then swiftly ignores.

Shatner's Chaos On The Bridge (about the chaotic early seasons of TNG) is also quite fun, although it's frustrating that it's not longer. It really feels like it could've gone into way more detail on certain things.

[purlieu]

Visionary. A nice little time travel episode with a number of nice mysteries at heart and a well paced escalation that does a good job of subverting the usual rule of three. O'Brien gets his usual luck of the Irish. I like that the Dominion story manages to trundle along in the background while playing an important part of the episode, too. A solid Trek episode with some very funny moments and a touch of continuity. Great stuff.

Distant Voices. Some of the symbolism with the characters was a bit heavy handed, but otherwise that was a tremendous little episode. Great mystery, lots of really bloody weird moments - some bits were quite Farscape-esque - and some nice character stuff for Bashir. Given just how poor Siddig El Tahir El Fadil El Siddig Abdurrahman Mohammed Ahmed Abdel Karim El Mahdi's range was in the first series, I'm impressed with how well his acting skills have developed by this point.

Through the Looking Glass. Although this did little to change my mirror universe feelings from 'not arsed', it was pretty enjoyable if only for just how much Sisko got into the role.

[Blumf]

Through the Looking Glass. Although this did little to change my mirror universe feelings from 'not arsed', it was pretty enjoyable if only for just how much Sisko got into the role.

Never got on with the DS9 mirror universe stories, but I've mentioned it before, the TNG set comic Mirror Broken is an absolutely brilliant treatment of the mirror universe:
https://comicpunch.net/star-trek-tng-mirror-broken

Picard, still stoic and philosophical, but unbound by morals and ruthlessly ambitious. Yar a violent bully. Data body modding. A feral Guinan. And a paranoid and delusional Barclay as our guide.

Artwork's a bit iffy mind.

[Malcy]

Through the Looking Glass. Although this did little to change my mirror universe feelings from 'not arsed', it was pretty enjoyable if only for just how much Sisko got into the role.

And also features one of the oddest cameos with Tuvok just being in the cave. There doesn't seem to be a reason for it but I enjoy it.

Never got on with the DS9 mirror universe stories, but I've mentioned it before, the TNG set comic Mirror Broken is an absolutely brilliant treatment of the mirror universe:
https://comicpunch.net/star-trek-tng-mirror-broken

Picard, still stoic and philosophical, but unbound by morals and ruthlessly ambitious. Yar a violent bully. Data body modding. A feral Guinan. And a paranoid and delusional Barclay as our guide.

Artwork's a bit iffy mind.

I read the Mirror Broken stuff earlier this year and it was really great. Barclay especially.

[purlieu]

The arrival of the 24CD Divine Comedy boxset coinciding with four season finale runs marking the end of Arrowverse Year 5 and my starting up my Doctor Who books again means I've had less time and my DS9 run has fallen to the wayside a little. Back on it today though!

Improbable Cause / The Die is Cast. Ah, that was great. For the first time we get some genuine information about Garak's past, while not answering the biggest questions - the reason of his exile, and just what 'side' he's on, if any. Seeing his growth and his sympathy with Odo was really wonderful. Odo himself got more changeling-related nastiness, and I wish people would leave the poor guy alone. Meanwhile, the 'Romulan' insider made a rather ominous remark about the near future. Lots of character, lots of action, some progress of the Dominion arc. What more could you ask for of a two parter?

[Wentworth Smith]

I think these episodes are some of the high water marks for DS9. Garak is, as usual, great throughout

Spoiler alert

Of course he blew up his own shop!

[close]

and totally morally out there for a Trek 'good guy'. 

Spoiler alert

Tain

[close]

is a great villain and it's fun and kind of sad to see

Spoiler alert

him completely lose his marbles at the end, clinging desperately to what he used to be and seeking validation from Garak.

[close]

[oy vey]

Garak - the best recurring character in DS9, perhaps Trek. Sorry Q lovers.

[Wentworth Smith]

Garak - the best recurring character in DS9, perhaps Trek. Sorry Q lovers.

The best character in Trek.

[Wonderful Butternut]

Improbable Cause / The Die is Cast. Ah, that was great. For the first time we get some genuine information about Garak's past, while not answering the biggest questions - the reason of his exile, and just what 'side' he's on, if any. Seeing his growth and his sympathy with Odo was really wonderful. Odo himself got more changeling-related nastiness, and I wish people would leave the poor guy alone. Meanwhile, the 'Romulan' insider made a rather ominous remark about the near future. Lots of character, lots of action, some progress of the Dominion arc. What more could you ask for of a two parter?

Odo is boss in that episode.

"I've had enough of your dissembling Garak! I am not Dr. Bashir and we not sparring amiably over lunch!"

Although the stasis thingy

Spoiler alert

that Garak uses to torture him in the second part is assembled from 3 components that don't seem to be held together. Why doesn't he grab one of the bits, fuck it across the room and then turn into a massive tentacle monster to rip Garak into many pieces?

[close]

[purlieu]

Yes, Odo's anger at Garak and general lack of patience with his duplicity and bullshit is superb.

[crankshaft]

It's amazing how DS9 managed to give us a number of brilliantly fleshed out side characters - Garak, Damar, Winn, Dukat, Martok, Nog, even Rom - whilst Voyager was struggling to give any of their regular cast an actual personality beyond "I'm angry", "I'm a pilot", "I play the clarinet", "I'm some kind of American Indian, further enquiries will be ignored".

[petril]

It's amazing how DS9 managed to give us a number of brilliantly fleshed out side characters - Garak, Damar, Winn, Dukat, Martok, Nog, even Rom - whilst Voyager was struggling to give any of their regular cast an actual personality beyond "I'm angry", "I'm a pilot", "I play the clarinet", "I'm some kind of American Indian, further enquiries will be ignored".

"and I'm the ship's wanker"

[purlieu]

Haha, I'm genuinely looking forward to discovering Neelix next year. He reaches Jar Jar Binks levels of hatred.