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Star Trek - Deep Space Nine [split topic]

Started by dr_christian_troy, July 12, 2020, 12:00:51 PM

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purlieu

It's Only a Paper Moon. If you'd asked me at the start of the show to write out a list of a hundred potential character stories, I still wouldn't have come up with 'Nog gets PTSD'. And I certainly wouldn't have expected it to be such a wonderful, heartwarming episode. That was utterly superb. Vic Fontaine is one of the best things that's happened to the show.

crankshaft

Quote from: purlieu on March 10, 2021, 07:34:31 PM
It's Only a Paper Moon. If you'd asked me at the start of the show to write out a list of a hundred potential character stories, I still wouldn't have come up with 'Nog gets PTSD'. And I certainly wouldn't have expected it to be such a wonderful, heartwarming episode. That was utterly superb. Vic Fontaine is one of the best things that's happened to the show.

This was the one I meant when replying to your AR-558 review, as I'm sure you've gathered. I love this episode. There's so much about it which goes above and beyond anything else in the franchise, both emotionally and in terms of concept ("let's do a deep, emotive show about two of our guest stars, entirely in a holosuite".) We never saw O'Brien or Picard go off the deep end this badly after "Hard Time" or "The Best Of Both Worlds", and Eisenberg plays this long-overdue examination of PTSD in Trek just wonderfully. I really, really feel for Nog. And Vic is the perfect foil for him. Just terrific telly.

oy vey

It's magnificent, and they laid the groundwork so well in AR-558 as you say. Vic's music while Nog was recovering from the amputation, etc. Look at the arc the writers gave Nog from the pilot to this, and I always enjoy a seamless and superb use of the holodeck in a Trek episode.

purlieu

Yeah, Aron Eisenberg's performance was outstanding. It would be easy to oversell it, but the whole thing is done with a real believability. His "No, but I will be" response at the end was perfectly written and acted. In episodic TV, issues are so often wrapped up in 45 minutes, so it was refreshing to see that he hadn't just healed; rather, he'd simply reached a point where he could start healing. Little things like that really ground the show in reality.
My only criticism of the whole episode was the other crew members being ever so slightly too harsh to / about Nog at times. The "living in a holosuite is crazy!" aspect especially. Guys, your only recreational activities involve going to fake places and interacting with fake people, if that's not weird then someone using it as a psychological retreat after a traumatic experience isn't either.

oy vey

I totally agree. Trek characters are overly written to have a stick up their ass about the holodeck when someone uses it in ways they aren't comfortable with for whatever reason. Barclay may have had an addiction in TNG but I wouldn't have any problem disappearing into it for a few weeks at a time to escape the usual bullshit. What's the difference between that and any other getaway. And using it for therapy makes excellent sense. Nog was never going to be there forever. What's the rush? Though Vic played it well booting him out I do admit.

crankshaft

To give the script its due, Dax is excellent on this point - whilst the other characters are skeptical, indeed hostile, to the idea of Nog doing his therapy in the holosuite, she's behind him all the way, and she's also the one who goes to Vic to remind him that Nog can't remain in Deep Space Sands forever.

dr_christian_troy

Retrospectively, and having seen this episode (and indeed the whole series) for the first time in the last year, there is also something deeply comforting about the idea of submersing yourself into a distraction for as long as you need to figure out how to move forward and feel better.

purlieu

Prodigal Daughter. Underwhelming. The coda had a fairly emotional speech from Ezri, but I don't think it was earned. The main story felt muted and underdeveloped. The Orion Syndicate feel like such a vague threat, too, with little chance of them really becoming important at this point.

oy vey

I didn't like this one. I appreciate the writers picking previous plot points and making new stories out of them. They've been very successful at this. But this one didn't work. They crammed too much together bringing in Erzi and her family. They should have made it an O'Brien only episode and tortured him in a more focused way.

Poobum

#459
It was an episode of too much tell and not enough show. Ezri's mum never came across as anything other than a bit overbearing. Making her kids help her run the family business? How could she? Hanging Norvo's painting up even though he didn't really like it? Monstrous.

oy vey

And she's partly responsible for her son committing murder apparently. Not Ezri's finest moment given she's a counselor. I suppose she's also managing her own guilt. Whatever.

purlieu

Yeah, none of what she said at the end really matched what happened in the episode.

The Emperor's New Cloak. Ah bloody hell. That was actually kind of terrible, but I also really enjoyed it. The alternate universe stuff is normally a bit of a drag, but camping it up with some Ferengi silliness seemed to fit a lot better. Rom's continual discussion of the daft logic was a bit on the nose but overall I thought it was fun.

oy vey

Was that the one with alternate Vic as a real person? Jesus I just typed that.

purlieu

Haha, yes. It basically felt like they just wanted a chance to do alternate versions of Ezri and Vic.
It's also really distracting whenever Garak is on screen, because in his Cardassian armour he looks like Kryten.

purlieu

Field of Fire. Fucking hell that was naff.

oy vey

And shame it was a great concept, albeit a bit of a Silence of the Lambs knock off. Sorry Ezri but this would have been better being Jadzia circa season 4 with a more gritty approach.

purlieu

Yeah, it's quite good on paper, but it didn't work. The terrible dream sequence complete with mid-range '90s US crime drama piano soundtrack pretty much killed it for me from the off.

oy vey

And the low frame rate fuzzy camera. Horrendous.

Malcy

Mini-transporter bullets is a good little idea though.

oy vey

As is a vulcan serial killer. Pissed it all away they did.

purlieu

Chimera. Odo put through the wringer again, I thought he was having too nice a time lately. A lovely ending, though, I really like him and Kira as a couple.

oy vey

The last scene was great. There were some similarities to the much earlier episode where Odo tries to tame a young Jem Hadar. But this was a great episode. Fun fact, the same actor who played Laas plays Martok. J.G. Hertzler.

Poobum

#472
This is an episode I really don't like. I think Laas is an awful character whose general psychopathy is ignored far too easily. I have no idea if his little speech on humanoids disrupting nature was supposed to be thought provoking but I hope not. It could have been really interesting if he was confronted with the genocidal nature of his own race, and his own absolute failure to have any understanding of humanoids even after living amongst them for so long, but his dismissive arrogance was left unchecked. I thought Odo should have been far more horrified by Laas's casual and hate filled murder of the Klingon, rather than so blindly eager to defend him. I suppose at least it's a good window into how the founders became as cruel as they did. I'd also quibble with being able to turn into fire, it goes from science fiction, into magical powers.

oy vey

A humanoid girlfriend dumped him and he became a cunt. Simple as that.

What I love about this episode is that Kira realizes she loves Odo enough to put his (potential) needs above their relationship. Odo even remarks on it with Laas in their meeting in the cave. So Laas, do you know what true love really is? No, I think I'll become a dick instead. No hand shake because secretly I'm jealous.

purlieu

Badda-Bing, Badda-Bang. Just when I think this show can't surprise me anymore, they throw in a Vic Fontaine-centred comedy gangster thriller. Great stuff.


purlieu

Yes, I didn't want to be sleazy about it, but I did enjoy Ezri's outfit particularly.

purlieu

Inter Arma Enim Silent Leges. Twists and turns like a twisty, turny thing. Yeah, I enjoyed that. I wish Section 31 had been introduced much earlier in the run, it feels like it won't be utilised very much at this point.

oy vey

It was an alright episode. If the message is the title I think they already covered that already many times, but it was quite watchable. Romulans are cunts but DS9 keeps them interesting.

By the way, from now on there's no filler. The rest of the series is tight. Stock up on beer and pizza.

purlieu

Penumbra. The Ezri and Worf stuff felt a little unexciting and predictable, although the sudden arrival of the Breen gave that plot a really unexpected twist. Meanwhile, Sisko and the Prophets seem to be heading into some serious shit. Looks like we're back to serialised stories again, and even without the above post, this position within the whole show would have suggested to me that this is the start of the final stretch. V. excited.