Star Trek - Deep Space Nine [split topic]

[oy vey]

Yeah I probably shouldn't have said that. Anyway, Ezri and Worf is my least favorite aspect of this episode. Ezri getting mixed up between hosts seems a bit forced, just to generate some bickering. And Worf is grumpier than usual. Some interesting setups on the Sisko end.

[dr_christian_troy]

If you're on a DS9 high when you reach the end of the series purlieu, if you haven't already definitely check out the documentary mentioned previously, "What We Left Behind". Lovely stuff.

[purlieu]

Yes, I fancy tracking it down as the comments in this thread have all been very positive.

Til Death Do Us Part. God, Sisko, what are you doing? Did you not learn from the last time you ignored the Prophets? Also, why are the Breen the only race that the universal translator doesn't work on? Kai Winn and Gul Dukat was physical repulsive. Great stuff, really ramping up the excitement.

[Poobum]

My most recent re-watch made me appreciate the emotional depth that Sarah being Sisko's prophet possessed mother brought. Makes his conflict and how seriously he takes the prophet's warning more impactful and understandable.

I love the Breen, the ship design is great. I think the writers stated that the Breen's raison d'etre is mystery, like the Cardassian's is arrogance and the Klingon's is warrioring, hence the masks and intelligibility.

[purlieu]

Strange Bedfellows. Not much to say other than this is really great. Some real edge of your seat viewing at this point. Damar and Weyoun are utterly captivating together.

[JamesTC]

Yes, I fancy tracking it down as the comments in this thread have all been very positive.

I didn't really chime with the doc if I'm honest. I backed it on Indiegogo and liked all the other documentaries they've made (Chaos on the Bridge, The Captains and For the Love of Spock) but I just felt they were very unfocused. There are some good bits but it was a pretty big letdown after following the production for as long as I did.

On the topic of the documentary, the Voyager doc by the same people has announced that they will do HD scans of all the footage if they reach another $120k. It is already the most successful documentary in Indiegogo history and it is only halfway through the fundraising period.

[oy vey]

I'm looking forward to the Voyager doc. I hope it's worth it.

Strange Bedfellows seems to moving pieces around the chess board but there are some excellent scenes. Winn in distress with Kira was superb. A king of analogy to Dukat and Sisko in Waltz last season.

[purlieu]

It's interesting just how different these serialised sections are: as you say, only a few things really happened in the episode, but it was all very watchable.

[Camp Tramp]

Strange Bedfellows. Not much to say other than this is really great. Some real edge of your seat viewing at this point. Damar and Weyoun are utterly captivating together.

"Maybe you should talk to Worf again?"

[Camp Tramp]

Duplicate

[Malcy]

Sisko's favourite.

[purlieu]

"Maybe you should talk to Worf again?"

Yes, I loved that.

The Changing Face of Evil. I kind of want to just binge this to the end now, this is really exciting. The terror in Weyoun's voice when he realised he could be the last was a delight.

[oy vey]

Damar, who killed Ziyal last season, is starting to rock. It's funny how Game of Thrones fans celebrate that shows ability to go beyond simple good and bad with characters when DS9 was doing it in the 90s.

[The Culture Bunker]

I've always enjoyed the bit with Damar having a few bevvies as the next Weyoun arrives after Worf snapped the previous one's neck: "Oh hellllooooo!"

[Wonderful Butternut]

Yes, I loved that.

The Changing Face of Evil. I kind of want to just binge this to the end now, this is really exciting. The terror in Weyoun's voice when he realised he could be the last was a delight.

I've always had one huge problem with that episode:

Changeling:

Spoiler alert

"We've just blown up the enemy fleet, but let's not capture or kill anybody floating about in the escape pods, not even Sisko and Martok, the only two Alpha Quadrant[nb]They kinda forget the Beta Quadrant exists sometimes in Star Trek[/nb] commanders who've made successful offensives against us, because something something demoralise the enemy."

[close]

[Malcy]

I've always had one huge problem with that episode:

Changeling:

Spoiler alert

"We've just blown up the enemy fleet, but let's not capture or kill anybody floating about in the escape pods, not even Sisko and Martok, the only two Alpha Quadrant[nb]They kinda forget the Beta Quadrant exists sometimes in Star Trek[/nb] commanders who've made successful offensives against us, because something something demoralise the enemy."

[close]

Especially since most major races are Beta Quadrant based, even Earth.

[purlieu]

Damar, who killed Ziyal last season, is starting to rock. It's funny how Game of Thrones fans celebrate that shows ability to go beyond simple good and bad with characters when DS9 was doing it in the 90s.

Yeah, he's absolutely coming into his own at this point. The tension between him and Weyoun has always been enjoyable, but the as time goes on it just gets better.

And yes, I did sigh at the fairly lazy bit of plotting with the Founder letting them go. Allowing a few to go back to share the news of how devastating the Breen weapons are, but the Defiant crew really should have been killed.

[oy vey]

The founder is wwwwi... a dumb bitch.

[purlieu]

When it Rains. Ah, so much going on. Good to see Dukat getting some shit; good (in a narrative sense) to see Section 31 playing a bigger role in the plot. Interested to see just how badly the Klingons are going to come out of this.

Tacking Into the Wind. Not so badly after all, apparently. Some great stuff with Odo, Damar, Garak and Kira too.

[oy vey]

Garak - In the Pale Moonlight "It would mean calling in all my favours."

Apparently not. Garak has a bottomless pit of contacts on Cardassia. Bah I'm being pedantic. Garak keeps his cards close to his chest and he's a strategic bullshitter. Good episodes. The klingon political stuff was interesting. Makes a change from the TNG days.

[purlieu]

Yeah, I'm loving how much more Klingon the Klingons seem here. Less espionage and intrigue and more battles and fighting. Worf's victory at the end came as a genuine shock, having followed the Klingon story from TNG.

[oy vey]

It was, and we have Ezri to thank. I admit she has her moments.

[Malcy]

Garak - In the Pale Moonlight "It would mean calling in all my favours."

Apparently not. Garak has a bottomless pit of contacts on Cardassia. Bah I'm being pedantic. Garak keeps his cards close to his chest and he's a strategic bullshitter. Good episodes. The klingon political stuff was interesting. Makes a change from the TNG days.

Yeah the calling in the favours line is obviously another Garak lie. It's a piece of piss to do it but he wants Sisko to think otherwise.

[oy vey]

Those dead operatives he contacts in ITPM may have been part of his plan to escalate to manufacturing the data rod. He probably bullshited about contacting them. The Dominion security hasn't been so efficient the past few episodes. Or Garak had them killed to keep everything consistent. If this was any other character I'd say we're into fan masturbation territory, but this Garak we're talking about.

Meanwhile, I think Laas must have the shapeshifter disease. Anyone give a fuck?

[Wonderful Butternut]

I think you're right that Garak never called in any favours in "In the Pale Moonlight", he just told Sisko he tried to and anyone he contacted was bumped off to set the whole thing up.

Bashir mentions that biomemetic gel, which they used to "pay" for the Cardassian data rod, can be used to make organic explosives. But I bet Garak already had the Cardassian data rod. He only needed Tolar to make the holo forgery. The rest was a ruse so Sisko would give him the gel in the belief he needed it to pay for the data rod, and he instead used the gel to make an organic explosive with which he blew up Vreenak's ship.

[purlieu]

Extreme Measures. Well, I really never imagined that, two episodes before the very end of the series, they'd have an episode about Bashir and O'Brien going on a comedy road trip through a guest character's mind. Lovely stuff.

[Chairman Yang]

I was doing the washing up and thinking about In the Pale Moonlight, as you do, and isn't Garak telling Sisko all his men are dead the exact same lie he suggests Sisko tell Vreenak later on? 'Dozens of good men gave their lives, that sort of thing...'

It really wouldn't surprise me if there's an entire Garak's Version of that story.

[oy vey]

Been waiting ages for this... Extreme Measures.

[purlieu]

Haha.

The Dogs of War. I like that they've tied up some of the lighter ends of the show - the Ferengi stuff, Bashir and Dax - there so the finale can get down to some serious shit. Something about Damar becoming a saviour-type character is unsettling and quite funny. Odo's points about the Federation accepting Section 31's plan regardless were excellent, and show just how far this is from the original vision of the Star Trek universe. I'm sure Gene was rolling in his grave, but it makes for great viewing.

[oy vey]

Extreme Measures with Trevor Eve is an interesting one. It's played for comedy, while being quite morbid on the face of it. I suppose no-one gives a shit about a genocidal black-ops cunt so fair enough. Interestingly his mind looks like DS9 which worked out well for the budget. I did like it though.

The Dogs of War wraps up the Ferengi stuff well enough, though they've succeeded in humanizing yet another race. Or is it the inevitable progression of an overly greedy sexist society?