Labour Party Desolation v2: a beige loafer stamping on a human face forever

[pancreas]

Will any of us be left by the end? Stay tuned to find out.

[Ferris]

Will any of us be left by the end? Stay tuned to find out.

Keir was never "left" to begin with, eh readers?!

[machotrouts]

Well I, for one, am delighted to hear we've finally Drawn A Line Under Antisemitism!

All sorted now. Plain sailing from here on in! 🙂

[notjosh]

Does anyone have any theories why Ware is crapping on with this libel against Corbyn? I get that Ware probably feels the confidence and impunity of having swathes of the establishment behind him. But still, isnt there a gamble here? Imagine if the libel case against Corbyn fails.  Wouldn't it risk being a real life Wizard of Oz moment for the Beeb and current leadership?

Just read a twitter thread suggesting that Panorama's editorial process is so rigorous that it's almost impossible for anything to slip through which can't be legally defended:
https://twitter.com/WillardFoxton/status/1286245519417901056

From what I've read about the documentary, it seems like there may be a lot of omissions and misleading context, but not a lot which can be pointed to as outright untruth. Can't be bothered looking into it any more though to be honest.

[EOLAN]

Just read a twitter thread suggesting that Panorama's editorial process is so rigorous that it's almost impossible for anything to slip through which can't be legally defended:
https://twitter.com/WillardFoxton/status/1286245519417901056

From what I've read about the documentary, it seems like there may be a lot of omissions and misleading context, but not a lot which can be pointed to as outright untruth. Can't be bothered looking into it any more though to be honest.

A long thorough (by Twitter standards) layout of why the BBC legal process is so thorough. Of which I am sure it is. Then a quick line just saying the Labour lawyers must obviously be money-grabbing incompetents giving obviously wrong advise on the case; implying  it has to be because the BBC legal system is so great; even though that had nothing to do with the case being bought.

[NoSleep]

I know some others have mentioned forming another party, but is that the way forward from here? What's Momentum going to be from hereon, now that the likelihood of a left wing government in the UK has started to look less likely? Could Momentum be a better focus than joining another party at this point, a kind of united left movement, or is it too tied to Labour/Corbyn?

[jobotic]

I don't know how reliable it is but here's a guide to the NEC election groups for those of you still members of this Party of Cunts

https://labourlist.org/2020/07/over-170-members-are-standing-in-labours-nec-elections-who-are-they/

[holyzombiejesus]

You have to be a Labour member to be in Momentum, I think.

[Ghostly Pale]

Yes the 2 are combined

It's a toughie for sure. There's always the vote splitting argument. But perhaps the Blue Tories, red Tories and yellow Tories would just carry on wanking Murdoch and his ilk to squabble over the same votes in Stoke or whatever whilst a new progressive party made headway. Wishful thinking on my part though probably, if history is anything to go by.

[jobotic]

A lot of this would depend on whether they do chuck Jezza out and he isn't too exhausted to carry on.

[bgmnts]

Corbyn has been the prolonged victim of one of the most brazen and shameless smear campaigns in political history.

He surely cannot carry on.

[BlodwynPig]

A long thorough (by Twitter standards) layout of why the BBC legal process is so thorough. Of which I am sure it is. Then a quick line just saying the Labour lawyers must obviously be money-grabbing incompetents giving obviously wrong advise on the case; implying  it has to be because the BBC legal system is so great; even though that had nothing to do with the case being bought.

Here is a handy explainer

https://youtu.be/RaqNEHuTf7Q?t=2987

[NoSleep]

You have to be a Labour member to be in Momentum, I think.

Yes. It still makes the most sense to seek to do something from within the Labour Party rather than start out afresh elsewhere, however daunting that looks right now.

[pigamus]

Getting pretty nasty now.

https://www.thejc.com/comment/opinion/the-corbynites-have-lied-with-impunity-now-they-face-the-legal-consequences-1.501782

[Famous Mortimer]

Yes. It still makes the most sense to seek to do something from within the Labour Party rather than start out afresh elsewhere, however daunting that looks right now.

I disagree. I draw your attention, again, to your comments before the 2019 election, where you were absolutely certain that, because Corbyn supporters had control of the NEC and lots of power in the party, that never again would the Labour Party be drawn to the right.

The chances of anyone like Corbyn getting anywhere close to being elected is effectively nil. Partly because they'd never allow someone like him on the ballot again, with rule changes and backroom deals and suchlike, partly because they just don't have any MPs like him any more to even try and get on the ballot. And they will use the media slaughter of him as evidence, too.

The political activity of the RMT is a pretty interesting indicator of what left-wingers who are opposed to Labour could do. If you're a left-winger, the Labour Party does not represent you, and aside from a few years here and there, has not represented you in a long time.

[Buelligan]

Yes. It still makes the most sense to seek to do something from within the Labour Party rather than start out afresh elsewhere, however daunting that looks right now.

I'm beginning to think twice.  Let's face it, we had the leader and the McDonnell and Labour's infestation still managed to destroy that.  They fucked Scotland.  My feeling is that they're there to fuck all hope.  And they'll continue. 

There are so many people who really care, the Corbyn Just Give fund is up to £40K in less than a day with no media exposure at all, should we continue pissing it into the wind?  Wouldn't it be more effective to take off the gloves now?

[pancreas]

Inclined to agree. I want them to kick out Corbyn.

[NoSleep]

I disagree. I draw your attention, again, to your comments before the 2019 election, where you were absolutely certain that, because Corbyn supporters had control of the NEC and lots of power in the party, that never again would the Labour Party be drawn to the right.

The chances of anyone like Corbyn getting anywhere close to being elected is effectively nil. Partly because they'd never allow someone like him on the ballot again, with rule changes and backroom deals and suchlike, partly because they just don't have any MPs like him any more to even try and get on the ballot. And they will use the media slaughter of him as evidence, too.

The political activity of the RMT is a pretty interesting indicator of what left-wingers who are opposed to Labour could do. If you're a left-winger, the Labour Party does not represent you, and aside from a few years here and there, has not represented you in a long time.

I didn't say it would be easy, but it's still the surest way to a left wing government in the country (and unbelievable that many Corbyn supporters could see nothing wrong in voting for Luke Warmer). All other channels are going to be way harder than that.

[NoSleep]

Inclined to agree. I want them to kick out Corbyn.

Where to from there? Standing on the sidelines forever?

[pigamus]

I think a new party could work if you target just a few winnable seats - hell, maybe even just one. If you can get even one seat under FPTP with all the odds against you that's a major step towards being credible - obviously it makes a big difference to the Greens having Caroline Lucas in parliament - but if you spread yourself too thinly then FPTP will absolutely bumrape you.

[pancreas]

I think a new party could work if you target just a few winnable seats - hell, maybe even just one. If you can get even one seat under FPTP with all the odds against you that's a major step towards being credible - obviously it makes a big difference to the Greens having Caroline Lucas in parliament - but if you spread yourself too thinly then FPTP will absolutely bumrape you.

Bristol West for example.

[NoSleep]

What if all the people who leave the Labour Party over this don't agree to form one party? And I don't think having a shot in one constituency is going to give credibility to a party; you'd have to make more of a wave than that, and the shit would naturally start to fly against a left-wing party, because the establishment are afraid of that.

[Sebastian Cobb]

There's always the worry it'll turn out like a more lentilly version of tinge.

[NoSleep]

With even less clout.

[idunnosomename]

IDENTITY POLITICS???

IN THE FUCKING JEWISH CHRONICLE!!??


and a bonus



now bonkers boner boris is in the real fash can go WILD

[holyzombiejesus]

If When I leave the party, I think I'm just going to try and turn my back on politics. I'm done.

[Ferris]

There's always the worry it'll turn out like a more lentilly version of tinge.

Yeah that's my feeling. Left wing nandos desolation.

[jobotic]

If When I leave the party, I think I'm just going to try and turn my back on politics. I'm done.

I can't go more than five minutes without looking at something political online. Driving me insane. You can't pretend it's not happening but i so want to. For a bit.

[bgmnts]

If When I leave the party, I think I'm just going to try and turn my back on politics. I'm done.

Then the emperor has already won.

[Buelligan]

If people are done, why not throw it all in on one last push?  If we're giving in anyway?

I believe John Ware worked for The Sun in the past so he knows a bit about reasonable fair political discourse and truth and that.