Chart Music Podcast 2 (Man Sound) - ITS PIPOU TIME!

[boki]

Quite surprised to learn that 70 Gwen Party did three Peel Sessions.  I assumed from the way the lads talked about them bombarding the MM with demos that they never got beyond that stage.

[Pauline Walnuts]

4.

[Crabwalk]

I have been inside Cheryl Baker's house and can exclusively reveal that

1) It looks like it was

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decorated in the 90s

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and
2) She's a

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Daily Express

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subscriber

She is nice though.

[Rizla]

The name doesn't ring a bell I'm afraid. Not to say that our paths haven't crossed at some point but he seems to have left as much of an impression on me as I undoubtedly have on him.

Ah soz. Well I'm sure it was someone on here who used to be a newshound of some description - some joke about his name sounding like a lumberjack's warning cry.

[buzby]

Loved Taylor's TV pitch ideas and his first crush story (which then got a nice callback to Peanuts). Not surprised people from ATVLand don't remember Rock Around The Dock, but it's fondly remembered in Granadaland. It was actually made to celebrate Granada opening their first location Liverpool, when they moved their news studio to the newly-restored Albert Dock, much to Tony Wilson's chagrin (followed a couple of years later by the This Morning studio elsewhere in the dock warehouse). I've mentioned before on here that The Damned's performance of Eloise with the Liverpool Phil orchestra was far superior to to the version they put out, but the audio from it has never been released (presumably because it was owned by Granada).

Granada had put on something similar a couple of years earlier with New Brghton Rock, which was recorded at the New Brighton open-air baths (now a Morrisons, sadly).

[boki]

4.

Fuck my hat.

[easytarget]

As a huge fan of Cathedral it wasn't fun to hear a tale of Lee Dorian threatening to glass our Neil, he seemed to take it well though.
"I've met posher". Indeed.

[Chriddof]

I had to look up the "Disco Joker" comp mentioned by Neil, and found that

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the Smiths track (which was Panic, as Neil said)

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is at the start of Side B. The same side ends with...

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All Night Holiday by Russ Abbot

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.

Also the artwork reminded me of

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mediocre to actively bad ZX Spectrum / C64 budget software covers. And I did like the bold choice to basically bisect the second word in the logo with some "As Seen On TV" branding (only in Portuguese, obv.)

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. See it all here:

https://www.discogs.com/Various-Disco-Joker/release/2691275

[jamiefairlie]

Another great episode. I genuinely believe Taylor Parkes is the finest and most insightful cultural analyst the UK has. His description of his first crush was so accurate and his dissection of the UK's attitude to sex (as part of the Sam Fox bit) was also bang on. An actual national treasure.

The Housemartins section was a bit of a misfire for me. there seems to be a bit of received wisdom in the group that their shared liking for 80s indie is now something to be embarrassed about and that really it was all about Prince, hip-hop and America. I don't see it that way and, in their own way, Heaton & co were challenging the norms of mid-80s big-hair, leather & lace pomposity in a way that made me feel represented in what felt like a cultural/values battle in which we had few visible symbols to cheer on.

[phantom_power]

They criticised them for almost playing at protest and not being angry enough, or couching their socialism in too much pop but songs like Flag Day, The People Who Grinned Themselves to Death, Build and Sheep are pretty clear in their intentions even if the melodies are poppy. Not every political song has to be McCarthy

[phantom_power]

I think they are completely wrong about Max Headroom, and again in a way that suggests they didn't really watch it. The initial film is a great bit of dystopian sci-fi and the character in the pop video TV series is actually pretty fun, far more than the technological trickery and glitches that they make it out to be. He is wry and funny and most of the criticisms they level at his personality are either completely wrong or deliberately there to be made fun of. It is the curse of the critic, to feel you have to have an opinion on everything, regardless of how ill-remembered it might be to you

[Ballad of Ballard Berkley]

It was a bit like when Pricey had a go at Loadsamoney, in a way that suggested he either never watched him on Friday Night Live or had completely forgotten what the point of the character was. Which is fine insomuch as the gang can't be expected to hold forth knowledgably on every single aspect of popular culture, that's an unreasonable demand, but it does become a bit irksome when they blatantly get something wrong.

The best thing to do in a situation like that would be to explain why you thought the Loadsamoney record was shite, while also pointing out that you don't really remember the character's other appearances on TV. There's no shame in that!

[non capisco]

I was just slightly surprised that Neil had never heard of the Max Headroom signal hijacking incident. I'm almost jealous, what a fascinating thing to be introduced to.

[phantom_power]

I mean Parkes pretty much admitted he didn't watch Headroom at the time because of a misguided idea that it was just "yank stuff like American football" and then proceeds to discuss him at length.

I imagine if you only saw him on adverts and the odd appearance you might think he was shit but at least say that is what you are basing it on and move swiftly on. Don't come up with a dissertation on why he is shit and what it means in popular culture when you are basing it on totally false research

[dr beat]

I don't think they really talked much about Max Headroom did they? Certainly not a dissertation.  A bit 'yeah he was a bit shit cos he's American', the signal hijacking and then a bit about Art of Noise. 

And The Housemartins? The Tribe of Toffs its ok to like if you ask me ;)

[DrGreggles]

The Housemartins were great and Happy Hour is one of the best indie pop singles of the 80s. #HotTake

[Ballad of Ballard Berkley]

I don't think they really talked much about Max Headroom did they? Certainly not a dissertation.  A bit 'yeah he was a bit shit cos he's American', the signal hijacking and then a bit about Art of Noise. 

That's true, the Max Headroom chat was quite brief, but I agree with phantom-power in that, whenever they're confronted with something they don't know much about, it's perfectly okay to admit that.

Although to be fair, Taylor, as you say, did admit that he made a snap judgement about Headroom back in the '80s and never paid much attention to him. And Neil obviously wasn't arsed about him either.

I'm not sure what my point is now...

[dr beat]

I'm not sure that admitting a lack of knowledge and saying I don't know makes for entertaining listening though.  I've been put off by more than one podcast when the hosts say something like 'ok so what do we know about such-and-such? Hmm, well according to IMDB (read it off)'...[nb]Ok I know the CMP lot do admit to using Wikipedia but there's much more else going on[/nb]

I much prefer them articulating their responses to something as they view it [nb](not in 'An American REACTS' way obv)[/nb], as they are an eloquent bunch even if we may not always agree.  And you can't accuse them of never doing their research.  Certainly not Taylor with his paper-shuffling.

[Ballad of Ballard Berkley]

I agree, but the Chart Music format allows plenty of room for discussion of a particular song and performance without them feeling the need to hold forth on tangential aspects they don't know much about. As I say, it's okay to present an opinion while also adding that you're not an expert and as such may have overlooked some wider context.

This is a very minor complaint, and I'm certainly not accusing them of scrimping on research! One of the joys of this podcast is the way they can spark up a conversation about whatever's put in front of them. They never just mumble "Yeah, that was alright I suppose." Heaven forfend.

[non capisco]

Defo think we're due another slightly spiky Sarah and Taylor match up, as much as I love Team ATV and they're pretty much always my favourite episodes the one slight drawback for a historic pop cultural critique podcast is that they agree on everything.

[Ballad of Ballard Berkley]

Yeah, Sarah disagreeing with Taylor is always great. They obviously all get on, but she's the only one who ever says, "No, that's bollocks."

Taylor's misanthropy and forthright opinions are very funny, and I know it's comedically performative to a certain extent, but Sarah is the only member of the gang who challenges him.

[Dusty Substance]

Got pack from an afternoon on the beach yesterday and thought I'd listen to Part One of #59. Five and a half very quick hours later and I'd binge listened to the whole lot.

Taylor and Neil are (I think) my favourite combination and this was another great episode, even if the music line up was less than stellar. Had no idea the

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'Orrible Being Eight and a Half

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song existed and I must have heard the

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WHAM

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song before but don't remember it being a

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Was Not Was

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cover.

[phantom_power]

I don't remember that song but they are wrong (again, sorry) about Edge of Heaven. It is a banger

[Jockice]

They criticised them for almost playing at protest and not being angry enough, or couching their socialism in too much pop but songs like Flag Day, The People Who Grinned Themselves to Death, Build and Sheep are pretty clear in their intentions even if the melodies are poppy. Not every political song has to be McCarthy

McCarthy could be very poppy too. Charles Windsor could easily have been a Housemartins song. I do remember back in the day some ultra-indie types went off the 'Martins as soon as they became a chart band and did things like make silly videos and mess around on TV. The likes of McCarthy though were somehow seen as pure because they didn't have hits. Myself, I loved both bands.

[phantom_power]

Oh yeah I love McCarthy but they were very blatant in their agit-pop stylings and though they could be poppy there was always an uncommercial edge to their music. I saw an old interview with them recently where some of the members seemed to be struggling with the idea of being more commercial to get their message across better or to be "ideologically pure" and just preach to the converted. I think in the end they chose the latter and never really let their pop side flourish.

[EOLAN]

Still have to catch up on latest but finished the David Lee Travis one. Sometimes when I did zone out; I got a little confused as for some reason I thought they were telling an anecdote about John Peel, Kylie Minogue and the band (or lead singer) from Travis getting in an elevator. Rightly taking him down but even in audio format the misogynistic groping of DLT on its own was getting quite exhausting. 

[DrGreggles]

Oh yeah I love McCarthy but they were very blatant in their agit-pop stylings and though they could be poppy there was always an uncommercial edge to their music. I saw an old interview with them recently where some of the members seemed to be struggling with the idea of being more commercial to get their message across better or to be "ideologically pure" and just preach to the converted. I think in the end they chose the latter and never really let their pop side flourish.

McCarthy didn't have songs as good as The Housemartins though, which I suspect was the crucial difference.
Heaton has never always played 'populist', but he could churn out a hit when needed.

[Dusty Substance]

Can not believe there's a band calling themselves "Sly And The Family Drone". The fucking audacity.

[Jockice]

McCarthy didn't have songs as good as The Housemartins though, which I suspect was the crucial difference.
Heaton has never always played 'populist', but he could churn out a hit when needed.

Plus The Housemartins really wanted mainstream success, whereas McCarthy didn't. Heaton wanted his band to sound like a poppier version of the Buzzcocks, which they did. Sometimes.

[Pauline Walnuts]

McCarthy were pop, a slightly adult orientated kinda pop, just like the Housemartins, but they just weren't very good at  it.