Labour Party Desolation v3: Abstainence Makes the Farce Grow Stronger

[Famous Mortimer]

I thought the abstaining 'strategy' was to abstain at this stage but then make amendments - what is the thinking behind abstaining, rather than voting against, if it ends up UNamended?

The thinking is, they have no policies of their own, being the beigest of the beige, and are desperately hoping that if they keep their heads down, in a few years they'll either get cushy directorships or the Tories will implode and they'll luck into being the government.

[George Oscar Bluth II]

Also abstaining you still get the Tories saying "Labour didn't support our efforts to allow Are Brave Boys to commit Good Crimes while undercover protecting you". Did they learn from the benefits vote farce of 2015? Did they fuck. Fair play to everyone who quit.

[Sebastian Cobb]

Also abstaining you still get the Tories saying "Labour didn't support our efforts to allow Are Brave Boys to commit Good Crimes while undercover protecting you". Did they learn from the benefits vote farce of 2015? Did they fuck. Fair play to everyone who quit.

The tories literally did this when they abstained a few weeks ago. If Starmer's actually playing 4d chess like centrists claim he is, he's fucking shit at it.

[Sebastian Cobb]

The results are in, all amendments failed and the bill passed.

https://twitter.com/pmillerinfo/status/1316764123624075265

34 voted against this time.



Nav Mishara has also resigned.

[Shoulders?-Stomach!]

Good on you Baz.

[bgmnts]

Am I being thick or are we genuinely entering the stages of a quasi-totalitarian regime?

[honeychile]

Clive Lewis managed to lay his hands on his soul in the end, i see.

The Labour MPs in that image above are the only members of the PLP who would've joined the resistance in Nazi-occupied territory.

The rest couldn't even be fucked to walk through a corridor to take a stand against state-sanctioned murder, rape, and torture.

[Sebastian Cobb]

[honeychile]

So between this and the abstention on the Overseas Ops bill, that's pledges 4, 7, and 10 all gone. However Keir is adding an 11th pledge, i believe we will all be able to apply for co-ownership of a bridge he's selling.

Worse than Miliband.

[colacentral]

Often enormous crises force a new political reality upon those who  would not otherwise have accepted the need, ideologically or practically.

We have to fight tooth and nail for NEC representation, otherwise find leftwing but ostensibly cross-party causes to back like the environment, universal basic income, even something like assisted dying (not the DWP kind). The left need a trojan horse/wedge issue they can use. They also need a leader.

Sultana?

Either way, if there is even a hint of a charismatic left leader emerging I reckon the left have a narrow chance of toppling Starmer. Realistically we will probably wait til 2024 and find Starmer has done just enough to stay in the job.

Replacing the House of Lords and a new campaign for PR would be popular with a broad range of people. Specifically "replace" not "abolish" as the checks and balances argument is always the obvious counter. They are the unelected corrupt elite that the EU was portrayed as.

Plus environmental concerns and animal rights - even Tories love their cats and dogs. I feel like most people find that a laughable suggestion but animals and animal cruelty are a unifier, and look at how damaging the issue of fox hunting was to Theresa May. It also ties in with the environment in an obvious way. If we're talking about grass roots local campaigns to win people over, appealing to pet owners on issues that they can't dismiss as unpatriotic or classiest would seem a good tactic.

[Shoulders?-Stomach!]

Alex Sobel on Labour's left.. Hmm.. Nope not convinced.

This is the bind though. If you relinquish power Starmer will fill it with some ghoul and the left are further diminished. If you abstain to stay in the cabinet you can't scrub your soul clean. Corbyn never did this, even on Brexit. Starmer is a bastard.

[Sebastian Cobb]

Abstention still results in tory attacks as if they'd voted against. Doesn't seem good morally or tactically.

[king_tubby]

[Famous Mortimer]

Abstention still results in tory attacks as if they'd voted against. Doesn't seem good morally or tactically.

It's never worked as a political strategy. Spineless, worthless fucks, every one of them.

[jobotic]

Have you learned nothing? The only way to fight fascists is to help them get everything they want and save your attacks for their enemies.

[Consignia]

I reckon Keith's learning his lessons from Nietzsche, "Beware that, when fighting facists, you yourself do not become a facist". By doing the opposite, he's the furthest thing from a facist.

[Cuellar]

Starmer had wanted Labour MPs to abstain on the bill once their amendments were defeated, arguing that statutory regulation of informants' conduct would have been necessary if the party had been in power.

What does that mean

[holyzombiejesus]

So between this and the abstention on the Overseas Ops bill, that's pledges 4, 7, and 10 all gone. However Keir is adding an 11th pledge, i believe we will all be able to apply for co-ownership of a bridge he's selling.

Worse than Miliband.

You could also argue that numbers 1 (Increase income tax for the top 5% of earners), 5 (Common ownership), 6 (Defend migrants' rights) and 9 (Equality) have gone.

[Fabian Thomsett]

'Centrists' are gonna get us all killed.

[Sebastian Cobb]

You could also argue that numbers 1 (Increase income tax for the top 5% of earners), 5 (Common ownership), 6 (Defend migrants' rights) and 9 (Equality) have gone.

You could argue, they're all gone given they've basically been put out of sight in favour of vague platitudes about 'british values' and how the tories are 'holding the country back' and the only time they're ever mentioned at all is when a disgruntled leftie digs them out to point out he's reneged on yet another one.

[jobotic]

I'll be looking round my next Branch Committee meeting trying to work out which one us is actually from the Foods Standards Agency and has licence to rape and kill the rest of us.




no, its impossible to try and be funny about this.

[olliebean]

On point 1 there, this does rather sound like they're letting all the Tories' worst legislation through in the hope that we'll have to elect Labour to get rid of it.

[bgmnts]

Sunk cost fallacy now isn't it?

[Sebastian Cobb]

They'll not get rid of it.

[Shoulders?-Stomach!]

It's never worked as a political strategy. Spineless, worthless fucks, every one of them.

Abstention can be useful if there's a balance parliament. There were lots of relatively sophisticated chess plays during the Brexit votes, however this rather falls into the shade when compared to abstaining on basic matters of principle and human rights.

[Shoulders?-Stomach!]

Can anyone help out? Around the time of Starmer's leadership ascension there were articles about his connection to something called the Triennial Commission? Now I come to google/bing/ecosia it I appear to have completely fabricated this.

However, as that would be the first such instance in my entire life, I suspect this - or something very similar - is true and I did read a long article from a Labour blogger about them. Was it Triennial something else?

[Zetetic]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trilateral_Commission

No one is going meet every 4 months FFS, not even lizard people living by a subterranean calendar.

[bgmnts]

Can anyone help out? Around the time of Starmer's leadership ascension there were articles about his connection to something called the Triennial Commission? Now I come to google/bing/ecosia it I appear to have completely fabricated this.

However, as that would be the first such instance in my entire life, I suspect this - or something very similar - is true and I did read a long article from a Labour blogger about them. Was it Triennial something else?

Trilateral Commission maybe?

[honeychile]

What does that mean

Starmer's iota of a sensible point is that due to the conduct of undercover operatives and informants being a legal grey area at the moment which the courts have picked up on, statutory regulation of such activity is necessary.

But his argument is that regardless of the amendments failing "at least it's now codified", despite the fact that the codification removes the grey areas for the worse, not the better.

[idunnosomename]

Kier Starmer is a cop.


Made of ham.

half man, half ham

all cop