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Labour Party Desolation v3: Abstainence Makes the Farce Grow Stronger

Started by BlodwynPig, October 07, 2020, 06:42:38 PM

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Zetetic

Quote from: Paul Calf on November 22, 2020, 12:25:50 PM
The possibility of an alternative to starvation within the system that we currently inhabit, or an alternative to it, has to come before you kick the existing support away.
Okay. I'm not sure that there's a genuinely meaningful link back to grid girls from this though.

Zetetic

Interesting see Sarkar and Bastani react so badly to some Northerners arguing they too should have basic services and infrastructure, although it's getting them to just about engage with the owner-occupier question.


TrenterPercenter

Quote from: Zetetic on November 22, 2020, 04:12:19 PM
Interesting see Sarkar and Bastani react so badly to some Northerners arguing they too should have basic services and infrastructure, although it's getting them to just about engage with the owner-occupier question.

Really, where have they said this? (is it a Brexit thing?)

TrenterPercenter

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/nov/22/labour-infighting-inquiry-damaging-starmers-position

Interesting, both in itself and the way the Guardian is reporting it. 


EDIT: just realised these shenanigans are quite interesting politically in the light of Patels bullying evidence.

Shoulders?-Stomach!


BlodwynPig

Quote from: Shoulders?-Stomach! on November 22, 2020, 05:03:51 PM
Good luck Kieth mate.


This was shared by Jewish Voice For Peace today:
https://www.972mag.com/holocaust-antisemitism-israel-tool/

Pure evil, these people. Yet we wave the white flag, shake their hands and transform the opposition into a useful arm of ethnofascism in the name of "The Holocaust".

Zetetic

Quote from: TrenterPercenter on November 22, 2020, 04:27:49 PM
Really, where have they said this? (is it a Brexit thing?)

It's a "someone said something about regional inequality" thing, as far as I can tell, provoking a bunch of tweets along the lines of "but Grenfell", "but home ownership in Northern corpse towns" and "but child poverty in Hackney" which are both 1) not entirely unreasonable points more widely and 2) not really addressing the issue of regional inequality (and centralisation of power in the UK).

Edit: Still, gratifying to see Sarkar saying this:
QuoteI think the spread of home ownership across the country - in particular, where's there's high levels of home ownership plus high deprivation - goes a long way to explaining Labour's fractured electoral coalition.

Edit: Don't think either of them have quite got to grips with actually whether the UK's focus on agglomeration into a single city is part of the problem both for London and everywhere else.

Sebastian Cobb




Fair play to Leanne Wood, she didn't really need to do this at all, but did anyway.

BlodwynPig

She would be a good Labour leader, non? At least if we had the borders on that Cymru map that bgmnts posted.

lipsink

Quote from: TrenterPercenter on November 22, 2020, 02:42:01 PM
Btw did people see the Frankie Boyles interview with Sarkar - was really interesting.

I dunno if I can be arsed listening to Frankie Boyle. I'm not really buying his suddenly 'woke' re-invention. Particularly after all the horrible cunty things he said in the past.

TrenterPercenter

Quote from: Sebastian Cobb on November 22, 2020, 05:17:49 PM



Fair play to Leanne Wood, she didn't really need to do this at all, but did anyway.

Yeah I think she would and there isn't much to choose from currently.

I just tuned into 5 minutes of the Owen Jones Show stream which has on Nadia Whitmore and John McTernan.  I just turned off as Whitmore was very boringly repeating herself about how people didn't want an autocracy but pluralism.  She is a good egg there is no doubt but it's dull and repetative, like I say I just switched off after 5 minutes as I'd heard her say the same things 3 times by then (same with the other Nadia Gebrail on Novara she often just repeats herself stringing out points over 6-7 minutes by saying the same things again and again).  As someone else mentioned it's content filler but they should realise that a lot of the time less is more.


Johnny Yesno

Quote from: lipsink on November 22, 2020, 05:42:40 PM
I dunno if I can be arsed listening to Frankie Boyle. I'm not really buying his suddenly 'woke' re-invention. Particularly after all the horrible cunty things he said in the past.

It's a good interview.

TrenterPercenter

Quote from: lipsink on November 22, 2020, 05:42:40 PM
I dunno if I can be arsed listening to Frankie Boyle. I'm not really buying his suddenly 'woke' re-invention. Particularly after all the horrible cunty things he said in the past.

He does address that in the interview as it happens.

Johnny Yesno

Quote from: Sebastian Cobb on November 22, 2020, 05:17:49 PM



Fair play to Leanne Wood, she didn't really need to do this at all, but did anyway.

Yeah, she's great.

honeychile

I don't doubt that with a ton of disillusioned Corbyn-supporters out there and Senedd elections coming, Wood can probably sense the chance to pick up a lot of soft support from previous Labour voters. But even so, she's going way further there than any other prominent british politican has had the guts to and it feels pretty liberating to see someone do it.


BlodwynPig

Quote from: TrenterPercenter on November 22, 2020, 05:43:33 PM
Yeah I think she would and there isn't much to choose from currently.

I just tuned into 5 minutes of the Owen Jones Show stream which has on Nadia Whitmore and John McTernan.  I just turned off as Whitmore was very boringly repeating herself about how people didn't want an autocracy but pluralism.  She is a good egg there is no doubt but it's dull and repetative, like I say I just switched off after 5 minutes as I'd heard her say the same things 3 times by then (same with the other Nadia Gebrail on Novara she often just repeats herself stringing out points over 6-7 minutes by saying the same things again and again).  As someone else mentioned it's content filler but they should realise that a lot of the time less is more.

Dalia was incredible on Friday. It was my first beer for weeks (9%) and I was drunk, but it felt like I had entered the spiritual world, such was the power of her words.

TrenterPercenter

Each to their own I guess.  I've nothing personal against her.

greencalx

This update on Starmer's inquiry into that leaked report has slipped out quietly https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/nov/22/labour-infighting-inquiry-damaging-starmers-position

Quote
Concerns have now emerged over the scale and unpredictability of the independent inquiry, which insiders fear has taken on "a life of its own". It is understood to have received hundreds of submissions. Party figures said the inquiry was going "anywhere and everywhere".

Another said: "We have created a real millstone here. This could be sorted out, frankly, in a few weeks, but the inquiry seems to be looking at everything. It's become a nightmare."

Given that unattributed sources in the Labour Party always hail from the right, it would seem that this has got the wind up them. I was expecting a bit of a whitewash...

BlodwynPig



TrenterPercenter

Quote from: greencalx on November 22, 2020, 07:24:00 PM
This update on Starmer's inquiry into that leaked report has slipped out quietly https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/nov/22/labour-infighting-inquiry-damaging-starmers-position

Given that unattributed sources in the Labour Party always hail from the right, it would seem that this has got the wind up them. I was expecting a bit of a whitewash...

Yep posted this upthread - them sounding a bit rattled is what I was alluding too.

thugler

Quote from: greencalx on November 22, 2020, 07:24:00 PM
This update on Starmer's inquiry into that leaked report has slipped out quietly https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/nov/22/labour-infighting-inquiry-damaging-starmers-position

Given that unattributed sources in the Labour Party always hail from the right, it would seem that this has got the wind up them. I was expecting a bit of a whitewash...

The guardian at it again in that article: 'Corbyn was suspended as a party member for suggesting that allegations of antisemitism in the Labour party had been "dramatically overstated for political reasons" by opponents and the media.'

Conviniently missing out the word scale which changes the meaning entirely.

BlodwynPig


TrenterPercenter

Quote from: thugler on November 22, 2020, 07:47:49 PM
The guardian at it again in that article: 'Corbyn was suspended as a party member for suggesting that allegations of antisemitism in the Labour party had been "dramatically overstated for political reasons" by opponents and the media.'

Conviniently missing out the word scale which changes the meaning entirely.

I have this battle with friends all the time.  They read stuff like this and react, I point out how they have subtley misrepresented things, they get defensive over not realising it and start saying "yes but it's basically the same thing and anyway what do think it is a conspiracy?".

Is it a conspiracy that the media lies and are very good at it.  No that's just the way it is and always has been.

It is amazing then listening to them complain about Brexit and Trump where press manipulation is of course recognised an accepted.  I think some media outlets become mental crutches for people, they do the job of thinking for them, questioning if that is reliable appears to be upsetting and for some reasons personal for most people.


BlodwynPig