When there's no more room in hell ...

[The Mollusk]

Isn't the original Dawn of the Dead just the most marvellous horror film ever made? I watched it last night for the millionth time and I can never tire of it, it's such a fucking trip. It doesn't just set the precedent for all the other zombie films that would follow it, it manages to have a rollicking good time doing it, and executes every single move with such effortlessly deft precision that even despite the (knowing) goofy bits, I'd say it's impossible for anyone who understands cinema to not be swept up in its thrall.

My favourite type of media is that which can exude a masterful knowledge of the craft but to never take itself too seriously, and Dawn of the Dead is surely the epitome of that. It manages to perfectly juggle a number of serious social commentaries in a grizzly, pioneering horror that's also a cool buddy action flick and a bleak character drama whilst throwing in some genuinely great comedy moments for the sheer fuck of it.

It's insanely quotable and almost every scene is iconic but one of the real standouts for me is when Francine and Steven emulate a nice evening in a restaurant which ends in disappointment, cutting to a shot of the couple jaded and completely burnt out in bed together as Simon Park's superb library music track Sun High plays out. Chills, mate. Chills every time.

[bgmnts]

"We got this man! We got this by the ass!" is still something I say.

I like how the film starts big time, with the newsroom in a state of chaos.

Props to the remake as well, a totally different film but very gripping and intense (with the best dvd extras ever made).

[The Mollusk]

I saw the remake at the cinema but never revisited it. I remember it being ... quite good? I'm one of those twats who doesn't like running zombies though.

If we wanna get into Romero remakes though, Tom Savini's 1990 version of Night of the Living Dead sweeps the board.

[Glebe]

It's fucking great, yeah.

[Bad Ambassador]

Showed it to my mum last year. Apart from closing her eyes when the zombie lad gets his head exploded, she quite liked it.

[The Mollusk]

Showed it to my mum last year. Apart from closing her eyes when the zombie lad gets his head exploded, she quite liked it.

It was my partner's first time watching it last night. She's very squeamish but loves daft action flicks so I sold her on the premise of Peter and Roger's relationship. There wasn't enough time for her to turn away in horror when the shock reveal of the head explosion happened, and I sort of felt bad for not giving warning. But it's a classic moment! And I did warn her more further on about the other particularly grim or jumpy bits.

[Claude the Racecar Driving Rockstar Super Sleuth]

I am resigned to no one ever agreeing with me on this, but I think it's a bit crap.

[ASFTSN]

Yes, it's obviously amazing. I like the big fat zombies gut squishing on the outside of the mall's windows.

I also really like the "people in green face paint" zombie style in this, a different flavour altogether to probably the most convincing zombie makeup ever (Day) but still great.

[ASFTSN]

"We got this man! We got this by the ass!" is still something I say.

I like how the film starts big time, with the newsroom in a state of chaos.

Props to the remake as well, a totally different film but very gripping and intense (with the best dvd extras ever made).

I remember thinking the remake was a bit shit (zombie baby, running zombies, come on lads). What's so good about th DVD extras?

[bgmnts]

I remember thinking the remake was a bit shit (zombie baby, running zombies, come on lads). What's so good about th DVD extras?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SLZ0J6-Y3oA&ab_channel=gjk-2015

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vciSDOhaCS0&ab_channel=SiniestroVisi%C3%B3n3.1

[lipsink]

The only thing I don't quite like is the blood just looks a bit like too much like red paint. The effects in Day of The Dead are much better but that film isn't half as good as Dawn.

[druss]

I am resigned to no one ever agreeing with me on this, but I think it's a bit crap.

I watched it in the early 2000s, after the remake I think. The effects are so bad that it doesn't even feel like a horror film. It's enjoyable but the zombies look utterly ridiculous so there's no fear there, which is usually what you want from a horror film.

From memory it seems like one of those of it's time films which is hugely influential and well made, but in the present day it fails in the most basic aspect of horror, ie. it isn't at all scary.

Maybe I should give it another go, haven't seen it since I was a teenager. I usually prefer older horror films.

[The Mollusk]

I am resigned to no one ever agreeing with me on this, but I think it's a bit crap.

Oh? Why's that then? (Genuinely eager to know, please tell.)

The only thing I don't quite like is the blood just looks a bit like too much like red paint. The effects in Day of The Dead are much better but that film isn't half as good as Dawn.

I've banged on about this plenty of times before on here, but this is the sort of thing I really like. Well, "really like" isn't the best way of describing my preference, but the unreality of the bright red soupy blood is a trope I greatly admire in vintage horror. I'm not sure whether or not Tom Savini was intending to make the blood look as realistic as possible and this was the result, but this (perhaps inadvertent) detachment from total realism is part of why I like certain horror films so much. I don't go into it wanting to see something that looks like it could happen in real life. There's something cartoonish about it which somehow makes what I'm seeing even more mind-bending and grotesque. The same thing could be said about the cream pie fight scene in this film, I suppose, in that it makes me guffaw in a sort of bemused terror like "What the FUCK is going on? WHY is that happening?"

[Bad Ambassador]

One of the zombies crowding outside the mall isn't wearing any make-up, so I like to think it's just a bloke who hasn't realised the apocalypse has happened and is just politely waiting with everyone else for the stores to open.

[Claude the Racecar Driving Rockstar Super Sleuth]

Oh? Why's that then? (Genuinely eager to know, please tell.)

Basically, I think the opposite of everything you said in your opening post. It's just generally naff (especially the score) and the satirical subtext that everyone creams their slacks over could be scribbled on a postage stamp: They think the shopping centre is great, but it's actually a death trap. Woo-blinking-hoo.

Day of the Dead is superior in every technical way and is no less insightful about post-Vietnam American hawkishness than Dawn is about consumerism.

[The Mollusk]

One of the zombies crowding outside the mall isn't wearing any make-up, so I like to think it's just a bloke who hasn't realised the apocalypse has happened and is just politely waiting with everyone else for the stores to open.

I watched it in the early 2000s, after the remake I think. The effects are so bad that it doesn't even feel like a horror film. It's enjoyable but the zombies look utterly ridiculous so there's no fear there, which is usually what you want from a horror film.

From memory it seems like one of those of it's time films which is hugely influential and well made, but in the present day it fails in the most basic aspect of horror, ie. it isn't at all scary.

Without wanting to echo my previous post too much, I'll elaborate a bit more here.

At (blue) face value, I don't find the zombies in Dawn of the Dead particularly scary either, but that's not really the point for me any more. The ends justify the means with this film, in that it's the entire scenario which is scary, and the events which take place are depicted brilliantly, especially in terms of pacing. You're thrown right into the pandemonium as soon as the titles appear, and despite the characters seemingly thinking they've stumbled on a goldmine soon after, things just progressively get worse.

The creeping dread never goes away, and in spite of this, it's basic human arrogance which is their undoing. The underlying vibe of the whole film is pretty horrible to watch unfold, and the scope of the situation in how the characters realise "it's everywhere" is portrayed really well.

Also just gonna massively disagree that the effects are "bad". They're fucking great, and loads of fun.

[Claude the Racecar Driving Rockstar Super Sleuth]

They look like they're made of plasticine.

[The Mollusk]

Basically, I think the opposite of everything you said in your opening post. It's just generally naff (especially the score) and the satirical subtext that everyone creams their slacks over could be scribbled on a postage stamp: They think the shopping centre is great, but it's actually a death trap. Woo-blinking-hoo.

Day of the Dead is superior in every technical way and is no less insightful about post-Vietnam American hawkishness than Dawn is about consumerism.

We'll just have to agree to disagree then. I think the score rules. Goblin's contributions go without saying, but even the other tracks seem to suit it bizarrely well for me. I really appreciate the humorous tone some of the tracks set, which is obviously intentional. The only bit of the soundtrack that doesn't sit well with me is right at the end when Peter has a change of heart and there's this sudden blast of super heroic classical music. One of the most unforgivingly cheesy parts of the whole film.

I don't believe people are uh creaming their, erm... slacks? over the satirical commentary. If they're anything like me, they just appreciate it as one of the many levels of a film which fires in all directions and scores high on every target. A lot of classic horror has a political or satirical subtext so it's certainly not groundbreaking in that regard, it's just pulled off really nicely.

Day is indeed technically more superior, (and, similar to Dawn, it's quite remarkable how well it works as a high-concept horror) but for all my previous reasoning, personally I don't think that makes it a "better" film.

[Claude the Racecar Driving Rockstar Super Sleuth]

They're wiping it on the curtains.

[phantom_power]

It isn't a scary film but it is full of dread and nihilism and just the sheer inevitability of succumbing to the zombie threat. I don't know how it manages it but for some reason it makes the idea of becoming a zombie so bleak and awful, worse than merely dying. I know it has been done before and since but the bits where the heroes meet their friends who are now zombies is so much more effective than those other films for some reason.

[druss]

Without wanting to echo my previous post too much, I'll elaborate a bit more here.

At (blue) face value, I don't find the zombies in Dawn of the Dead particularly scary either, but that's not really the point for me any more. The ends justify the means with this film, in that it's the entire scenario which is scary, and the events which take place are depicted brilliantly, especially in terms of pacing. You're thrown right into the pandemonium as soon as the titles appear, and despite the characters seemingly thinking they've stumbled on a goldmine soon after, things just progressively get worse.

The creeping dread never goes away, and in spite of this, it's basic human arrogance which is their undoing. The underlying vibe of the whole film is pretty horrible to watch unfold, and the scope of the situation in how the characters realise "it's everywhere" is portrayed really well.

Also just gonna massively disagree that the effects are "bad". They're fucking great, and loads of fun.

You had me with this post and made me want to revisit it, and then the gif you posted reminded me why I found it a bit naff.

I'll still probably give it a go when I get a couple of hours this week, it's nearly Halloween after all.

[ASFTSN]

so there's no fear there, which is usually what you want from a horror film.

I'm probably not eloquent enough and don't know enough about film theory to articulate on why, but I don't think this is always the case for me.

[druss]

Yeah maybe. I've seen horror films that haven't been scary but have interested me enough that I've enjoyed them.

This seems to be leaning towards me rewatching Dawn of the Dead and being blown away by an amazing film.

[The Mollusk]

I'm probably not eloquent enough and don't know enough about film theory to articulate on why, but I don't think this is always the case for me.

I did attempt to write something similar and tried to compare it to my recent thinking that a comedy doesn't need to make you laugh out loud in order to be considered a comedic success.

I actually don't like to be scared shitless, and the aspects of a horror I find more enticing are things that are outside of the realm of my own human imagination, brooding psychological weirdness, or even just a really well-told story within the defining parameters of "horror" (which, incidentally, is exactly how I see Dawn of the Dead).

Proper vintage work like Edgar Allen Poe or Jacques Tourneur's films from the 1940s are certainly not fear-inducing to me, but they are deeply intriguing, and the paranoia and "what you don't see" aspects poke away at the mind in a way which is quintessentially "horror".

[Famous Mortimer]

It's definitely my favourite zombie movie, top (very small number) of all horror movies too. The remake is surprisingly excellent (and if the special features are as good as claimed, I might have to spend $20 on that special edition blu-ray from Shout Factory).

[The Mollusk]

Anyone know if the additional material in the "Extended Mall Hours" (shit name) version are worth the extra time investment? The original is just over 2 hours long and there's nary an inch of fat on it, so naturally I was wary about it last night when showing it to someone who's never seen it before.

[Egyptian Feast]

Anyone know if the additional material in the "Extended Mall Hours" (shit name) version are worth the extra time investment? The original is just over 2 hours long and there's nary an inch of fat on it, so naturally I was wary about it last night when showing it to someone who's never seen it before.

I like the extended version, but I know many find the extra material unnecessary. It's the only version I've watched since it became available in the late 90s or thenabouts. I had the 2 hour version on video before that and it was heavily censored (no exploding head for a start), so the excitement of having 20 minutes more of one of my favourite movies may have clouded my judgement. I wouldn't even know now which bits are part of the extra footage, that's just the version I'm used to.

[Famous Mortimer]

I watched the Dario Argento cut most recently and it's fantastic. I really didn't miss any of the scenes he trimmed.

[thenoise]

Watched this as a teenager, desperately tried to like it as I was aware of its cult status via all the web 1.0 horror forums of the time. Didn't click for me I'm afraid¹. Homemade zombie makeup and silly music wasnt what I wanted in a zombie film. Especially from the man behind the peerless (and still terrifying) Night of the Living Dead. I'm tempted to rewatch it based on this thread, but put off by the talk of humour/satire etc. If I didn't find it funny, which I didn't, it's just going to be silliness isn't it?

1. My Dad made stupid remarks throughout, which didnt help.

[phantom_power]

So which is the best version to watch? I have seen it a few times before but no idea which versions I watched. Isn't the Argento one less meandering and more action? How many versions are there? 3? 4?