Watching Withnail

[poodlefaker]

There are a few good scenes in the screenplay that didn't make  the film - getting the Jag serviced and the trip to the off-licence before the holiday spring to mind, but as someone elas has said, the intro and the stage directions are a work of art in themselves.

BR wanted Daniel Day-Lewis for Withnail, iirc, and Kenneth Branagh also auditioned, as did Eddie Tenpole Tudor.

[greenman]

It's a sublime film. I fucking adore it. The screenplay is astonishingly good. I think the more times you watch it, the sadder it gets. Once you're inured to the quotable lines, what's left is a deeply poignant and rather bleak film.

You also start noticing how every little line is perfect, so it's out with "Monty, you terrible cunt!" and in with "We're coming back in here."

I suspect I'm the best at liking the film. In any case, I'll certainly correct anyone on the exact wording of lines, even if you think you know it well. Pancreas will attest to this.

As well known as the script and performances are its also a very well shot film, manages to make the scuzzy London setting and the damp foggy lake district work together.

The Arrow bluray from a few years ago really did help a lot keeping the original grainy scuzzy look.

[Claude the Racecar Driving Rockstar Super Sleuth]

One of my happier memories of school is of the time I convinced my A-level film studies teacher to let us watch this, instead of Local Hero. Annoyingly, however, I got ill and consequently missed the lesson in which it was screened.

Hunter Thompson could have been speaking about it when he wrote

We had all the momentum; we were riding the crest of a high and beautiful wave... So now, less than five years later, you can go up on a steep hill in Las Vegas and look West, and with the right kind of eyes you can almost see the high water mark — that place where the wave finally broke, and rolled back.

just change the place and time.

I've long thought of Withnail & I, Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas and The Big Lebowski as a sort of unofficial trilogy, charting the fall and partial resurgence of the 60s dream. The Thompson quote there matches perfectly with Danny's mournful "They're selling hippie wigs in Woolworths, man."
I've not seen Inherent Vice, but it looks like it could fit the theme too.

[Hand Solo]

I've long thought of Withnail & I, Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas and The Big Lebowski as a sort of unofficial trilogy, charting the fall and partial resurgence of the 60s dream. The Thompson quote there matches perfectly with Danny's mournful "They're selling hippie wigs in Woolworths, man."
I've not seen Inherent Vice, but it looks like it could fit the theme too.

Robinson was asked to direct Fear And Loathing, probably at Depp's insistence, but turned it down after the rigmarole he went through with Hollywood studios doing Jennifer-8. Obviously he went on to do the The Rum Diary a few years ago, again at Depp's insistence, which is based on an unpublished Thompson novel. It's alright really, and charts a similarly putrid death of a dream-type era in the late 50s but more about the 3rd world being carved up by the opulent West, but it doesn't really work with Depp poncing about spitting out Withnailian lines.

I think Mike Leigh's Naked is one of the films that come closest in dialogue, tone and fetid grime. Though Naked is an even darker exploration of it, with many actual instances of rape occurring rather than just the threat.

[Buelligan]

I've long thought of Withnail & I, Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas and The Big Lebowski as a sort of unofficial trilogy, charting the fall and partial resurgence of the 60s dream. The Thompson quote there matches perfectly with Danny's mournful "They're selling hippie wigs in Woolworths, man."

Ah, absolutely!

I was just talking with my lovely brother and he told me that Richard E Grant had been tweeting Withnail and Isolation vignettes during the last lockdown, a few of which he'd seen and loved.  Delightful stuff that can still be watched.  Like this.

[Noodle Lizard]

Just watched it again last night cos of this thread, but I generally watch it at least once a year anyway. It's still brilliant, and amazing that I'm still finding little lines or moments that I never noticed before. The ending and the entropic themes also get to me more and more the older I become.

"We live in an age of weather forecasts, breakfasts that set in ..."

[poodlefaker]

The Rum Diary is pretty terrible, it's like a Johnny Depp vanity project: Withnail and I set in 50s Cuba. Bruce Robinson and Hunter Thompson, together at last. I suppose we should be thankful he didn't remake W&I with Tim Burton.

[greenman]

Depp does really belong in the hall of ham, the difference between him and E Grant here or people like Walken is his performances have nothing but the persona, The Rum Dairy is just a cartoon Hunter S Thompson, it has no anima, no sense of desperation behind the mask the way Withnail does.

[Noodle Lizard]

Depp does really belong in the hall of ham, the difference between him and E Grant here or people like Walken is his performances have nothing but the persona, The Rum Dairy is just a cartoon Hunter S Thompson, it has no anima, no sense of desperation behind the mask the way Withnail does.

The obvious counterpoint to that would be to point out that Raoul Duke in the book is, himself, a cartoon Hunter S. Thompson (likewise with Dr. Gonzo/Oscar Zeta Acosta). It's essentially expressionist fantasy. That being said, I think some of the more somber moments in the film do capture the "desperation" present within the book very well, and Depp did fine with that material.

The Rum Diary is pretty terrible, it's like a Johnny Depp vanity project: Withnail and I set in 50s Cuba. Bruce Robinson and Hunter Thompson, together at last. I suppose we should be thankful he didn't remake W&I with Tim Burton.

I was looking forward to the film version of The Rum Diary for ages, eagerly following its tumultuous production for the best part of five years. This was back when I loved the book (still do), and when Depp was still broadly considered to be a great actor, and who had been declared by Thompson himself to be the only actor capable of playing him. It's worth remembering that Depp was supposedly the one who found the unpublished manuscript of The Rum Diary whilst staying in Thompson's house, and who convinced him to finally put it out there forty odd years after he'd written it (if I remember correctly, Thompson had previously deemed it "too personal" and ignored it after a few initial attempts at publication).

Throwing Bruce Robinson into the mix seemed like a match made in heaven, so I was well on board. After all, it's easily the most straightforward Thompson piece to adapt for the screen, in a way none of his other work is, and the Withnail/Thompson connection had been well-established, rightly or wrongly. But the more I heard about changes to the source material, some dodgy casting choices and Depp's seemingly growing indifference towards preserving its integrity, the less hope I had. When it finally came out, all my worst suspicions were confirmed and then some. Its worst crime is that it's a thoroughly boring piece of work. You couldn't think up a better combination of director and actor to tackle it at the time, so it's astonishing that it turned out to be such a shiter.

It also introduced Johnny Depp to Amber Heard, so I imagine I'm far from the only one who wishes it had never been made.

[the science eel]

Just watched it again last night cos of this thread, but I generally watch it at least once a year anyway. It's still brilliant, and amazing that I'm still finding little lines or moments that I never noticed before. The ending and the entropic themes also get to me more and more the older I become.

"We live in an age of weather forecasts, breakfasts that set in ..."

That particular scene is perfect - the script, the performances, the set. I've never seen or heard anything quite like it.

His monologue is kind of fruity and I expect reading it on paper you might think it wouldn't come off as a spoken piece. But Richard Griffiths is SO good, imbuing it all with a melancholy that works so well within the background (that scene and the film as a whole). You couldn't wish for better casting.

[the science eel]

The Rum Diary is pretty terrible, it's like a Johnny Depp vanity project: Withnail and I set in 50s Cuba. Bruce Robinson and Hunter Thompson, together at last. I suppose we should be thankful he didn't remake W&I with Tim Burton.

There was an April Fool going around this year that they were planning to remake it for the American market. I can't imagine that'll ever happen.

[Noodle Lizard]

That particular scene is perfect - the script, the performances, the set. I've never seen or heard anything quite like it.

His monologue is kind of fruity and I expect reading it on paper you might think it wouldn't come off as a spoken piece. But Richard Griffiths is SO good, imbuing it all with a melancholy that works so well within the background (that scene and the film as a whole). You couldn't wish for better casting.

Griffiths is the best part of the film - an astonishing piece of casting, like you say. He even looks like an illustrated character from some antiquated novel Monty might have read in a disused barn one summer. I can think of other actors who could have feasibly played Withnail and/or I without making too much of a difference, but I can't think of a single person who could have done Monty like Griffiths did.

Seriously, how can you take a line as perfunctory as "Oh, good morning!" from a script and make it so funny?

[the science eel]

Yes!

He always came across as a lovely soul, too. That helps.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=59oHiB6-dCA

[Small Potatoes]

Yes!

He always came across as a lovely soul, too. That helps.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=59oHiB6-dCA

Just listened to that - he really does come across as a top man, doesn't he? Can't remember where I read it, but I do recall reading somewhere that he was extremely sensitive and unhappy about his weight, and even though he was always being cast as obese types, it was forbidden to allude to the character's corpulence either in the script or on set.

EDIT: Just read up on it a bit, apparently he was rail-thin as a kid and his GP prescribed RADIATION TREATMENT to beef him up a bit. As a consequence, he ballooned more or less overnight and was never able to lose it. Fucking hell. Thanks, doc.

[the science eel]

what does he mean by 'breakfasts that set in', anyway?

[Hand Solo]

Here's Viv MacKerrell (inspiration for Withnail) in 1974's Ghost Story: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4jH_sJbhHrM

He's introduced right at the beginning as Duller.

As I recall he also has a small part in a 1971 Play For Today: Edna, The Inebriate Woman as a particularly Danny the Dealer sounding junkie.

[pigamus]

He looks like Sean Bean

[El Unicornio, mang]

Another clip of Viv, although he's more like Danny in this one

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OatOwb3tb2g&ab_channel=lastschicker

[QDRPHNC]

what does he mean by 'breakfasts that set in', anyway?

I always thought it was a reference to the old dishwashing / laundry commercials, that they would get rid of set in food and stains. Like Monty is making fun of new-fangled meaningless marketing speak which now just forms a sizeable percentage of our conversation.

[Noodle Lizard]

what does he mean by 'breakfasts that set in', anyway?

I like that it's ambiguous, but delivered with such emphasis that you somehow know exactly what he's getting at.

I thought it referred to digestion, personally.

[the science eel]

I think his tone is mocking, so QDRPHNC's idea rings true.

I'm going to have to watch it again this weekend.

[Thomas]

I like how awful Danny is. The kind of person who would be consistently awful but then have a grain of kindness - talking I down with confidence and care - that makes you think he's not so bad. He would then immediately return to type. Like Super Hans.

Indeed, Super Hans was inspired by Danny.

The wolves in the final scene of Peep Show, too, seem to be an allusion to Withnail's poignant close. It's a tragic film, innit? With Danny's above-quoted line about hippie wigs, it feels like the/a world is ending. It's an apocalypse movie.

[touchingcloth]

What's the name of Paul McGann's character? Is it I for Ian? Ian Withnail?

[El Unicornio, mang]

Marwood

[Dex Sawash]

I started over and have watched the entire thing. I'm too easily distracted to absorb the opening water boiling setpiece but struggled through that bit. Had to turn subtitles on due to very bad sound on hbomax stream. Will probably watch again soon.

[Icehaven]

What's the name of Paul McGann's character? Is it I for Ian? Ian Withnail?

Marwood

It is although his name's never actually said in the film. Is he called Marwood in the credits?

I love the film and have seen it countless times but I can't remember, other than the very last few scenes is there any moment where Marwood isn't present or about to be/just momentarily in another room etc? I mean from the title of the film it'd make sense if it's completely from Marwood's perspective, and it makes it all the more poignant at the end when he's gone and we're left in Withnail's view. Or could that actually be Marwood imagining what Withnail said after he'd walked away?

[Hand Solo]

It is although his name's never actually said in the film. Is he called Marwood in the credits?

It's ..& I

When the courier delivers the telegram at Crow Crag you can make out Marwood on the letter. There was a misnomer that his name was Peter because of the scene at Monty's where Withnail said "and he's had an audition for Rep," which sounds like "Peter's had an audition for Rep."

[Dex Sawash]

Someone said Marwood when I watched last night. Could be a Mandela thing

[Icehaven]

Someone said Marwood when I watched last night. Could be a Mandela thing

Really? That's mad if it is a Mandela effect as I was sure the name not being used in the film was a whole thing that Bruce Robinson referred to in book of the script, but it's been years since I read it so stand corrected and Mandel-ered if I'm wrong.

[El Unicornio, mang]

Aside from the script and the telegram, the only other place his name is referred to is on the soundtrack, the track "Marwood Walks"