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GVIINNER: cunt's gone bananas

Started by madhair60, December 27, 2020, 07:16:34 PM

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idunnosomename

Quote from: Zetetic on December 29, 2020, 01:22:12 AM
That genuine (if now distant) motivation of feminism and the self-identity of a feminist who is moved by the plight of women is important to understanding his journey, but I'd hesitate to say that being "embroiled" in feminism and a laudable campaign is "the root" of ending up as a disgraced one-note transphobic bully.
well ok, earliest does not necessarily mean causation. and of course it was a very worthy cause at the time. all the worst he turned into a total bully.

stonkers

Quote from: Zetetic on December 29, 2020, 01:22:12 AM
That genuine (if now distant) motivation of feminism and the self-identity of a feminist who is moved by the plight of women is important to understanding his journey, but I'd hesitate to say that being "embroiled" in feminism and a laudable campaign is "the root" of ending up as a disgraced one-note transphobic bully.

Yeah he was the Twitter Policeman for years before he started on the transgender stuff, if there's a root to it's classic bully victim grows up to be the bully.

Zetetic

I'd add that I suspect he probably is genuinely upset by what he is convinced a serious threat that everyone else is ignoring or enabling, hard though that is to square with the narrowness of his perspective[nb]Extremely narrow, noting the response to Shappi Korsandi's endorsement of Let Toys Be Toys, that's already been quoted.[/nb], and that the emotional core of that comes from the same place as what we can recognise as his actual historical feminism.

Ferris

Quote from: Zetetic on December 29, 2020, 01:39:39 AM
I'd add that I suspect he probably is genuinely upset by what he is convinced a serious threat that everyone else is ignoring or enabling, hard though that is to square with the narrowness of his perspective[nb]Extremely narrow, noting the response to Shappi Korsandi's endorsement of Let Toys Be Toys, that's already been quoted.[/nb], and that the emotional core of that comes from the same place as what we can recognise as his actual historical feminism.

Yeah he's definitely a true believer, and also someone who is physically unable to admit they are wrong and must instead double down.

I don't want to speculate on why he is the way he is (he's a human being for fucks sake and I'm no psychologist), but I will say that having a miscarriage (that wouldn't pass naturally and required a medical abortion) was one of the most painful experiences of my life[nb]so far!![/nb] and it has left mental scars on myself and my partner that likely won't heal. [nb]It actually still really upsets me when I think about it, to the point that I wish we'd all stop using "Cassandra's miscarriage!! lmao!!" as a punchline because I'm just not there yet.[/nb]

Twin that with a cancer diagnosis and I really, genuinely, sympathize with him going a bit loopy. The thing I can't understand (and refuse to countenance) is him being a nasty piece of work and bullying other (societally vulnerable) people.

This thread is going to keep tripping me up with my brain pronouncing it "guh-vee-nerr"

guh-wiener

Junket Pumper

A cousin of mine who I've always liked, and who's always been relatively progressive, is completely terfed up. When we last spoke she was spouting every cliche about trans people, some almost directly quoted from Linehan. I recommended a few articles which dissect his lies but I doubt she'll read them. Really infuriating that an obsessed toad like him can poison people's minds without being reigned in at all.

JaDanketies

Quote from: Menu on December 29, 2020, 01:25:27 AM
Yes it's that plus the internet addiction thing, and I think something to do with his cancer scare/losing a testicle. It was the perfect storm for his sanity.

My research agrees that the testicular cancer surgery was the time he pivoted to this cause. He was always a Twitter bell-end and a media-style bullying griefer but he became monomaniacally fixated on the trans menace when he suffered the trauma of cancer and its treatment.

There are a lot of celebrities who are awful to the little people on Twitter. There's a mindset that when someone is critical of you, then it's okay for you to attack them with as much viciousness as possible, and to get your fans to join in. In some cases this might be more justifiable than others - for instance when someone tweets something racist at Ash Sarkar. And everyone on the internet is guilty of it - if someone is mean and insulting then you are mean and insulting back. Arguably it's different when a celeb does it because of the massive power differential.

Glinner still went further than many other celebs though, such as doxing someone and posting a picture of their mother because they criticised one of his sitcoms.  He was always firmly on the bullying-celeb side of Twitter.

tldr some of the unpleasant character traits seem to be pathological but the fixation on trans people seems borne from the trauma of cancer.

DrGreggles

My mate lost a bollock to cancer and has managed to survive without becoming a bigot, so I don't think that's a reason for Glinner's behaviour.
Far more likely that he's always been a cunt and he's gone bananas.

JaDanketies

And I  think that explains why some celebs don't seem to see Glinner in the same light as a normal person. Wossy, for instance, did not recognise that Glinner's behaviour was outrageous bullying because he would've assumed that the little people he was attacking as part of a transphobic hate mob said something mean to Linehan and therefore 'deserved it'.

bigfatheart

It really is the perfect storm of various personality traits of his, coupled with various things that have happened, that seem to have led to this:


  • Long before all this happened, he had that 'Twitter policeman' reputation, which sometimes came from him overzealously supporting progressive causes, but could also come from petty stuff like the whole Giles Coren incident.
  • He is undoubtedly sincere in seeing himself as a feminist, but he does also seem to enjoy being told by women how brilliant he is for being a feminist, so it wasn't hard for TERFs to win him over by flattering his ego.
  • He's always been defensive of his work - the first time I heard about his reputation for being a dickhead on Twitter, it was because he was sulking about somebody somewhere not liking the IT Crowd - which I think comes from a place of insecurity, judging by the Father Ted commentaries, where he's laceratingly self-critical. I can see bits of it in myself, to be honest - being self-critical to try to hide insecurities, which then makes it more hurtful when somebody notices and points out those insecurities - and maybe I'm projecting but I feel Glinner's an extreme case of that.
  • Judging by the IT Crowd episode that kicked it all off, his idea of what transgender people even were seems to have been a little childlike, in the sense that it's "so she's a woman, but she drinks beer and watches football!" - the sort of thing you might think when you're 12 and hearing about sex changes for the first time. As a result, I think there was always a barrier to him taking it seriously, since to him people taking offence would have seemed equally childish. We're well past that now, of course, seeing as he thinks it's an issue about predators trying to get into toilets, but it always meant he was going to side with the people he saw as 'the adults in the room', and that wasn't going to be the TRAs.
  • Since he has always seen himself as being progressive, it probably would have hurt his pride to be told that he's done something offensive, and while you'd think that the sensible reaction would be to reflect, or even just try to ignore it and get on with your life, it does seem to be a common trigger for the whole 'people getting more right-wing as they get older thing'. I suspect it's a big part of why J.K. Rowling has been happy to embrace this, starting with her whole anti-Corbyn thing, which seems to have made her scornful of the young left as a whole. With Glinner it's more extreme but, well, everything he does seems to be more extreme.
  • While I don't think that his cancer fight literally led to an 'I've lost a testicle, ergo I must obsess over everyone else's genitals' mentality, it's hard not to wonder about the effects of that trauma.

There'll definitely be more in there, but I think that's some of the big ones.

Jockice

Quote from: JaDanketies on December 29, 2020, 09:37:32 AM
And I  think that explains why some celebs don't seem to see Glinner in the same light as a normal person. Wossy, for instance, did not recognise that Glinner's behaviour was outrageous bullying because he would've assumed that the little people he was attacking as part of a transphobic hate mob said something mean to Linehan and therefore 'deserved it'.

And there's also the fact that Ross is a cunt. And when I say 'fact' I mean personal opinion. But I'm sure I'm right and that's all that matters.

phes

Fact that he appeared to spend almost his entire life communicating in 280 characters, online, has probably severely harmed any chance he had to escape this radicalisation. He doesn't come face to face with anyone who isn't on his team, meet people as actual human beings, talk to them and connect with them. He'll travel hundreds of miles to the deathbed of a random he's never even met before, but he wont make any effort whatsoever to bring people with differences together. It's just an endless cycle of 280 character angry, pointscoring wars online. Hideous, dehumanising, bullying exchanges. And he's met a lot of verbal abuse, which has just entrenched the position that he's right, and that TRAs and trans people generally are awful and a threat. And now he spends his days compiling 'research' pieces to fit his madness, instead of just talking to people. Because he believes there is no point talking to trans people, because he's pissed away years in flame wars. He is an addict and he is socially inept and i can't see any way out of this for him. He has found a home   

JaDanketies

Quote from: bigfatheart on December 29, 2020, 10:15:10 AM
  • Long before all this happened, he had that 'Twitter policeman' reputation, which sometimes came from him overzealously supporting progressive causes, but could also come from petty stuff like the whole Giles Coren incident.

The Giles Coren incident is when some woman said one of Giles' columns was not as good as his usual output, and Coren replied something along the lines of "shut the fuck up you decrepit old hag." The proles said this was unfair and unreasonable, although lots of Coren's fans piled in on the 'old hag'.

This prompted much naval-gazing amongst Twitter celebs. At the time I believe Charlie Brooker came down on the side of Coren, but I believe his views have since evolved. Glinner wrote some article about it where he compared Twitter to a dinner party and said the woman's unsolicited criticism was shitheaded and she deserved what she got.

This goes some way to explaining how he doesn't recognise that his behaviour is beyond the pale.

Here's a blog someone wrote about Graham Lineham being a pos before he was a terf that goes into further detail.

Shoulders?-Stomach!

Sadly going off the chart unwell and fucked in the head appears to be no obstacle to continuing to find work in the British & Irish media.


idunnosomename

Quote from: phes on December 29, 2020, 10:54:27 AM
Fact that he appeared to spend almost his entire life communicating in 280 characters, online, has probably severely harmed any chance he had to escape this radicalisation. He doesn't come face to face with anyone who isn't on his team, meet people as actual human beings, talk to them and connect with them. He'll travel hundreds of miles to the deathbed of a random he's never even met before, but he wont make any effort whatsoever to bring people with differences together. It's just an endless cycle of 280 character angry, pointscoring wars online. Hideous, dehumanising, bullying exchanges. And he's met a lot of verbal abuse, which has just entrenched the position that he's right, and that TRAs and trans people generally are awful and a threat. And now he spends his days compiling 'research' pieces to fit his madness, instead of just talking to people. Because he believes there is no point talking to trans people, because he's pissed away years in flame wars. He is an addict and he is socially inept and i can't see any way out of this for him. He has found a home
for most of his time on twitter it was 140 characters. He was a very early adopter alongside a lot of other Brithish media luvvies (most notably Stephen Fry, once King of Twitter)

Jumblegraws

Quote from: DrGreggles on December 29, 2020, 09:36:40 AM
My mate lost a bollock to cancer and has managed to survive without becoming a bigot, so I don't think that's a reason for Glinner's behaviour.
Far more likely that he's always been a cunt and he's gone bananas.
I don't think anyone's saying an orchiectomy automatically affects your disposition, just that the evidence points to Glinner's being a source of trauma that's been a significant factor in where he's at today, if not the trajectory then the rate of travel at least.

Has he ever gone into more detail about the bullying he experienced at school? I sometimes wonder if he was a bit of a Liz Lemon who imagined himself as a perpetual underdog and said a lot of needlessly hurtful things to his classmates as a result.

Quote from: idunnosomename on December 29, 2020, 11:17:05 AM
for most of his time on twitter it was 140 characters. He was a very early adopter alongside a lot of other Brithish media luvvies (most notably Stephen Fry, once King of Twitter)
Twitter has definitely done bad things to the more insecure celebs. Fry had a lot of trouble dealing with criticism. Some like Frankie Boyle, Limmy, etc have learnt to treat it with the lack of seriousness it deserves (and the likes of Gervais are thick skinned enough to not care), but if Twitter adoration is boosting your self-esteem you can't be dismissive of it. Now Glinner has lost Twitter he is trying to create a replacement, which is inevitably tiny and pathetic. So he doubles down.

Jockice

Quote from: Jumblegraws on December 29, 2020, 11:52:51 AM

Has he ever gone into more detail about the bullying he experienced at school? I sometimes wonder if he was a bit of a Liz Lemon who imagined himself as a perpetual underdog and said a lot of needlessly hurtful things to his classmates as a result.

I wonder that too. As someone who genuinely was bullied at school for sheer outsiderness (although I'd like to add it wasn't all the time, it wasn't by everyone and others got it worse, often for no clearly-defined reason) there's something about his claims that just don't strike me as totally true. That's an instinct thing on my part though. Maybe he was. I've mentioned this on other threads but some people I was at school with have since mentioned that they didn't think I was at all, while others saw me as being permanently picked on. It's in the eye of the beholder I suppose. I don't think I've bullied anyone myself since those days but some people might think I have done. And even if I have it wasn't on such an industrial scale as Linehan.

Jumblegraws

It's been sort of interesting (to me anyway) watching Glinner try to create a Twitter substitute by blu-tac'ng together a bunch of social media formats, up to and including Twitter itself via anonymous accounts. I thought his online presence would wither away when he lost the conflict/flattery rush of Twitter but he's defied my expectations in the most ugly way possible. Good for him.

idunnosomename

really starting to think paying £200 to be in the glinner gang was not the best way to turn around my failed comedy-writing career, as instead of sitcom school, I am just being told over and over the grave consequences of Eddie Izzard being a lesbian.

JamesTC

Has Glinner attacked Frankie Boyle for criticising Gervais using transphobic jokes yet?

JaDanketies

Quote from: JamesTC on December 29, 2020, 12:59:36 PM
Has Glinner attacked Frankie Boyle for criticising Gervais using transphobic jokes yet?

All the Gervais defenders on Twitter condemning Boyle for making jokes about down syndrome many years ago, as if Gervais did not write Derek or stake his life to defending the use of the word 'mong'.

Blue Jam

Quote from: JaDanketies on December 29, 2020, 10:55:53 AM
Here's a blog someone wrote about Graham Lineham being a pos before he was a terf that goes into further detail.

Thanks for posting that. Interesting read, particularly this bit:

QuoteThings got desperate when Linehan tweeted:

"I'm sure [Giles Coren's] sister and wife will be surprised to hear that he HATES Women"

As one startled tweeter put it, Glinner was now reduced to the old "how can I hate women: my mum's one" defence.

That's a common defence MRAs use when they try and pretend they actually care about men's rights and don't simply hate women. A similar and also very common one is "I like some women, my sister's not a slut" and the idea that these people don't hate women as a whole, just the ones that are "sluts" (but of course, that's all of them). Bit like Glinner pretending he likes the good trans people and it being a moot point because, as far as I can tell, his idea of a good trans person is a detransitioner, ie, someone who isn't trans.

Also Giles Coren is a cunt but I'm not going to tell him that on Twitter, best not to.

NoOffenceLynn

December 29, 2020, 01:15:27 PM #113 Last Edit: December 29, 2020, 01:28:12 PM by NoOffenceLynn
Quote from: FerriswheelBueller on December 29, 2020, 02:01:46 AM
Yeah he's definitely a true believer, and also someone who is physically unable to admit they are wrong and must instead double down.

I don't want to speculate on why he is the way he is (he's a human being for fucks sake and I'm no psychologist), but I will say that having a miscarriage (that wouldn't pass naturally and required a medical abortion) was one of the most painful experiences of my life[nb]so far!![/nb] and it has left mental scars on myself and my partner that likely won't heal. [nb]It actually still really upsets me when I think about it, to the point that I wish we'd all stop using "Cassandra's miscarriage!! lmao!!" as a punchline because I'm just not there yet.[/nb]

Twin that with a cancer diagnosis and I really, genuinely, sympathize with him going a bit loopy. The thing I can't understand (and refuse to countenance) is him being a nasty piece of work and bullying other (societally vulnerable) people.
Indeed it could be a whole series of traumatic events that triggered off his obsessive, mad,  trans view, but you're right that's no excuse for his vile bullying behaviour.

Also, sorry to hear about the loss your wife and yourself suffered, my friend suffered the same before Christmas and l can't imagine how devastating it must be.

Blue Jam

A mate of mine had testicular cancer and had a testicle removed and in the aftermath of that he became very involved with... fundraising for cancer charities and raising awareness of men's health. Another mate had leukaemia and also does a lot of cancer charity stuff, and while he's not a scientist he became very interested in cancer biology and has been heavily involved in public understanding of science work since his recovery.

While I don't deny that Glinner's experience of cancer was traumatic, it's interesting to think about how involved he was in the whole Skeptic community and how the path he took wasn't getting involved in research, fundraising, outreach work etc. Especially after another experience of personal tragedy had previously led him to being very involved in the Repeal The 8th campaign, again with the backing of atheist anti-religion Skeptic types.

Personally I think this may just be an extreme case of social media addiction and radicalisation. A very extreme one, and not one I can get my head round.

Kankurette

Quote from: JaDanketies on December 29, 2020, 01:05:36 PM
All the Gervais defenders on Twitter condemning Boyle for making jokes about down syndrome many years ago, as if Gervais did not write Derek or stake his life to defending the use of the word 'mong'.
~but he likes animals~

Blue Jam

*moved to more appropriate Gervais thread*

Jumblegraws



Blue Jam