Topic: Labour Party - Any other leader would be 20 points ahead

[BlodwynPig]

Thinking about it, is the green party not basically what this new left party would be like?

I hope not. Its bereft of ideas for starters.

[BlodwynPig]

It doesn't make sense to try to build an England-wide alternative to Labour, because it will run into the same problems as Labour - plus some new ones, plus competing with Labour and other parties on the same basis that Labour is already trying to compete on.

Each citizen should form their own party... like i’ve done

[ZoyzaSorris]

Thinking about it, is the green party not basically what this new left party would be like?

Maybe once upon a time but they revealed themselves to be a bunch of complete liberal centrist bed-shitters at heart when it came to Corbyn and FBPE bullshittery. No longer valid.

[Zetetic]

One of the fundamental problems that UK/English Labour is running into is that it's trying to hold together constituencies that are both materially and geographically massively segregated. The problem is even greater for any alternative that doesn't have the brand attachment across these already in place.

Attempts to build alternative political parties might recognise this, and instead of trying to replicate this problem by trying to grab all the same constituencies, focus on applying pressure in a subset that are united by something.

Each of England's small number of cities, and their renters. The corpselands, and their corpses. Somewhere or some set of people with common problems or identities other than "well, I voted for Labour the last few times".

[ZoyzaSorris]

A party that basically took aim at the worst Labour mps only standing in safe seats, focusing their fire on a few key seats in areas where the demographic are likely to be particularly pissed off with a crap Starmerite new new Labour approach - put the wind up them, grow from there. Needs a good leader and be very young and fresh not old crusty lefty splinter group nonsense.

[bgmnts]

Yeah sorry Sais, you're on your own.

[Buelligan]

Further on the Liverpool mayor thing, the Guardian now reporting that Labour councillors are considering voting to scrap the position entirely following the debacle.  Apparently the Lib Dems have long campaigned to do just that, so that's nice.  And with regard to the complexities of why Labour made the move to scratch the candidates list, apart from Rothery (I've posted her endorsements below for clarity),

...she was up against two councillors: Wendy Simon, who took over as acting mayor following the arrest of the incumbent, Joe Anderson, in December; and Ann O’Byrne, who quit as Anderson’s deputy in 2018.

My thinking is they'll let it settle and then let the people have their mayor again, in a few years, when Rothery's gone off the boil

It was only in January that Liverpool councillors voted to hold a referendum in 2023 to ask Liverpudlians whether they wanted to keep the position of city mayor or replace it with a council leader and cabinet, a committee system or a hybrid model.

But the Guardian understands that senior Labour figures in the city are now discussing calling a vote at next Wednesday’s full council meeting on scrapping the mayoralty before the local elections in May.

They believe they would win the vote, knowing that the main opposition councillors from the Liberal Democrats have long campaigned to scrap the role. There is nothing the national Labour party could do to stop them.

They think they could still hold a referendum in 2023 to decide on how the city should be governed in the long term.

Which is odd because in Labour's email to members, stating the cancellation of the vote and removal of the candidates they said

The role of Liverpool Mayor is a high profile and hugely important figure. The people of Liverpool deserve a Labour Mayor and the Labour Party needs to select the right candidate who can deliver an election win, stand up against the Conservatives, lead Liverpool out of the coronavirus crisis and fight for the regeneration and the resources that the city desperately needs.

Now, apparently, the people of Liverpool don't need anyone.



https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/feb/24/liverpool-council-may-hold-vote-to-scrap-role-of-mayor-over-selection-fiasco

[holyzombiejesus]

https://twitter.com/ClaudiaWebbe/status/1364675540297412618?s=19

https://twitter.com/PJHeneghan/status/1364736267603304449?s=19

Eurgh. Heneghan is such a vile little turd. There were kids like him at school. Loathsome cunt.

Having said that, are 'we' being a bit disingenuous by claiming that the scumbags who targeted Diane Abbott in the leaked WhatsApp messages are racist, or targeting BAME left-wingers? I don't think that their horrible sneering comments about DA were rooted in racism.

[Buelligan]

I don't know.  I think its clear, from those reported conversations, that they'd indulge in pretty much any kind of hateful behaviour to attack other Party members who they saw as factionally opposed to them.  But IMO, that whole whataboutery distraction is just a distraction, Labour needs to stop doing shitty things to itself.  That's the whole of it.

I know it's against the nature of the left, what with us being a bunch of (metaphorically) beaten, abused, massively defensive sorts. But we honestly should be turning some public criticism towards the various left-wing groups that could potentially lead us, giving them a clear sign that the wider movement needs and wants leadership, co-ordination and focus, now more than ever.

I know we don't like to get too critical of our allies, especially when our enemies are so much more powerful, but realistically, pragmatically, the best chance for us to form some sort of movement/party outside of Labour is for the left to make our feelings very publicly known to the people we need to lead us, and to hold our left-wing leadership/figureheads accountable. Short term, we need to turn our sights on that leadership and demand action. Because the alternative is that nothing will ever happen, I promise you that.

Was thinking about this.  Watched the recent Novara interview with John McD that Johnny linked, around 1:27, Walker asks him about our next steps.  It's a bit coded but it's pretty clear, at least to me, that McDonnell is calling on all of us to speak up and demand Corbyn's reinstatement - which is a banned subject.  I think he is calling for a Spartacus uprising, IMO, he needs to be clearer because, again, IMO, it's the only way we're going beat this. 

[Johnny Yesno]

https://twitter.com/ClaudiaWebbe/status/1364675540297412618?s=19

https://twitter.com/PJHeneghan/status/1364736267603304449?s=19

Eurgh. Heneghan is such a vile little turd. There were kids like him at school. Loathsome cunt.

Isn't he just? And what about his mate's profile pic? I mean, I'm no prude but it's hardly professional, is it? These people are mad.

Having said that, are 'we' being a bit disingenuous by claiming that the scumbags who targeted Diane Abbott in the leaked WhatsApp messages are racist, or targeting BAME left-wingers? I don't think that their horrible sneering comments about DA were rooted in racism.

I don't think we are. He's part of the emerging culture of systemic anti-black racism on the right of the party.

[idunnosomename]

we're all thinking the same thing about eluned's profile pic and no they do not look right at all

[Johnny Yesno]

https://skwawkbox.org/2021/02/24/breaking-left-wing-members-win-double-court-victory-vs-labour/

This is excellent news!

It is unfortunate that the Labour party by its actions has incurred legal costs of over £50,000 in just two weeks – at the expense of members’ subscriptions – rather than getting down to the meat of the case.  We do not have the large pockets that the Labour party is using to defend a system criticised as being unjust and ineffective by the EHRC.

Kieth is determined to drain Labour's resources, isn't he?

Nevertheless, it's becoming more and more apparent to all what a useless cunt he is. Stay in the party, lefties!

[Petey Pate]

Fucking hell, check out the jabronis in the St Mary's Oxford ward!

https://twitter.com/lukeakehurst/status/1364308438906523648

Holy shit, that's my ward.

If it helps, definitely won't be voting for this cunt. Let's hope for a Green landslide.

[colacentral]

What the fuck is wrong with these people? 

Here is an approved Labour candidate, who won't bring the Party into disrepute.



https://twitter.com/socialistvoice/status/1152626938256744448?lang=en

Luke Akehurst looks like the sort of neighbour who paints a house number on his wheelie bin, then complains when you bring the wrong one in by mistake.

[imitationleather]

Luke Akehurst looks like the sort of neighbour who paints a house number on his wheelie bin, then complaints when you bring the wrong one in by mistake. a pig with congestive heart failure.

[idunnosomename]

and the guy's only 48 lol

[Absorb the anus burn]

Akehurst Olive from On The Buses makes me feel like I have shit in my eyes.

[Buelligan]

Holy shit, that's my ward.

If it helps, definitely won't be voting for this cunt. Let's hope for a Green landslide.

You know, he's actually made me hope the Greens take over the whole council just on the basis that anyone prepared to accept him as a candidate or sit with him on a committee has deeply questionable judgement IMO.  Poor as I am, considering bunging them a few (very few) quid.  I don't hate him, don't hate anyone in the real sense but Akehurst tempts me, he's the embodiment of everything that's destroying the Labour Party and to me, that's close to as bad as it gets.

Speaking of which, I was just out doing a spot of work and pondering and I remembered when he who shall not be named started on, here, about antisemitism and I actually felt a bit sorry for him and thought his unbalanced feelings about politics had turned his head.  Made him say unforgiveable things about comrades.  I was quite disturbed because it was the first time, personally, a person I saw as a comrade (in the sense that they were a Labour supporter) had behaved towards people I knew to be absolutely righteous in that awful witch-finder way.  I just thought it was just one deranged nut.  And then I noticed the rest of the iceberg.  Was a real turning point for me, that.  I suppose I associate Akehurst with it (for good reasons).

Not sure you can ever go back from that, it's like when a partner hits you.  The trust is broken, isn't it?  What I mean is, could any of us ever trust any of these people again?

[imitationleather]

lol

[Shoulders?-Stomach!]

But that's because the Left aren't TAKING THE FIGHT TO THE TORIES by erm...supporting Kieieieith opposing a windfall tax on covid exploiting corporations....


...jesus

[Shoulders?-Stomach!]

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/feb/25/tax-rises-party-uk-rewards-voters-pandemic

You can bet your bottom dollar there will be no leadership from Sir Keef

[pigamus]

Luke Akehurst and Shaun Murphy would get on like a house on fire

[imitationleather]

Luke Akehurst and Shaun Murphy should be put in a house on fire.

[BlodwynPig]

https://twitter.com/ClaudiaWebbe/status/1364675540297412618?s=19

https://twitter.com/PJHeneghan/status/1364736267603304449?s=19

Eurgh. Heneghan is such a vile little turd. There were kids like him at school. Loathsome cunt.

Having said that, are 'we' being a bit disingenuous by claiming that the scumbags who targeted Diane Abbott in the leaked WhatsApp messages are racist, or targeting BAME left-wingers? I don't think that their horrible sneering comments about DA were rooted in racism.

Let's welcome them back. Olive branches are the root of social democracy. Together we're stronger.

[BlodwynPig]

Not sure you can ever go back from that, it's like when a partner hits you.  The trust is broken, isn't it?  What I mean is, could any of us ever trust any of these people again?

Let's welcome him back. Olive branches are the root of social democracy. Together we're stronger.

You've lost your bite and its dangerous.

[idunnosomename]

where are all the columns from sensible centrists who told us to replace corbyn with a grown-up telling us why no one likes sircut hair!?!/ do that not know? is it our fault? it's probably all our fault. im so sorry, mr aaronovitch, i will try better.

[katzenjammer]

Sadly I just think the current British electorate, and particularly the English part, is way more right wing than left. Doesn’t matter who the Labour Party leader is, they ain’t getting in

Nearly half of people believe those who lost their job during the pandemic were likely to have been underperforming, a survey has found.

In findings that will raise fears over inequalities in Britain, a study of attitudes by researchers at Kings College London showed a significant minority thought a widening post-Covid income gap between white people and BAME groups would not be a problem.

In one of the starkest findings, one in eight Britons (13%) said they think black people are more likely to be unemployed and have lower incomes because they “lack motivation or willpower”.

https://www.theguardian.com/inequality/2021/feb/25/job-losses-in-pandemic-due-to-performance-issues-say-nearly-half-of-britons

[Buelligan]

Let's welcome him back. Olive branches are the root of social democracy. Together we're stronger.

You've lost your bite and its dangerous.

Heheh.  Who would you like me to bite Blods?  I assure you, my teeth are still fine and sharp.

[Buelligan]

Nearly half of people believe those who lost their job during the pandemic were likely to have been underperforming, a survey has found.

In findings that will raise fears over inequalities in Britain, a study of attitudes by researchers at Kings College London showed a significant minority thought a widening post-Covid income gap between white people and BAME groups would not be a problem.

In one of the starkest findings, one in eight Britons (13%) said they think black people are more likely to be unemployed and have lower incomes because they “lack motivation or willpower”.

https://www.theguardian.com/inequality/2021/feb/25/job-losses-in-pandemic-due-to-performance-issues-say-nearly-half-of-britons

Fucking hell, what a shithole.

[BlodwynPig]

Heheh.  Who would you like me to bite Blods?  I assure you, my teeth are still fine and sharp.

Good.

edit: reading that post you just commented on - plenty of people to bite