Author Topic: Labour Party - Any other leader would be 20 points ahead  (Read 87355 times)

Re: Labour Party - Any other leader would be 20 points ahead
« Reply #2520 on: May 04, 2021, 09:02:09 PM »
Crace, the King of the Grown-ups, is quite scathing of Keith today. Sad to see love die.

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Re: Labour Party - Any other leader would be 20 points ahead
« Reply #2521 on: May 04, 2021, 09:19:39 PM »
Keith is already getting his excuses in, saying  there is a "mountain to climb" after the party's 2019 general election result.

Kieth showing the good way to start is to fall 100s of metres down a ravine and break an arm.

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Re: Labour Party - Any other leader would be 20 points ahead
« Reply #2522 on: May 04, 2021, 09:43:40 PM »
Crace, the King of the Grown-ups, is quite scathing of Keith today. Sad to see love die.
Crace bucks the garun trend for looking really pleased you crapped on his rug and he can't wait to eat it


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Re: Labour Party - Any other leader would be 20 points ahead
« Reply #2523 on: May 04, 2021, 09:54:41 PM »
Do we think that Jess Philips will celebrate the upcoming Labour defeat as much as she did in 2019?

Re: Labour Party - Any other leader would be 20 points ahead
« Reply #2524 on: May 05, 2021, 12:36:53 AM »
Can you remind us what happened in 2017? Because you seem to have missed that one out for some reason?

(Just for clarity Labour won over 50% of the vote)
I left it out because I think people fall back on it too much when there were enough extenuating factors to make it a blip that won't be let happen again.
The Tories were in civil war, Corbyn had just won a leadership contest that was pretty much framed as though he was the pro-Brexit candidate, Farage and pals were relatively absent and Teresa May was a distinctly terrible leader whose weirdness made it impossible for the media to not lay into her a tiny bit. It definitely was good but I don't think there's anything since December 2019 and now that could stop this seat turning blue without a third party taking a large number of tory votes


Regardless of Starmer's politics, he just shouldn't be the leader. No one from London or who was especially vocal on remain should be near the role. Why is this by-election evening happpening? Presumably they had some control over when this dude steps down so why not hold off until it seems like there's a chance  of winning? Unless... they genuinely figured a doctor (any doctor) during the pandemic was a best chance they had, which seems scarily possible

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Re: Labour Party - Any other leader would be 20 points ahead
« Reply #2525 on: May 05, 2021, 12:46:53 AM »
Teresa May was a distinctly terrible leader whose weirdness made it impossible for the media to not lay into her a tiny bit.

To start with, the papers, including the Graun, were full of how great she was in PMQs and how she showed up that rank amateur Corbyn, so much so I was wondering if I was watching the same PMQs. They continued this deception until it became untenable and then made like they'd always thought she was a robot. We mustn't ever forget this.

Re: Labour Party - Any other leader would be 20 points ahead
« Reply #2526 on: May 05, 2021, 12:55:21 AM »
To start with, the papers, including the Graun, were full of how great she was in PMQs and how she showed up that rank amateur Corbyn, so much so I was wondering if I was watching the same PMQs. They continued this deception until it became untenable and then made like they'd always thought she was a robot. We mustn't ever forget this.

BBC had that fluff piece on her when she was elected as Conservative leader which was in big contrast to the tone of the Panorama episode (not that one) when it looked almost certain he was going to win the Labour leadership election. Not to mention that atrocious show they had with Nick Robinson watching May blundering Brexit in awe and fawning over her after the disastrous election.

Re: Labour Party - Any other leader would be 20 points ahead
« Reply #2527 on: May 05, 2021, 06:31:06 AM »
Tanks on Labour's lawn!

Safe pair of hands!

Strong and steady!


Re: Labour Party - Any other leader would be 20 points ahead
« Reply #2528 on: May 05, 2021, 10:16:27 AM »
Ruth Smeeth has written a bit in The Times saying that transphobia is free speech and must be defended. Ruth Smeeth who had people expelled from the party for being critical of her.

I fucking hate this party.

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Re: Labour Party - Any other leader would be 20 points ahead
« Reply #2529 on: May 05, 2021, 10:45:05 AM »
Ruth Smeeth - just an awful vile person.  Happily, no longer an MP.

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Re: Labour Party - Any other leader would be 20 points ahead
« Reply #2530 on: May 05, 2021, 11:08:06 AM »
Ruth Smeeth - just an awful vile person.  Happily, no longer an MP.

These people seem to do all the damage they can then piss off because they never gave a fuck in the first place.

See also: Change TIG UK

Re: Labour Party - Any other leader would be 20 points ahead
« Reply #2531 on: May 05, 2021, 11:30:42 AM »
Quote
Whatever the results are, I will take responsibility, as I take responsibility for everything in the Labour party.

Repeating an argument he used yesterday, Starmer also claimed that it was always going to take more than a year for Labour to recover. He said:

I took over the Labour party after the worst general election result since 1935.

We’ve got to rebuild into the next general election - that is the task in hand.

This is the first test and we go into that test fighting for every vote, but I never thought we would climb the mountain we have to climb in just one year - it is going to take longer than that.

I take full responsibility, but it's Corbyns fault.

idunnosomename

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Re: Labour Party - Any other leader would be 20 points ahead
« Reply #2532 on: May 05, 2021, 11:37:40 AM »
"worst general election result since 1935" is one of those catchphrases they just say now like red wall.

what it really means is "time to be like the tories!!!"
says a #tory, predictably
https://twitter.com/Anna_Soubry/status/1389831873992531968

Re: Labour Party - Any other leader would be 20 points ahead
« Reply #2533 on: May 05, 2021, 11:39:07 AM »
Electoral and political genius and heavyweight Anna Soubry

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Re: Labour Party - Any other leader would be 20 points ahead
« Reply #2534 on: May 05, 2021, 11:48:19 AM »
Corbyn in 2019 (32.1%) got a higher percentage of vote share than Brown in 2010 (29%), Miliband in 2015 (30.4%) or Kinnock in 1987 (30.8%).

He also got 40% of the vote share in 2017.

Re: Labour Party - Any other leader would be 20 points ahead
« Reply #2535 on: May 05, 2021, 11:59:52 AM »
Yeah but a lot of those votes were from young woke voters and we don't want their support thank you very much.

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Re: Labour Party - Any other leader would be 20 points ahead
« Reply #2536 on: May 05, 2021, 12:40:11 PM »


jeez, that is fucking pathetic. he'll be saying the same thing in ten years time if people let him.

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Re: Labour Party - Any other leader would be 20 points ahead
« Reply #2537 on: May 05, 2021, 12:44:59 PM »
I take full responsibility, but it's Corbyns fault.

We thought we'd start climbing the mountain by slipping down an escarpment.

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Re: Labour Party - Any other leader would be 20 points ahead
« Reply #2538 on: May 05, 2021, 12:53:29 PM »
Best start the rebuild by losing one of the few seats we held onto in the worst-ever election result of all time ever.


Corbyn in 2019 (32.1%) got a higher percentage of vote share than Brown in 2010 (29%), Miliband in 2015 (30.4%) or Kinnock in 1987 (30.8%).

He also got 40% of the vote share in 2017.


I think focusing on these individual results and arguing 2019 v 2017, how much remainers fucked us etc probably obscures the wider issues affecting any left-wing party at the moment. Brexit didn't help with the "red wall" (which is a made-up thing), but the wider trend for the left to get votes from the younger, the University educated, the city dwellers, and the renters meant a lot of those seats were precarious anyway. Obviously, the "slap a flag on it and agree with the Tories" strategy isn't doing gangbusters, but I do wonder if 2017 didn't represent a bit of a ceiling for the left-wing in the present moment.

Re: Labour Party - Any other leader would be 20 points ahead
« Reply #2539 on: May 05, 2021, 01:42:33 PM »
I’ve just watched Sky at the gym. A Tory MP saying Starmer can’t regain the Red Wall because they don’t want a metropolitan elite in charge. A business owner saying he likes Johnson because he’s a ‘character’ and ‘semi-normal’. I cannot see a way out of this, and before anyone tells me to go and canvass former Labour voters, I can’t. No matter how far to the right Starmer moves, it’s no use. And don’t tell me to get out on the streets and riot. I can’t.

I have not felt this hopeless since 2005.

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Re: Labour Party - Any other leader would be 20 points ahead
« Reply #2540 on: May 05, 2021, 02:17:47 PM »
I don't understand people who like politicians because they are a "character". It's like wanting your surgery to be done by a "character". I want the politician who is best at the job, not one who is LOLRANDOM and makes jokes.

On BBC News online they had someone called Farmer saying they'd like to see Boris Johnson's critics deal with what he's dealt with "over the past 12 months". I'm fairly sure most of them would be responsible for less death, hospitalisations and economic collapse than under Mr Late to Lockdown Three Times.

Re: Labour Party - Any other leader would be 20 points ahead
« Reply #2541 on: May 05, 2021, 02:28:22 PM »
Best start the rebuild by losing one of the few seats we held onto in the worst-ever election result of all time ever.



I think focusing on these individual results and arguing 2019 v 2017, how much remainers fucked us etc probably obscures the wider issues affecting any left-wing party at the moment. Brexit didn't help with the "red wall" (which is a made-up thing), but the wider trend for the left to get votes from the younger, the University educated, the city dwellers, and the renters meant a lot of those seats were precarious anyway. Obviously, the "slap a flag on it and agree with the Tories" strategy isn't doing gangbusters, but I do wonder if 2017 didn't represent a bit of a ceiling for the left-wing in the present moment.

Agree with this. It's pointless cherrypicking something that makes 2019 not look as bad anf pretending that it was fine. Percentage of the vote is not a useful measure of anything really.

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Re: Labour Party - Any other leader would be 20 points ahead
« Reply #2542 on: May 05, 2021, 03:46:28 PM »
Obviously, the "slap a flag on it and agree with the Tories" strategy isn't doing gangbusters, but I do wonder if 2017 didn't represent a bit of a ceiling for the left-wing in the present moment.

Not a ceiling, well, maybe a false ceiling.  A false ceiling put there by every cunt that worked inside the Labour Party to make sure Labour did not win that election. 

We could have done better, no one can know how much better but what they intentionally did lost us votes, about that, there can be no argument.  So it's not the high water mark for socialism in Britain, it's the best we can do with them working to make us fail, until they're gone, it's the ceiling.

Re: Labour Party - Any other leader would be 20 points ahead
« Reply #2543 on: May 05, 2021, 04:43:31 PM »
EDIT
« Last Edit: May 05, 2021, 06:09:09 PM by Goldentony »

Re: Labour Party - Any other leader would be 20 points ahead
« Reply #2544 on: May 05, 2021, 06:05:28 PM »
I don't understand people who like politicians because they are a "character". It's like wanting your surgery to be done by a "character". I want the politician who is best at the job, not one who is LOLRANDOM and makes jokes.

Sounds rational but it's just human nature I think. Same with any industry, it's typically the most likable that get ahead rather than the most competent. Still don't quite understand why politicians still talk in that stilted hand-waving manner, you'd think someone would have capitalised on speaking like a regular person.

I'm surprised we haven't seen more celeb leaders really, especially after Trump's success. Waiting for the first TikTok election dance campaign to vote in the guy with the sickest move.

Re: Labour Party - Any other leader would be 20 points ahead
« Reply #2545 on: May 05, 2021, 06:21:19 PM »
Johnson isn’t even likeable or interesting. People say they’d go down the pub with him. Would you? Would you really? This is a man who thinks John Lewis is tacky and common, for fuck’s sake, he wouldn’t give most of his supporters the time of day.

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Re: Labour Party - Any other leader would be 20 points ahead
« Reply #2546 on: May 05, 2021, 06:37:23 PM »
Still don't quite understand why politicians still talk in that stilted hand-waving manner, you'd think someone would have capitalised on speaking like a regular person.

It's exactly like corporate "values" for exactly the same reason. They've done a bit of market research, got conflicting information because different people like different things then tackled that by removing or watering down things to the point they're insipid and meaningless.

Are Wetherspoons' the bland facsimile of a pub purely to cut down 'operational costs' of being more entertaining or because they did a load of market research and identified the 'I don't like the musics' and the 'I don't like the darts' aspects of going to pubs. Catering by removal rather than addition.

Sebastian Cobb

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Re: Labour Party - Any other leader would be 20 points ahead
« Reply #2547 on: May 05, 2021, 06:44:44 PM »
Johnson isn’t even likeable or interesting. People say they’d go down the pub with him. Would you? Would you really? This is a man who thinks John Lewis is tacky and common, for fuck’s sake, he wouldn’t give most of his supporters the time of day.

First imagine you'd spent the last few years frequenting a pub where every other patron was a focus-grouped actor who could only speak in non-committal vagueness, to the point you couldn't even ask them what their favourite crisps were.

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Re: Labour Party - Any other leader would be 20 points ahead
« Reply #2548 on: May 05, 2021, 07:05:19 PM »
First imagine you'd spent the last few years frequenting a pub where every other patron was a focus-grouped actor who could only speak in non-committal vagueness, to the point you couldn't even ask them what their favourite crisps were.

all the flavours...plain

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Re: Labour Party - Any other leader would be 20 points ahead
« Reply #2549 on: May 05, 2021, 08:38:43 PM »
Labour expected to lose Hartlepool. Centrist commentators already spinning:

https://twitter.com/JohnRentoul/status/1389479176646836230



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