Author Topic: Columbo: Bad Lieutenant  (Read 2771 times)

pigamus

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Re: Columbo: Bad Lieutenant
« Reply #60 on: March 11, 2021, 08:14:51 PM »
Oh I've remembered now, it's in the club for geniuses one - he calls the (clearly underage) girl pretty and she says, "you're the first man to want me for my body rather than my mind."

Urrrgh.

An tSaoi

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Re: Columbo: Bad Lieutenant
« Reply #61 on: March 11, 2021, 08:16:17 PM »
You weren't impressed with the Irish-American actor Patrick McGoohan's Irish accent?

Jesus, I always thought he was English in real-life. How did I not clock the name?

Quote
McGoohan was born in Astoria, Queens, New York City, the son of Rose (Fitzpatrick) and Thomas McGoohan, who were living in the United States after emigrating from Ireland to seek work. He was brought up as a Catholic.[1] Shortly after he was born, McGoohan's parents moved back to Mullaghmore, County Leitrim,[2][3] Ireland, and seven years later, they moved to Sheffield, England.

Well faith and begorrah, y'all. A Yank-Paddy-Gammon.

pigamus

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Re: Columbo: Bad Lieutenant
« Reply #62 on: March 11, 2021, 08:19:44 PM »
Are you maybe thinking of the one with the poet?

mothman

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Re: Columbo: Bad Lieutenant
« Reply #63 on: March 11, 2021, 09:04:25 PM »
But yeah, he guest-starred as the killer on a record four occasions.

The episodes must have gotten progressively shorter. The last one, Columbo says “It’s him! He did it!” the instant he sees him.

Re: Columbo: Bad Lieutenant
« Reply #64 on: March 11, 2021, 09:29:58 PM »
I do wonder how many of the killers recanted their confessions as soon as they were properly lawyered up. Few if any were seen to be Mirandaised, onscreen anyway.

If real-life is anything to go by, recanting often doesn’t make a blind bit of difference.  Confessions were seen - and sometimes still are - as being the gold standard of evidence, partly because of an innocent person couldn’t possibly confess something they didn’t do . It just simply couldn’t happen.

Would have been a long while ago, but I heard an interview with someone on Juan Rivera’s legal team (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juan_Rivera_(wrongful_conviction)#Conviction_overturned) - think his conviction hadn’t been overturned at this time - where this was discussed. Essentially a large part of the problem is that people think ‘well, I know I would never confess a crime that I didn’t do, therefore they must have done it’. It was incredible how far-fetched the prosecution's explanations were, but somehow those were more plausible than three juries thinking that the confession could have been a false one.

The first season of the Accused podcast, the murder of Elizabeth Andes was covered. In a nutshell, her boyfriend found her murdered, he called the police - they zeroed in on him as a suspect and after 15 consecutive hours of interrogation, he confessed. Going from memory, he said that he was so exhausted that he just wanted it to stop and thought - like others do - that as he didn’t do  it., the system would realise it. (Spoiler: this normally makes things a lot worse.) Fortunately for him, the confession was full of factual inaccactices - his lawyers tried to get the confession thrown out at the trial, but couldn’t so that focussed on why it was flawed. After he was acquitted, the police force said that they jury had got it wrong and the case was closed.

‘Verballing’, where a policeman says that someone confessed to them with no corroborating evidence (e.g. a written record or anyone hearing) and often with the suspect denying they had said it, was accepted as standard practice in the UK for many years.

….EDIT2:  Also the episode on the cruise ship is a great one for Columbo fans.  Plenty of 'hey it's that guy', decent pop clue and it confirms that Columbos wife does actually exist

There’s plenty of indications in other episodes - like when he talks to a mechanic about his wife’s car or when alone and speaking to her on the phone.

That's where I've been watching them, but my god the adverts are annoying and drag it all out to 2 hours. Not that Columbo itself drags, but it's a big commitment when there's 3 or 4 in a row, you can literally sit there for 6+ hours. Dunno if they're on Channel Five's catchup service, they might be.

You are so right - the frequency of adverts is painful, so so painful.

You weren't impressed with the Irish-American actor Patrick McGoohan's Irish accent?

But yeah, he guest-starred as the killer on a record four occasions.

He also directed several, including a couple of that he wasn’t in.

Culp and Cassidy did pretty well as well - playing a murderer thrice.

However, Mike Lally was in 23 episodes (although possibly more as he suggests) not as a murderer, but still…

Oh I've remembered now, it's in the club for geniuses one - he calls the (clearly underage) girl pretty and she says, "you're the first man to want me for my body rather than my mind."

Yeah, it’s a scene to raise the eyebrows at - that said, I think it illustrates how things are viewed very differently now and when recently watching Last Salute…, I found how Columbo invades someone’s personal space more disconcerting. By happy chance, both scenes are recently discussed at: https://columbophile.com/2021/03/07/10-times-columbo-should-have-been-reported-to-his-superiors/

Re: Columbo: Bad Lieutenant
« Reply #65 on: March 11, 2021, 10:03:01 PM »
Surprised Forgotten Lady isn't on the list since Columbo basically lets the murderer get away with it.

Ballad of Ballard Berkley

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Re: Columbo: Bad Lieutenant
« Reply #66 on: March 11, 2021, 10:24:33 PM »
He also directed several, including a couple of that he wasn’t in.

And I love the fact that McGoohan included a reference to The Prisoner in the first episode he directed: "Be seeing you."




non capisco

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Re: Columbo: Bad Lieutenant
« Reply #67 on: March 11, 2021, 10:37:14 PM »
now I wish there was an episode where he smokes heroin with prostitutes and blackmails drug dealers

There is one where he's standing there with his tiny little shrivelled lad out making a weird sobbing noise. I think it's one of the 1990s ones.

Blumf

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Re: Columbo: Bad Lieutenant
« Reply #68 on: March 11, 2021, 10:37:34 PM »
Surprised Forgotten Lady isn't on the list since Columbo basically lets the murderer get away with it.

He doesn't let her get away with it, but he does realise that the court case is going to be tricky with Ned Diamond putting himself in front of the charges. A popular episode, especially as he's denied a clean conviction (by Columbo standards), one of the few times he looks genuinely pissed off, I think.



Any Sergeant Wilson fans?



No, not that one, this one


Re: Columbo: Bad Lieutenant
« Reply #69 on: March 12, 2021, 12:27:26 PM »
He doesn't let her get away with it, but he does realise that the court case is going to be tricky with Ned Diamond putting himself in front of the charges. A popular episode, especially as he's denied a clean conviction (by Columbo standards), one of the few times he looks genuinely pissed off, I think.



Any Sergeant Wilson fans?



No, not that one, this one



Well he does let her get away with it because he doesn't arrest her. I always thought he seemed quite sympathetic to her and lets her boyfriend take the wrap for her cause he realizes that she can't remember doing the murder. I guess that's another twist on the formula.

I think i read somewhere that Sgt Wilson was an attempt by the writers to add another regular character to the series because the network had suggested it to them.

pigamus

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Re: Columbo: Bad Lieutenant
« Reply #70 on: March 12, 2021, 12:33:06 PM »
He’s a likeable character but there’s nothing really for him to do. Columbo doesn’t need a sidekick.


Re: Columbo: Bad Lieutenant
« Reply #71 on: March 12, 2021, 12:38:46 PM »
He’s a likeable character but there’s nothing really for him to do. Columbo doesn’t need a sidekick.

There’s a story - I have no idea if it’s true, but I really hope it is - that the network really pushed Link and Levinson to give Columbo a sidekick and their response was to give him a dog.

pigamus

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Re: Columbo: Bad Lieutenant
« Reply #72 on: March 12, 2021, 12:43:38 PM »
I suppose the murderer is kind of the sidekick - I hadn’t thought of it like that before.

Re: Columbo: Bad Lieutenant
« Reply #73 on: March 12, 2021, 12:44:36 PM »
For a cop show it's surprising how little you see of Columbo at his desk or working in the Police station.

Re: Columbo: Bad Lieutenant
« Reply #74 on: March 12, 2021, 12:49:46 PM »
...I think i read somewhere that Sgt Wilson was an attempt by the writers to add another regular character to the series because the network had suggested it to them.

It’s often reported that the network did want a sidekick for Columbo, but Wilson’s appearances have a long gap between them and Link, Levinson and Falk were vehemently opposed to the idea.  I think the actor who played Wilson became friends with Falk and my feeling is that the character was meant to be a one-off but they thought he would be good to bring back (and it fits the episode) as they liked him and the character.

There are few actors that they reused in the series - e.g. the nun who mistakes Columbo for a homeless person (which was used in The Simpsons) is played by Joyce Van Patten, who they cast in a much larger role as the murderer in An Old-Fashioned Murder - which always gives me the vibe that they liked to involve people they liked.

pigamus

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Re: Columbo: Bad Lieutenant
« Reply #75 on: March 12, 2021, 01:10:59 PM »
A foil would have been a  better idea - like a smarmy ambitious detective who hates Colombo's guts but isn’t anywhere near as good, something like that.

gmoney

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Re: Columbo: Bad Lieutenant
« Reply #76 on: March 12, 2021, 01:16:24 PM »
Or the ghost of his old partner.

Jerzy Bondov

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Re: Columbo: Bad Lieutenant
« Reply #77 on: March 12, 2021, 01:59:41 PM »
Started with Murder by the Book. The opening is so great. You know what's going to happen, it's called 'Murder by the Book', it's a Columbo, you know it's going to start with a murder. But the way it teases you is so clever. You've got a few little fake-outs, mysterious little details like the business with the lighter, and then it changes location and just keeps going. The more it goes on, and the more you realise how complicated Franklin's scheme is, the more you realise how tricky it's going to be for Columbo to unpick these events. But you also get a seed of how the plan might fall apart when the shopkeeper spots Ferris in the car. Franklin is a great villain as well, smarmy as fuck. The opening would almost make a good little standalone short, like an episode of Inside No 9 or something. And then you get into the aftermath and Columbo rocks up, speaking from off screen at first, warm and sympathetic, and then he makes an omelette. You're in good hands here. It's gonna be a good one.

Jerzy Bondov

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Re: Columbo: Bad Lieutenant
« Reply #78 on: March 12, 2021, 02:04:22 PM »
Ahh this is so good! I love it.

Re: Columbo: Bad Lieutenant
« Reply #79 on: March 12, 2021, 02:12:23 PM »
Started with Murder by the Book. The opening is so great. You know what's going to happen, it's called 'Murder by the Book', it's a Columbo, you know it's going to start with a murder. But the way it teases you is so clever. You've got a few little fake-outs, mysterious little details like the business with the lighter, and then it changes location and just keeps going. The more it goes on, and the more you realise how complicated Franklin's scheme is, the more you realise how tricky it's going to be for Columbo to unpick these events. But you also get a seed of how the plan might fall apart when the shopkeeper spots Ferris in the car. Franklin is a great villain as well, smarmy as fuck. The opening would almost make a good little standalone short, like an episode of Inside No 9 or something. And then you get into the aftermath and Columbo rocks up, speaking from off screen at first, warm and sympathetic, and then he makes an omelette. You're in good hands here. It's gonna be a good one.

Yeah, it’s a really fantastic episode. Cassidy is my one of my favourite murderers and love the interactions with Barbara Colby, who I think is just so terrific. A while ago, I was looking at what else she had done because I wanted to see more and discovered that she was sadly murdered a few years later and it remains an open case.

Jerzy Bondov

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Re: Columbo: Bad Lieutenant
« Reply #80 on: March 12, 2021, 02:21:58 PM »
Yes that's shocking. She's great, what a funny but sad character

Blumf

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Re: Columbo: Bad Lieutenant
« Reply #81 on: March 12, 2021, 02:26:15 PM »
A foil would have been a  better idea - like a smarmy ambitious detective who hates Colombo's guts but isn’t anywhere near as good, something like that.

I think Sgt Wilson is a better route to that though. As Columbo's usual MO is to hang around people and irritate them, having Wilson come along and, without meaning to, irritate Columbo with his chipper attitude seems like a nice turnabout.

Sebastian Cobb

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Re: Columbo: Bad Lieutenant
« Reply #82 on: March 12, 2021, 02:31:36 PM »
I wonder what it'd be like to go for a pint with Columbo when he's off duty. He's obviously a nice charming chatty fella, would he seem more 'switched on', is his native exterior a veneer that he drops or just his personality?

He doesn't seem to change when he's down the station and I get the impression some of his colleagues don't really think he's all that, but I feel that it might be that he is indifferent to the chain of command and the police as an institution.

Re: Columbo: Bad Lieutenant
« Reply #83 on: March 13, 2021, 07:13:16 AM »
There’s plenty of indications in other episodes - like when he talks to a mechanic about his wife’s car or when alone and speaking to her on the phone.
I believe in the cruise ship episode someone says 'Columbo, your wife was looking for you', implying that they've actually seen his wife.  On all the previous occasions she's mentioned it could be said (at a stretch) that he's just pretending his wife is still alive.

Re: Columbo: Bad Lieutenant
« Reply #84 on: March 13, 2021, 09:03:47 AM »
Quote from: Jerzy Bondov
Started with Murder by the Book. The opening is so great.

Even before anything happens, the opening shows you the 23-year-old director had a Jaws in him - the first shot zooming through the window, finding and tracking the car, the sequence going on to show him parking and coming up the building, all while the frenzied typewriter clacking gets your heart racing... then, as you say, the fake-outs forestall any release to that tension.

What's the best Columbo to start with if you want to watch Columbo?

You've started in the right place: Murder By The Book was made as ep 2, but pulled up bcz it impressed the producers so much. The "real" 1 swapped places, and is just as good, with an astounding visual sequence of the aftermath of the murder. One of the only regular "series" episodes written by creators Levinson & Link.

Also recommended, if you don't just power through:

S01e04 SUITABLE FOR FRAMING
- a lot of the joy of Columbo is seeing him absolutely class-war rich cunts to the deck. this one has so much fun hanging out with rich art collectors that you want to be at their party

S01e07 BLUEPRINT FOR MURDER
 - directed by Falk, he discovered that making a full-length feature on 35mm in real locations, on a TV schedule, was actually bloody hard and never asked again

S2e01 ETUDE IN BLACK
 - starring Falk pal John Cassavetes pulling off the greatest alibi ever, written by a young Steven Bochco with Levinson & Link, and directed by the Coach from Cheers. also, introduces Columbo's dog, Dog.

S2e06 A STITCH IN CRIME
 - the Leonard Nimoy ep

S2e08 DOUBLE SHOCK   
 - starring Martin Landau, Julie Newmar, and Martin Landau

S3e02 ANY OLD PORT IN A STORM
 - one of the best, as already noted - Donald Pleasance as one of the most sympathetic baddies ever, co-written by social-conscience b-movie king Larry Cohen

S3e05 PUBLISH OR PERISH
 - Jack Cassidy back, also with Mickey Spillane

S3e07 SWAN SONG
 - directed by Nick Colasanto again, about an almost-sympathetic country-Jesus-rock-star murderer,  starring Johnny Cash AND Ida Lupino

S3e08 A FRIEND IN DEED
 - directed by another of Falk's actor/drinking buddies, Ben Gazzara, with a darker tone than usual

beanheadmcginty

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Re: Columbo: Bad Lieutenant
« Reply #85 on: April 04, 2021, 11:08:42 PM »
I'm just watching "Suitable for Framing" and did a huge double-take during the murderer intro sequence when he looked at a painting of some rowing boats and it made the sound of TOS Starship Enterprise doors opening.

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