Phwoar thread redux

[flotemysost]

I just find it so depressing to see women using words like "slut" and "whore".

Again I'm genuinely sorry for that. To be clear, I wasn't intending to "slut-shame" myself by using it, either - agree that sexual shaming is a massive problem, though it certainly doesn't have to involve the use of those words and it can take far more insidious forms.

To be honest it wasn't really intended as anything other than a synonym for "sexual", there was no negative connotation intended (and quite a few of my female and gay male friends do use those terms in a lighthearted, affectionate way, no hateful intent, which has possibly desensitised me to their nastier usage) - but it was thoughtless and naive of me to casually use such a loaded term without considering how it might make other people feel. As I've said, appreciate you calling me out on that and I hope you can understand my apology.

[Mr_Simnock]

You're almost there. Almost. You come so close. But yeah, seize upon my word choice to deflect attention from it.

Could you just crank down the rather nasty replies up from 11 where it's currently at. You know folk can disagree with you and you don't have to get all bitter and aggressive all the time.

[chveik]

Seriously, I've called people out in the PHWOARGH thread for using sexist language and they have apologised and taken it more graciously than this. Again, there has been far more self-reflection in that thread than there has in this one.

i've read both threads and that's just plain wrong. for a start nobody outside of cab has complained about this one being creepy

[Buelligan]

I agree this is utterly deranged.  People making a grab for the higher ground and lecturing others about their posts.  FFS.  We've read all the words.

Casually floating the idea that there's anything righteous about that old thread that can be gathered up and used to shame or blame anyone outside of it?  The fact that people went right out and started a new one, presumably knowing about the contents of the old.  Using provocative language in this thread, on these last pages and then telling other people to mind their words and post nice?

Come on.  Wouldn't it be better just to move on, take it on board and be better next time, rather than trying to pull it all down on top of everyone?  Ugly madness.

[Lisa Jesusandmarychain]

" people went right out and started a new thread" , retitled and with restrictions. Basically, a thread whose MO is to say " I like this lady/ gentleman, he/ she is attractive", which quite a few people may say is a birrova pathetic and unnecessary thread, but, I mean, come on.

[TrenterPercenter]

i've read both threads and that's just plain wrong. for a start nobody outside of cab has complained about this one being creepy

Again; this isn't what Blue Jam has said.

Someone complaining outside of cab about their picture being used is not the same as people not apologising for using sexist language and neither is that evidence of more self reflection in this thread than the other one (I mean it just doesn't make any sense; let's say 4 posters reflected on their sexist language in the other thread and none did in this one what on earth has that got to do with someone thinking this thread or that thread is creepy?).  I really don't understand how you and several other posters constantly misread other peoples posts like this.

Blue Jam is also quite clearly making a point to another poster about the double standard of what was being said to her and the terminology that was being used to do so.  This is obvious.

[BlodwynPig]

Forensic.

[Lisa Jesusandmarychain]

Phwoarensic.

( I'm glad I made this post, it was a good use of my time)

[Buelligan]

" people went right out and started a new thread" , retitled and with restrictions. Basically, a thread whose MO is to say " I like this lady/ gentleman, he/ she is attractive", which quite a few people may say is a birrova pathetic and unnecessary thread, but, I mean, come on.

The point is, you don't get to push the idea you're a top hole sensitive egg when you've recently stamped your little feet and started a new round, just to prove a point, presumably knowing that people complaining about that thread probably had good reason given this newly public shit. 

That's not group hug we're all here for you stuff and pretending it's anything other than a resounding fuck you, friend, is just words in the wind.

I'm not going to debate this, I don't feel that I can change anything and soaking up other peoples' negativity isn't appealing to me.  I just felt some of the gaslighting going on, aimed particularly at a couple of very decent fairly new women posters here, needed a counterpunch. 

[TrenterPercenter]

Forensic.

Not really it is quite obvious isn't it.

[JaDanketies]

Feel a little responsible for all this animosity cos I bumped the thread. Can't we all just get along, just for this one contentious topic?

[Lisa Jesusandmarychain]

I want to put up a picture of a quartet of bedridden glum, sickly looking female domestic fowl with all thermometers in their beaks, but I can't, because I'm not very good at that sort of thing. :(

[tourism]

Blue Jam is also quite clearly making a point to another poster about the double standard of what was being said to her and the terminology that was being used to do so.  This is obvious.

it seemed like barrel-scraping tone-policing deflection to me. in any case I was more upset by the 'I'm not a bad person, the person upset that their picture was picked over for wankability on the enlightened cleverclogs comedy board is a bad person and I've seen them fishing for compliments too' defense blue jam was doing than the other posters' choice of words, which seemed to be characterising that defense.

[Chedney Honks]

mook is out of prison

[Blue Jam]

Oh no, think I'm overdue a power-negging.

[Lisa Jesusandmarychain]

it seemed like barrel-scraping tone-policing deflection to me. in any case I was more upset by the 'I'm not a bad person, the person upset that their picture was picked over for wankability on the enlightened cleverclogs comedy board is a bad person and I've seen them fishing for compliments too' defense blue jam was doing than the other posters' choice of words, which seemed to be characterising that defense.

Don't think Blue Jam referred to yer woman as " a bad person", just an attention seeker who got the wrong sort of attention  from a bunch of eejits who really shouldn't have come out with that stuff in the first place. She also made it clear her sympathies lay with that woman in that case. No negging for Jammers necessary.

[tourism]

yeah, sorry, I'm losing my rag a bit

[Poirots BigGarlickyCorpse]

Could you just crank down the rather nasty replies up from 11 where it's currently at. You know folk can disagree with you and you don't have to get all bitter and aggressive all the time.

A depressingly predictable reply from one of the people who went combing through a random woman's twitter for proof of... something?

Blue Jam is also quite clearly making a point to another poster about the double standard of what was being said to her and the terminology that was being used to do so.  This is obvious.

yeah Blue Jam and I both know what's going on here Trenter. I'm not gonna pick on her any more because she wasn't the only one doing it.

I'll reiterate, without using any nasty words (I'm sure you'll all go out and crusade against the liberal use of the word "cunt" on this forum after this, right?). I find it distressing that the reaction of a handful of posters to some woman remarking that she found the way people talked about her picture creepy was to go to her twitter and say "Oh look, she doesn't mind that THESE men pay her compliments. She's complaining about this and yet she said that this other person was 'stunning'. She got a ton of replies complimenting her after complaining about us. Her Amazon Wishlist is linked in her Twitter bio, how interesting. She posts sexy pictures of herself while complaining that she's ugly when she clearly isn't, that really grinds my gears." You all think you're being really clever by keeping the quiet part quiet, but everyone can hear it. And there's this undercurrent of sexism too, because I have a hard time believing a man who complained about this issue would be subjected to this.

[TrenterPercenter]

it seemed like barrel-scraping tone-policing deflection to me. in any case I was more upset by the 'I'm not a bad person, the person upset that their picture was picked over for wankability on the enlightened cleverclogs comedy board is a bad person and I've seen them fishing for compliments too' defense blue jam was doing than the other posters' choice of words, which seemed to be characterising that defense.

The problem is posters exaggerating and twisting what other posters say.  Blue Jam never said that the twitter user deserved it; she said the opposite; this was ignored so that it could be made out she was comfortable with the picture being used.

finding out whether or not Blue Jam meant this (which for anyone that has been on the forum with BJ for the last 10 years is frankly laughable) seemed quite secondary to telling her what she meant.

[Poirots BigGarlickyCorpse]

edit: fuckit, my posts are there for all to read, I don't need to defend them further

[JaDanketies]

 I feel this isn't the time or the place to slag off the Twitter user and slagging her off here contextually reads like minimising what was done or questioning her response to it.

Recently she tweeted a picture of herself, two people whose feeds are RTed porn pics RTed her, and she asked them to undo it because she didn't want to appear in that context.

[TrenterPercenter]

I feel this isn't the time or the place to slag off the Twitter user and slagging her off here contextually reads like minimising what was done or questioning her response to it.

I have little doubt if that had been said to Blue Jam in a reasonable manner she would have agreed.

[Blue Jam]

Yes, of course I don't think Twitter Woman is a bad person, I just find it a bit laughable that someone can post up lots of sexualised pictures of themselves along with an Amazon wishlist and then act surprised when it turns out strange men off the internet weren't buying her toasters as random acts of kindness.

She wants positive attention on her own terms- and that's fine, because that's what we all want isn't it? If you post your CV on LinkedIn you don't want creepy men hitting on you but you do want someone to offer you a job. If you put sexualised photos on Twitter along with an Amazon wishlist link you don't want creepy comments but it might be nice to get a free toaster. I don't believe that anyone putting themselves "out there" for whatever reason is inviting abuse, or that negative attention is just the price you pay for positive attention. No-one should have to take the rough with the smooth, there shouldn't be any rough.

I suppose there's also part of me which just doesn't understand this brave new world. Putting all this personal stuff somewhere as publicly visible as Twitter sounds like more hassle than its worth and personally I'd rather just buy my own toaster. OnlyFans makes a lot more sense to me, it sounds like people can make a decent amount of money on there while having have much more control over their content. I think OnlyFans also has security features to stop content being shared elsewhere, they at least take some steps to protect their users.

[Butchers Blind]

Hang on, am I missing something? This lady puts nice pictures of herself up on social media and people just buy her stuff like toasters? What's the catch here?

[Chedney Honks]

If there are some changes in the dynamics of a forum for a very small number of people like us, of whom there are already so few, it makes little difference to the progress of humanity, but I'm happy enough if it makes a couple of people a bit more comfortable in this unpopulated corner. I also like that people are able to say, no, you don't get to decide the parameters just because you feel strongly about it, even if you are probably right. It's a conversation. At very least, as shit as Britain is, these conversations do take place here, for what negligible impact they have on the wider population. Most countries are decades if not centuries behind us and many are still eating dogshit straight off the floor.

[Paul Calf]

As someone who was born before the internet and grew up in a world without it, the idea of putting tons of intimate information onto it seems extremely foolish. Once you've dropped that into the pool, you lose control over it and people will do things with it that you don't like. I think people should generally be more guarded about what they share on a vast, open public network.

I am not in any way excusing the comments made in the phwoaar thread, but at the same time you cannot realistically expect everyone to share your opinion about the appropriate use of your data.

[Paul Calf]

Hang on, am I missing something? This lady puts nice pictures of herself up on social media and people just buy her stuff like toasters? What's the catch here?

See above. You have no control over the artefacts you leave behind.

Exploitation is the problem here. Exploitation is always the problem.

[Chollis]

Hang on, am I missing something? This lady puts nice pictures of herself up on social media and people just buy her stuff like toasters? What's the catch here?

Twitch is gonna blow your mind

[Blue Jam]

See above. You have no control over the artefacts you leave behind.

Exploitation is the problem here. Exploitation is always the problem.

Years ago I wrote a daft little comment on a forum and later found it published in a book, with my name under it. I once made a mix of a certain musician's tracks and then was a bit blown away when said musician emailed me to say how much he liked it... just a couple of times I've learned the lesson that if you put something out there, people will find it and use it however they see fit and you won't be able to stop them. A couple of quite pleasant little lessons though, I'm lucky I've never experienced anything sinister like revenge porn or doxxing or people selling my social media photos on Reddit or the Daily Mail doing a hatchet job on me, and I'm very wary of stuff like that.

No-one deserves abuse of course but I don't understand why people so willingly put this very intimate stuff out there. Even if you don't get any abuse over it you could face other problems, like a potential employer finding it. Also I find Twitter bad for my anxiety at the best of times, my skin simply isn't thick enough to handle the kind of negative attention some people get on there.

[Butchers Blind]

Twitch is gonna blow your mind

Its madness and people are fucking idiots.

I could understand it if the lady was in the poor house and desperately needed these things but it's just because she posted a nice picture of herself. If you really want to spend money that badly, donate to your local food bank.