Compulsory patriotism

[The Culture Bunker]

Growing up in Whitehaven, I didn't really much patriotism. My granddad and others from his generation had spent their lives working in the mines, plenty had been through the war, and didn't seem to hold much truck with flag waving kind of stuff. If anything, it was more local tribalism ("we're much better than those jam-eating gets up the road"). There would be a union flag waving above the town hall, but not much else beyond getting excited during Italia '90 and Euro '96.

When I've been back in recent years, there's certainly more of it - flags hanging outside pubs, lads with tattoos featuring the Union Jack and whatnot. Maybe it's linked to the town's continued decline and lack of opportunity for those left there? The strong leaning to Brexit and bringing in the first Tory MP for about 100 years is probably linked to it.

Having an Iranian wife, I'm glad this kind of stuff isn't a feature to much of a noticeable degree in my corner of Manchester, but I know it's out there.

[Kankurette]

Were you born hugger mugger to the sound of the bladdy Bow Bells?

I was. You slaaaaaags.

[BlodwynPig]

Nope I know lots of working class leftwingers that get this irl (most people do); I'm talking about online.  Also why would people be saying stop sneering at them if no-one is actually sneering at them (or it appearing to be that they are sneering at them).

It comes back to what I've been saying for sometime; any rightwinger with a brain could work out that pretending to be a lefty going massively over the top; sneering at people; calling people names etc... making ridiculous demands and seeing offence everywhere makes an unappealing movement.  Actual leftwingers need to make sure they are distinguishing themselves from these unhelpful behaviours.

wHY dO yoU hAtE thE LeFt sO mUCh?

[Kankurette]

Nope I know lots of working class leftwingers that get this irl (most people do); I'm talking about online.  Also why would people be saying stop sneering at them if no-one is actually sneering at them (or it appearing to be that they are sneering at them).

It comes back to what I've been saying for sometime; any rightwinger with a brain could work out that pretending to be a lefty going massively over the top; sneering at people; calling people names etc... making ridiculous demands and seeing offence everywhere makes an unappealing movement.  Actual leftwingers need to make sure they are distinguishing themselves from these unhelpful behaviours.

Right-wingers also do this tbf. Like the endless cryarsing about black people in ads and 'wokeness'. And I was also talking about online.

I'm not proud to be a Londoner by birth but I do feel an attachment to it. I couldn't live there but I always feel a bit nostalgic when I go there.

[SteveDave]

Got two tins of these yesterday. Rest of you are probably communists or labour voters or some shit.

I got these beans the other day...



I now love Brexit and kids.

[Kankurette]

Just don't drive any cars into swimming pools. Or put bombs in your bog.

[SteveDave]

Just don't drive any cars into swimming pools. Or put bombs in your bog.

We left the EU so we can do what we LIKE

[Ferris]

I'm from Bow in east London but because I'm quite well-spoken people always assume I'm one of the rich hipsters who moved to that area after university and priced the actual cockneys out. Even when I explain this definitely isn't the case I can tell people aren't convinced.

For this reason I find it hard to identify with being a cockney at all.

I went through a phase during undergrad whenever someone asked me where I was from I'd pretend to be distracted and take a quick note, then say "sorry, what did you ask?", then duly reply "Birmingham", and when they said "oh, you don't have the accent" I'd reveal I'd written "oh you don't have the accent" on the paper because every fucker for three years said it to me.

Stopped doing after a while because it was a bit of a prick move but I maintain it was quite funny and usually got a laugh. All in the delivery you see.

[TrenterPercenter]

Right-wingers also do this tbf. Like the endless cryarsing about black people in ads and 'wokeness'. And I was also talking about online.

Yes they do; I'm not suggesting it is either or; part of this there are two sides and they are both as bad as each other is the whole trick; you have to believe somewhat that right-wingers behaviours are relational to left-wingers in some tit for tat sense.

All I'm saying is being angry all the time and slagging off poor white people isn't a good look for a movement looking to gain support from a country with a lot of poor white people in it.

Excuse me a minute just need to have word with the pig.

[Paul Calf]

I went through a phase during undergrad whenever someone asked me where I was from I'd pretend to be distracted and take a quick note, then say "sorry, what did you ask?", then duly reply "Birmingham", and when they said "oh, you don't have the accent" I'd reveal I'd written "oh you don't have the accent" on the paper because every fucker for three years said it to me.

Stopped doing after a while because it was a bit of a prick move but I maintain it was quite funny and usually got a laugh. All in the delivery you see.

Do people do the accent when they talk to you? There's a certain type of person who can't resist saying the name of the city 'Brimingham' in a shite hammy Brum accent.

[Attila]

Tear them down and replace with the flag of hedgehogs - the true patriots of Britain

[TrenterPercenter]

wHY dO yoU hAtE thE LeFt sO mUCh?

I love the left; the actual left; want to talk about what that is anytime? Or are you still busy sharing Starmer memes and hanging out with middle class art students on twitter?

I'd love to actually talk about some leftwing politics.........pie and a pint?

[TrenterPercenter]

I went through a phase during undergrad whenever someone asked me where I was from I'd pretend to be distracted and take a quick note, then say "sorry, what did you ask?", then duly reply "Birmingham", and when they said "oh, you don't have the accent" I'd reveal I'd written "oh you don't have the accent" on the paper because every fucker for three years said it to me.

Stopped doing after a while because it was a bit of a prick move but I maintain it was quite funny and usually got a laugh. All in the delivery you see.

hehe I know your pain; but wait a minute I thought you were from the Black Country?

[Buelligan]

wHY dO yoU hAtE thE LeFt sO mUCh?

Or are you still busy sharing Starmer memes and hanging out with middle class art students on twitter?

[chveik]

HEAD GONE

[TrenterPercenter]

Ah wondered when the team would arrive it really is clockwork with you lot.

[Icehaven]

I've been looking for a second hand freezer on ebay recently and it amused me to see a few had either the Union Jack or St. George's Cross on the door. Is it a common thing to patriotify kitchen appliances? Can you get microwaves that play the national anthem instead of pinging? Dishwashers shaped like Buckingham Palace?

[Mr Banlon]

I've been looking for a second hand freezer on ebay recently and it amused me to see a few had either the Union Jack or St. George's Cross on the door. Is it a common thing to patriotify kitchen appliances? Can you get microwaves that play the national anthem instead of pinging? Dishwashers shaped like Buckingham Palace?

There's a reason they're called 'white' goods

[Kankurette]

Yes they do; I'm not suggesting it is either or; part of this there are two sides and they are both as bad as each other is the whole trick; you have to believe somewhat that right-wingers behaviours are relational to left-wingers in some tit for tat sense.

All I'm saying is being angry all the time and slagging off poor white people isn't a good look for a movement looking to gain support from a country with a lot of poor white people in it.

Excuse me a minute just need to have word with the pig.

I'm not slagging off poor white people. I'm slagging off the far right.

Ai yai yai we are talking at cross purposes here.

[TrenterPercenter]

I've been looking for a second hand freezer on ebay recently and it amused me to see a few had either the Union Jack or St. George's Cross on the door. Is it a common thing to patriotify kitchen appliances? Can you get microwaves that play the national anthem instead of pinging? Dishwashers shaped like Buckingham Palace?

I think there is going to be a bit of a boom in flaggery on things post-Brexit whilst the country tries to re-identify itself as independent.  This doesn't necessarily map to nationalism en-masse but for tourism and international trade purposes it could be good in some ways. 

There seems to be a bit of collective amnesia out there around the fact things like this have happened before; Cool Britannia was flag crazy and obviously the obsession with the proms; someone mentioned the who and all that 60s and 70s flaggery.  No-one thought Damon Albarn was delivering proto-facism to the masses. 

Some people just want simple things to feel proud about; often these are people that haven't got other securities so they seek big banner or purpose made things; lots of people live vicariously through the royal family for instance as a guide for their own family problems; they provide consistency to those that may not have had it.  It's incredibly unhealthy and superficial but it's something in absence of other things.  Of there is a nationalist side of things that is were the real problem lies (Orwell btw defined patriotism and nationalism as different things with nationalism the hatred of other countries and patriotism the love ones own country - sorry this might have already been said)

[Fambo Number Mive]

I don't think it's ever been used in such a divisive, toxic way before. Tory MPs are using it to say that people who disagree with them should go and.live somewhere else or be "educated".

[TrenterPercenter]

I'm not slagging off poor white people. I'm slagging off the far right.

Ai yai yai we are talking at cross purposes here.

Yes I got that; the rightwing; the organised rightwing don't care about poor white people; they use them for their own purposes and they tell them that the leftwing is elitist and hates them because they are poor and white.  I wasn't talking about you I was making a general point that leftwingers need to avoid walking into that trap (and this isn't about playing to the rightwings demands it is about creating a new culture of what is acceptable).

[Attila]

I've been looking for a second hand freezer on ebay recently and it amused me to see a few had either the Union Jack or St. George's Cross on the door. Is it a common thing to patriotify kitchen appliances? Can you get microwaves that play the national anthem instead of pinging? Dishwashers shaped like Buckingham Palace?

We've got a sticker of a cat who looks like Tiny Toast on ours.

[TrenterPercenter]

I don't think it's ever been used in such a divisive, toxic way before. Tory MPs are using it to say that people who disagree with them should go and.live somewhere else or be "educated".

Yes well perhaps this is "Cruel Britannia" and maybe these people need to be isolated and targeted rather than the general white unwashed; the trick has been for sometime to get critics conflating the UK population with arseholes like Rees-Mogg.

[Zetetic]

No-one thought Damon Albarn was delivering proto-facism to the masses.

https://corpor.at/artists/The_Indelicates/Juniverbrecher/Everything_English_Is_The_Enemy/ ?

[Icehaven]

I think there is going to be a bit of a boom in flaggery on things post-Brexit whilst the country tries to re-identify itself as independent.  This doesn't necessarily map to nationalism en-masse but for tourism and international trade purposes it could be good in some ways. 

There seems to be a bit of collective amnesia out there around the fact things like this have happened before; Cool Britannia was flag crazy and obviously the obsession with the proms; someone mentioned the who and all that 60s and 70s flaggery.  No-one thought Damon Albarn was delivering proto-facism to the masses. 

Some people just want simple things to feel proud about; often these are people that haven't got other securities so they seek big banner or purpose made things; lots of people live vicariously through the royal family for instance as a guide for their own family problems; they provide consistency to those that may not have had it.  It's incredibly unhealthy and superficial but it's something in absence of other things.  Of there is a nationalist side of things that is were the real problem lies (Orwell btw defined patriotism and nationalism as different things with nationalism the hatred of other countries and patriotism the love ones own country - sorry this might have already been said)

I spose really I was questioning why freezer doors, and why only flags? It's not as if there's tons of old freezers out there with other popular stuff on, like football badges or bands or nice scenery etc., just these two flags. And some of them are so old they're clearly from a previous flag waving era as they certainly aren't from this one, not for £20 collection only anyway. It's just odd to me to pick a random household appliance that doesn't usually come decorated and manufacture it with a flag on. Mugs, keyrings, car stickers, that sort of thing I can understand as they generally are themed/personalised etc., but a freezer door?

[canadagoose]

Ai yai yai

I read that in Michael Rosen's voice, because I used to hear him saying that in some of his poems. Then I somehow ended up saying it myself (not on purpose, it just got into my head somehow). Sorry, nothing to do with the topic really.

[TrenterPercenter]

I spose really I was questioning why freezer doors, and why only flags? It's not as if there's tons of old freezers out there with other popular stuff on, like football badges or bands or nice scenery etc., just these two flags. And some of them are so old they're clearly from a previous flag waving era as they certainly aren't from this one, not for £20 collection only anyway. It's just odd to me to pick a random household appliance that doesn't usually come decorated and manufacture it with a flag on. Mugs, keyrings, car stickers, that sort of thing I can understand as they generally are themed/personalised etc., but a freezer door?

It's a thing; we probably don't understand it too well within the country but outside we are seen to many as a mad little country with it's unique eccentricities; Britophilia is a thing just like people love Japanese culture; so this douche-flaggery has some currency.  This also seems to combine with retro elements a lot of the time as UK culture in the sixties was quite dominant.

https://www.smeg.com/news/new-smeg-union-jack-toaster-a-versatile-icon-with-a-british-look.html

This is often what a lot of British people are getting misty eyed at; a time when they were getting a lot of attention internationally, they were young and healthy and they pine for those feelings again; they use flags etc as a conduit but that is very different from using a flag and thinking about racial domination of the world.

[dissolute ocelot]

Fridge and freezer doors are very boring, large white spaces, there's a reason people cover them with all kinds of things. And while there def are union jacks, you can buy anything online from fake wood chip fridge wallpaper to "British flag or flag of any country" (not sure how they'll manage Nepal, but never mind).

[TrenterPercenter]

This is what mean about this post-Brexit boom in Union Jacks; it's basically going to be a load of people just trying flog tat (likely made in china) whilst sticking Union Jack on it.