Before We Was We: Madness by Madness

[DrGreggles]

Anyone else catch this?
Essentially it's a telly version of their book from a couple of years ago about their childhoods and the early days of the band.
Nicely done, I thought. The film inserts work well.
Good to see Chas involved too.

Episode 1: https://youtu.be/0tVMEQcySwk

[Brundle-Fly]

Even if you don't like their music, (which I do) it's a fantastic snapshot of London, of being young and in a band in the 1970s. It also dispels the assumption that Madness were all born and bred working-class urchins. They were a mix of all classes and types like the best bands always are.  An unpretentious, no-nonsense presentation too. No fans, no experts, no peers, no interviewer, not even much about their success of the past forty years, just the nutty boys telling their story before they were they.

[Jockice]

Ooh, this looks good. I read the book of the same name last year and thoroughly enjoyed it. I shall watch it later.

[phes]

Can't find the second or third episodes anywhere. Shame, was really enjoying that but obviously not going to buy an entire tv channel to finish it

[DrGreggles]

Can't find the second or third episodes anywhere.

It only started yesterday.

[phes]

I got the impression that all three episodes had been put on BT for on demand. The wording in articles isn't 100% clear though

[Jockice]

They have been, I'm a BT customer with the set-up on my bedroom TV.  I watched the first part last night (with subtitles as for some reason the sound wasn't working) and will possibly watch the other two on my laptop later today.

[Brundle-Fly]

For those non-BT customers, while we wait for the DVD or someone to upload this onto YouTube, in the meantime, there is always the latest The Reunion to enjoy on BBC Radio 4.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m000vp07

[SteveDave]

I'm going to take this opportunity to say that everyone should listen to "A Comfortable Man" by Cathal "Chas Smash" Smyth.

[Johnboy]

this looks good

[Brundle-Fly]

I'm going to take this opportunity to say that everyone should listen to "A Comfortable Man" by Cathal "Chas Smash" Smyth.

It's good, isn't it? Bit doleful though. Overlooked, because Cathal will always be seen as Chas Smash, unfairly labelled as the proto Bez when his contribution to the band was far more comprehensive than the freaky dancer. He co-wrote their biggest hit, Our House for a start.

[DrGreggles]

Chas co-wrote a surprising number of their hits, considering he was the last one to involve himself in the songwriting. Taught himself to play loads of instruments too.

'A Comfortable Man' is a very good album, but it certainly needed to exist outside of Madness.

He still considers himself "on hiatus" from the band, rather than having left, so hopefully he'll be back soon - and his involvement in this is surely a positive sign.

[Brundle-Fly]

He still considers himself "on hiatus" from the band, rather than having left, so hopefully he'll be back soon - and his involvement in this is surely a positive sign.

Hmm, don't hold your breath.

[mrClaypole]

I'm going to take this opportunity to say that everyone should listen to "A Comfortable Man" by Cathal "Chas Smash" Smyth.

It's an amazing album. Theres always been a sorrowful strand running through his work. I guess thats the Irish in him.
I'm not sure if Cathal would ever come back as I have heard that theres some pretty big rifts going on with at least 3 members of the band against him.
Seeing Madness live and hearing his introduction to One step beyond was always hairs on the back of the neck standing up moment.
Suggs just doesn't rally the crowd like that.
I've been alittle disappointed after the last 3 Chas less gigs I've attended

[DrGreggles]

Hence the "hopefully"!

[mrClaypole]

Hence the "hopefully"!

There were alot hoping he would be back for 2019s 40th anniversary. It was hopeful that he did attend the Camden walk of fame ceremony though

[Brundle-Fly]

They weren't a happy ship for a long time until Cathal left. If he had remained I don't think they'd be a going concern today. His presence is greatly missed at the live shows (like Neville Staples at The Specials gigs) and without Chas galvanizing everybody, the band might never have got back together in the nineties. Madness haven't tried to erase him from their history which is something. He was even interviewed for Thommo's doc.

[Brundle-Fly]

Seeing Madness live and hearing his introduction to One step beyond was always hairs on the back of the neck standing up moment.
Suggs just doesn't rally the crowd like that.

True, but I think Suggs is wary of stepping into Chas's loafers for the booming One Step Beyond intro so throws it away. It's a shame we probably won't ever hear Michael Caine live again, but having said that, Suggs doesn't have an issue singing Wings Of A Dove.

[DrGreggles]

He was even interviewed for Thommo's doc.

That was great, and wonderfully odd!

[mrClaypole]

That was great, and wonderfully odd!

Yes its typically Thommo. He really is the same off stage as he is on. A truly nice bloke who's definitely a genuine eccentric one off.

[holyzombiejesus]

They weren't a happy ship for a long time until Cathal left.

How come?

[Jockice]

It's an amazing album. Theres always been a sorrowful strand running through his work. I guess thats the Irish in him.
I'm not sure if Cathal would ever come back as I have heard that theres some pretty big rifts going on with at least 3 members of the band against him.

Which three? Just out of nosiness really. I've now watched all three parts of the documentary and it is indeed very good.

I've always loved Madness but have only ever seen them live once. On that occasion Bedders was on hiatus. It didn't make much difference but I can imagine it would if either of the two friontmen weren't there..

[holyzombiejesus]

They were the first and second band I saw (well, Jo Boxers were first as they were supporting).

[Brundle-Fly]

How come?

Without speculating too much, as far as I can gather, tensions between certain members and Cathal had been festering for a long time. I suppose that's what happens when you've been in each others' faces recording and touring for thirty-odd years. There was a bit of intimidation going on too and some physical altercations that were the final nail in the coffin. They're quite a boozy band (well, half of them are, no prizes for which ones) that didn't help resolve matters. There was talk of Cathal doing the 2019 Electric Ballroom gig but it was vetoed by a couple of members because they didn't need the stress.  The fact he lives in Ibiza now made any meetings/ rehearsals a real ballache too. But who knows? Stranger reconciliations have happened and there not getting any younger. A couple of years ago, Cathal had a nasty cancer scare that was underplayed by the press.

[mrClaypole]

Which three? Just out of nosiness really. I've now watched all three parts of the documentary and it is indeed very good.

I've always loved Madness but have only ever seen them live once. On that occasion Bedders was on hiatus. It didn't make much difference but I can imagine it would if either of the two friontmen weren't there..

Lee and Cathal have always had abit of a thing.  Chrissyboy also. But the main reason why he left was he and Suggs had almighty row causing them to cancel a concert just before Cathal left.  Apparently Suggs gave an ultimatum to the band "either he goes or I do".

[DrGreggles]

I wonder if that's what persuaded him to go to rehab.
He's all about meditation these days, isn't he.
Hope he's doing OK.

[mrClaypole]

I wonder if that's what persuaded him to go to rehab.
He's all about meditation these days, isn't he.
Hope he's doing OK.

I believe the rehab happened around 2011- 2012. I was told by someone it may have been a remark to Suggs about his drinking that lead to the furious bust up
Suggs has never discussed what happened with any of the band apparently but as Suggs was one of the peacekeepers in the group Cathal had no one in his corner to fight for him to stay as the band sided with Suggs as he obviously would be the bigger loss.
As I say it caused the band to cancel a concert in Russia and the excuse was that Suggs was I'll, the real reason was that the management couldn't convince Suggs to carry on with Cathal still in the band.

[Goldentony]

mates mates band were in a car with one of Madness once who was managing them at the time, in the car the guy got a call (carphone, london) that detailed the possibility of the possibily upcoming reunion gig at Hyde Park or wherever in London it was, Old Kent Road Park, told everyone what happened and upon getting out the car a little later the band basically said "thats us fucked then hey" and, dear reader, they were right

[mrClaypole]

mates mates band were in a car with one of Madness once who was managing them at the time, in the car the guy got a call (carphone, london) that detailed the possibility of the possibily upcoming reunion gig at Hyde Park or wherever in London it was, Old Kent Road Park, told everyone what happened and upon getting out the car a little later the band basically said "thats us fucked then hey" and, dear reader, they were right

When was this and why were your mates band fucked?

[Goldentony]

he fucked off to sell out Cockney Park and do TV appearances and Jools Holland for the rest of time and like a lot of bands I guess, when the one person rooting for you at the label fucks off thats your arse. Wasn't his/her fault, but it's funny to hear about it happening in real time in front of you. it's whenever that big reunion show was? fake edit - madstock