Author Topic: Star Trek: The Next Generation Rewatch (oh god no)  (Read 47816 times)

Re: Star Trek: The Next Generation Rewatch (oh god no)
« Reply #120 on: May 18, 2021, 09:54:10 PM »
Justice does have a great Worf one liner, though:

Tasha: "...and they make love at the drop of a hat."
Worf: "Any hat."

Re: Star Trek: The Next Generation Rewatch (oh god no)
« Reply #121 on: May 18, 2021, 10:46:18 PM »
This intrigued me, as I follow Sirtis on Twitter and she's always seemed lovely.  Googling Mara Wilson Marina Sirtis gave me this article which led to this tweet:

Ouch!

Seems more flippant and uninformed than actually hateful, although i'm sure your actual Native Americans are pretty fed up with such comments. Someone should send Sirtis a copy of 1491 by Charles Mann.

Not sure what to make of Mara Wilson, she seems to enjoy airing acquaintances' and former friends' dirty laundry a bit too much, to no obvious constructive purpose.

Re: Star Trek: The Next Generation Rewatch (oh god no)
« Reply #122 on: May 18, 2021, 11:00:52 PM »
Seems more flippant and uninformed than actually hateful, although i'm sure your actual Native Americans are pretty fed up with such comments.

Agreed.

She was very supportive when the whole #BLM thing was at its height.

bgmnts

  • Depressed to the point of poisonous toxicity.
Re: Star Trek: The Next Generation Rewatch (oh god no)
« Reply #123 on: May 18, 2021, 11:04:13 PM »
Seems more flippant and uninformed than actually hateful, although i'm sure your actual Native Americans are pretty fed up with such comments. Someone should send Sirtis a copy of 1491 by Charles Mann.

Not sure what to make of Mara Wilson, she seems to enjoy airing acquaintances' and former friends' dirty laundry a bit too much, to no obvious constructive purpose.

I dont even think the two comments contradict each other much.

Lemming

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Generation Rewatch (oh god no)
« Reply #124 on: May 20, 2021, 12:03:19 AM »
S01E08 - The Battle

A Ferengi Captain brings Picard's old ship, the Stargazer, to him as a gift. But there's a mindfucking afoot!

- Wesley has been playing around in Engineering, as a hobby, and has boosted the Enterprise's sensor capabilities. As a hobby. For fun.

- THE PICARD MANEUEVER!

- I like how the episode doesn't waste your time by trying to make you believe the obviously-fake log is real. The script could easily have wasted 15 minutes on having Riker or some other idiot giving it the "MAYBE PICARD REALLY DID FIRE FIRST???" treatment, but instead it wisely just presents the log as another piece of the puzzle for the crew to solve.

- Damon Bok has a SPHERE of PAIN which he's using to give Picard a headache, as part of his grand revenge plan.

- Check out this crazy shot:



- The ghost-crew on the bridge are what stuck in my memory for this episode. Great special effect, properly creepy.

- Miniskirt uniform sighted! I thought it'd been phased out by this point, but it's still here!

- Wesley beats Bev at neuroscience. Felt so bad for Wil Wheaton having to act this shit.

- The Ferengi first officer is cool and stops Bok. Now it's up to Riker to find a defence against THE PICARD MANEUEVER!!!! Turns out you just fire a tractor beam.

- The stupid melodramatic sequence of Picard being blown backwards in slow-mo made me howl with laughter. In fact, fuck it, have another gif:



Not a huge amount to say about this episode overall. I remember liking it more than I do. It's got the skeleton of a good idea, but outside a few scenes that are memorably creepy in isolation, it's mostly boring. There's no real mystery to dig into, not least because the episode outright shows you Bok cackling evilly while messing with the SPHERE of PAIN long before the characters find out about it, so you spend half the episode just waiting for them to catch up. As you can probably tell through the sparseness of this review, not a lot really happens over the course of the 45 minute runtime.

The episode suffers also because there's nothing to get into with Damon Bok. He's the driving force behind the plot but he barely gets any screen-time, and we don't learn enough about him or his son to sympathise with him or hate him.

3/10, maybe 4 on a good day. I wanted to like it more than I did.


bgmnts

  • Depressed to the point of poisonous toxicity.
Re: Star Trek: The Next Generation Rewatch (oh god no)
« Reply #125 on: May 20, 2021, 12:05:43 AM »
The editing in that explosion is amazing.

I'm not surprised I barely remember any of this, it's shite.

mothman

  • I don't know why
Re: Star Trek: The Next Generation Rewatch (oh god no)
« Reply #126 on: May 20, 2021, 12:15:31 AM »
I have this theory that the Stargazer was a “deep space exploration vessel.” We know they exist, but no class has ever been explicitly designated as such (sort of - more on that in a minute). There’s circumstantial evidence - Picard took command while still a lieutenant, then remained in command for 22 years; in one much-later episode he attends a seminar on “the psychological effects of deep space missions” which suggests he has some knowledge of the subject. And really the Stargazer with its four nacelles[1] would be ideal for long missions - if one or two nacelles broke they wouldn’t be dead in the water.

And that other ship class? The USS Prometheus in VOY “Message In A Bottle” - for “deep space tactical assignments” - and it has… four nacelles!

I’ll get me coat.
 1. a Constellation-class ship, so-called because in dialogue it was going to be the same class as the classic Enterprise - Constitution-class - and use the film models, before they redubbed it and built a new model.

Blumf

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Generation Rewatch (oh god no)
« Reply #127 on: May 20, 2021, 12:57:54 AM »
S01E08 - The Battle

...

3/10, maybe 4 on a good day. I wanted to like it more than I did.



Three!? Come on man! Even at it's worst that's a 5/10. Picard backstory (I think mothman is right) and some tense non-action. Even Riker manages to do something with his "first officer to first officer" chat, possibly the most proactive he'll ever be.

I think the big thing for me is seeing some actual tactics figured out, not just some meaningless "attack pattern gamma-6", but something that makes sense within universe. I'd like to see more of that in ST, particularly in ground action, as them just standing around in their space jim-jams with, at the most, a phase-rifle, seems a little lame and under thought.
« Last Edit: May 20, 2021, 01:09:10 AM by Blumf »

Lemming

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Generation Rewatch (oh god no)
« Reply #128 on: May 20, 2021, 01:26:39 AM »
True about Riker being useful for once. I wanted to like the episode but most of it honestly dragged.

Picard's backstory didn't really grab me, we essentially just learn one fact about his past career - he once captained the Stargazer and destroyed a Ferengi ship in self-defence. Patrick Stewart does great work in the scene with Beverly where he's freaking out about his mental stability and wondering if the past is as he recalls it, but it feels hollow to me because the episode has essentially already revealed everything to you. You already know Picard (obviously) didn't fire first and you already know that Bok's behind everything (because the episode explicitly, directly tells you this during the Bev-Picard scene by cutting to Bok doing his evil laugh while manipulating the pain-sphere), so it's just an exercise in watching Picard panic about questions you already have the answers to.

The biggest weakness is that the episode all sort of comes to nothing because it isn't interested in exploring Bok in any depth, even though his grief is the cause of the entire plot. The closest thing the episode has to a climax is Bok confronting Picard, but they exchange only a couple of fairly cliched lines with each other before Bok traps Picard in ghost-dream-hell and then vanishes to be dealt with very abruptly, off-screen, in a single line of dialogue. Meanwhile, Picard ragdolls in slow-mo across the bridge.

I think my memory of the ghost scenes made them seem a lot more harrowing than they actually are. Still effective though, really strong atmosphere.

daf

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Generation Rewatch (oh god no)
« Reply #129 on: May 20, 2021, 07:59:02 PM »
008 | “The Battle



Throbbing-Ball Ache!

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Highlights :
• One of your "Earth Hours"
• Square space-pillow - Ooh, there's comfy!
• Fantastic Fake Ferengi Fangs
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Other Bits :
• Possessed Picard (Again!)
• "Silver Sphere”?? - It's red with grey bits Riker, you plum!
• Wesley’s Jumper watch : Slate blue with Rainbow stripe
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

Score :

Re: Star Trek: The Next Generation Rewatch (oh god no)
« Reply #130 on: May 20, 2021, 08:50:06 PM »
One sadness I have about Season 1 is that the older I get, the further I am away from the nostalgia I have for it. I loved it as a child. I had a fair few Season 1 episodes on VHS/DVD whereas I had less of the later episodes so I watched them much more. When I was younger and had less discerning taste, it was mostly all just the same to me.

Lemming

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Generation Rewatch (oh god no)
« Reply #131 on: May 21, 2021, 11:24:36 PM »
S01E09 - Hide and Q

After being apprehended by Q once again, Riker is granted Q powers.

- Deeply awkward Picard-Tasha pep talk, that ends with her about to start flirting with him.

- Despite a string of consistently great performances by John De Lancie, I've never been a huge fan of the Q character. The Squire of Gothos has always been one of my favourite episodes of TOS, and Q feels like a less interesting knockoff of Trelane most of the time, especially when they soften him up a bit in later episodes. Here, he's a lot more threatening and unpleasant, but still basically feels like Evil Trelane.

- Q tells Riker that he may learn the "true nature of the universe". More of early-TNG's vaguely supernatural stuff, like we saw with the Traveller.

- Q needs to understand more about "the human compulsion" to explore and learn. The Enterprise isn't even a human ship, it's a Federation ship, and clearly there are thousands of other species who like exploring. Human exceptionalist BULLSHIT

- Wesley impaled, LOL

- Q is testing whether or not humans have the responsibility and wisdom to use Q powers. You'd think someone would point out that Q himself clearly doesn't have either of those qualities... I agree with the episode's belief that the powers are too great to entrust to anyone, but while Riker had them, he exclusively used them to save lives and try to make his friends happy.  Q, meanwhile, has so far exclusively used the same powers to torture and kill people. That's an open goal! Someone should have brought it up!

- Riker's dilemma over whether to save the dead child is probably the most interesting thing TNG has come up with so far, and it's a shame that it gets more or less swept under the rug after acting as the catalyst for Riker to yell at Picard. Picard's weedy explanation of why it was ok to save Worf and Wesley but not ok to save the child is such major-league horseshit. Unfortunately, the ending is the weak point to what has otherwise been a solid episode - Riker just does a bunch of obviously stupid shit that proves he's not ready for Q powers. Having him agonise over the dead child would have made for a far more compelling and morally tricky episode, but instead he just makes illusionary Klingons and ages up Wesley before admitting Picard was right about everything.

- Tasha and Bev didn't get gifts! And Troi doesn't appear at all!

It's an episode that's pretty lightweight when you get down to it. The entire plot can be summarised very briefly: Q apprehends the Enterprise, Riker is granted Q powers, Picard warns him not to use them, Riker goes a bit nuts and then realises Picard was right. As I said, it's irritating that the episode ends up being so straightforward and thin, because it comes up with a very effective plot device in the dead kid and Riker's decision over whether or not to save her, but then discards that for a far less interesting scenario.

Still, it works, and, unlike most other series one episodes, it's not boring. 5/10. More like 5 and a half, but we're NOT doing decimals EVER.



« Last Edit: May 21, 2021, 11:35:06 PM by Lemming »

Malcy

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Generation Rewatch (oh god no)
« Reply #132 on: May 21, 2021, 11:52:26 PM »
Could use Tom Hardy as Shinzon for a half-Picard!

Blumf

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Generation Rewatch (oh god no)
« Reply #133 on: May 22, 2021, 12:00:32 AM »
Worf's description of Klingon foreplay is a highlight.

What would you give Tasha?

As for Bev, it'd have to be her long dead hubby, but I don't think they'd want to deal with that baggage, not enough time for starters.

bgmnts

  • Depressed to the point of poisonous toxicity.
Re: Star Trek: The Next Generation Rewatch (oh god no)
« Reply #134 on: May 22, 2021, 12:02:57 AM »
The Q episodes are the best of Star Trek TNG in my memory.

Re: Star Trek: The Next Generation Rewatch (oh god no)
« Reply #135 on: May 22, 2021, 12:07:47 AM »
What would you give Tasha?

Permanently inebriated horny Data? 

daf

  • Hello Faithful Reader!
Re: Star Trek: The Next Generation Rewatch (oh god no)
« Reply #136 on: May 22, 2021, 07:54:48 PM »
009 | “Hide And Q



The Last Temptation of RiQer

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Highlights :
• Shakespicard
• Worf Sex-Fight
• Data Cocktail : Castrol GTX?
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Other Bits :
• Class M Cyclorama
• Napoleons Blown-apart
• Big Wesley = Spongebob Squarejaw
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

Score :

Lemming

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Generation Rewatch (oh god no)
« Reply #137 on: May 23, 2021, 01:01:54 AM »
• Big Wesley = Spongebob Squarejaw


Lemming

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Generation Rewatch (oh god no)
« Reply #138 on: May 23, 2021, 03:48:57 PM »
S01E10 - Haven

As Troi struggles to deal with her incoming arranged marriage, the Enterprise visits a planet so beautiful that it is rumoured to be able to cure any ailment.

- Armin Shimerman box. Fucking horrifying.

- Here's a controversial opinion for you - I love Lwaxana Troi, I think she's a much-needed dose of actual character in a show where people tend towards being very bland, and Majel Barret is a very underrated actor. Yes, the character can be very grating and unlikeable, but at least that's the reaction you're meant to have to her (unlike, say, Wesley and Neelix), and at least she's more interesting than the collection of interchangeable dull-as-dishwater knobheads that the main cast (barring Data and Worf) can often be.

- Got a genuine laugh out of Picard being too shit to lift the luggage. The agonised walk he does down the corridor, brilliant.

- Crap attempted explanation as to why Troi has that accent - she got it from her father, apparently.

- Troi tells her soon-to-be-husband, Wyatt, that she might be able to teach him telepathy. Call-back to Encounter at Farpoint, where we learned that Riker has a telepathic link with Troi. Will never be brought up ever again, as far as I remember.

- A race called the Tarellians, previously thought extinct, arrive at Haven. They are the last survivors of a bioweapon that obliterated their entire planet. They're all necessarily infected with the bioweapon, and could destroy Haven if they're allowed to land - yet they have nowhere else to go. Cool scenario for the Enterprise crew to stress over. They all decide to forget about it and go to Troi's pre-wedding party instead.

- Love Lwaxana's ridiculous pink eyeshadow at the party, which seems to extend so far up the side of her face that it practically goes into her hairline. Reminds me of when I first started learning makeup and just smeared any old shit all over the place. This is the style in the 24th Century, no doubt.

- Miniskirt uniform at the party! It's still going!

- Riker's a complete prat. Hostile towards Troi, then hostile towards Wyatt. Made much worse retrospectively as I'm pretty sure it was him who broke up with Troi (I seem to remember the Thomas Riker episode clarifying this?), and yet he stomps around the holodeck whining "THIS ISN'T FAIR ON ME!!!"

- Wyatt has seen a woman in his dreams since he was a kid. In a twist you can see coming from sixty miles away, it turns out she's on the Tarellian ship, and she's seen him in visions too. I like that the episode makes no attempt to explain this beyond Lwxana chalking it up to cosmic mystery and all thoughts being connected - yet more mysterious supernatural stuff in the vein of Q and the Traveller, which really appeals to me.

Overall enjoyed this one. The early-TNG weirdness is in full effect, with the concept behind Haven, the idea of a race of refugees who endlessly roam space after the destruction of their homeworld, and the idea of two people being mentally linked across the vastness of space since birth. The ending where Wyatt leaves with the Tarellians was a nice emotionally affecting payoff to the episode. Plenty of good Lwaxana content, including her just straight-up fucking up the entire dinner by being a prick, which ends very satisfyingly with Troi yelling at her and throwing the STUPID Betazoid gong to the floor. 6/10, though from what I've seen of other people's reviews of this episode, I'm guessing that my positive reaction is fairly uncommon - people seem to hate this one.


bgmnts

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Generation Rewatch (oh god no)
« Reply #139 on: May 23, 2021, 03:50:24 PM »
I don't get why people don't like Troi? She sort of grounds the other characters. Maybe you could say she's the heart of the crew? I don't know.

Lemming

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Generation Rewatch (oh god no)
« Reply #140 on: May 23, 2021, 04:01:11 PM »
I don't get why people don't like Troi? She sort of grounds the other characters. Maybe you could say she's the heart of the crew? I don't know.

Agreed, she's great when written well. It's probably just that the writing for her character is very weak a lot of the time. If you ask a casual TNG fan what they think of Troi, they usually joke about how all she does is point out the obvious ("I'm sensing hostility, Captain"), which isn't really reflective of her role in the show, but isn't totally untrue either.

Also, I hesitate to say this because it's probably only true in a relatively small number of cases, but sexism probably plays a role too. Same reason Janeway has a reputation among fans for being unhinged and bipolar, while Kirk, who IMO is written far more inconsistently and incoherently than Janeway, gets a free pass whenever he acts like an unhinged lunatic (Arena, Obsession, A Taste of Armageddon, virtually every single TOS movie, etc). Riker is far more useless than Troi, he spends most of the later seasons just repeating the last thing that's been said to him and staring dumbly at everyone, but for some reason fans tend to latch onto him while ripping Troi to pieces for being far less incompetent/inept.

mothman

  • I don't know why
Re: Star Trek: The Next Generation Rewatch (oh god no)
« Reply #141 on: May 23, 2021, 04:01:34 PM »
It feels like they just didn’t know what to do with the character half the time. They way they used her empathic gift was inconsistent. It’s ironic that - given how she also had a not-insignificant guest role on VOY, and came back for PIC too (the less said about the ENT finale the better) - they did think about replacing her with Jeri Ryan for at least one TNG movie.

Blumf

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Generation Rewatch (oh god no)
« Reply #142 on: May 23, 2021, 06:07:52 PM »
S01E10 - Haven

You forgot to mention Mr Homn, the best character in all of TNG, and who should take the 11/10 position in the rating system.


Chairman Yang

  • life changing
Re: Star Trek: The Next Generation Rewatch (oh god no)
« Reply #143 on: May 23, 2021, 07:35:53 PM »
God, Lemming isn't wrong. Mrs. Troi is like an oasis in a desert of bland characters. I think this might have been the first episode in this rewatch I wasn't even slightly bored with.

Incredible character development for Riker who rolls his eyes at the thought of doing his job during 'harp women hour' and then ditches his duties officiating the wedding dinner to have a strop. See also: every other time he's challenged in the show.

Love that Wyatt's heroic destiny is to run off to "save" this eight-person species. They're fucked, mate!



... Jaysus.

daf

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Generation Rewatch (oh god no)
« Reply #144 on: May 23, 2021, 08:00:58 PM »
010 | “Haven



We’re having a Gong-Bong, we’re having a ball!

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Highlights :
• Sozzled Lurch
• Lwaxana Pricard-Tease
• Ooh - Fancy party hairdo’s for the ladies!
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Other Bits :
• Talking Silver Squark-Box
• Riker’s Hologram Harpies
• Troi costume watch : Shiny Purple Pants
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

Score :

earl_sleek

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Generation Rewatch (oh god no)
« Reply #145 on: May 24, 2021, 05:20:08 PM »
Lwaxana Troi is an awful person who doesn't respect anybody but herself. She constantly belittles and demeans Deanna, mocks cultures that aren't her own and goes out of her way to sexually harass Picard, even though as a telepath she must know he doesn't consent.

She's alright in that DS9 episode with Odo.

Re: Star Trek: The Next Generation Rewatch (oh god no)
« Reply #146 on: May 24, 2021, 05:26:56 PM »
She is all that but it made her perfect for the Season 4 episode Half a Life. I can't believe how much I overlooked that over the years.

Lemming

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Generation Rewatch (oh god no)
« Reply #147 on: May 24, 2021, 11:35:38 PM »
Good to see Haven getting a fair appraisal! And yes, Mr Homn is outstanding. My dad is absolutely convinced that he's played by a strategically shaved Mick Fleetwood, despite concrete evidence to the contrary.

Lwaxana Troi is an awful person who doesn't respect anybody but herself. She constantly belittles and demeans Deanna, mocks cultures that aren't her own and goes out of her way to sexually harass Picard, even though as a telepath she must know he doesn't consent.

She's alright in that DS9 episode with Odo.

The only problem I really have with her is her treatment of Picard, which can be pretty nasty (though I do enjoy the comedic performances of both Barret and Stewart in episodes like Manhunt). Otherwise she's just incredibly rude and abrasive, which lightens up the screen in a show that can often slip into being very drab.

mothman

  • I don't know why
Re: Star Trek: The Next Generation Rewatch (oh god no)
« Reply #148 on: May 24, 2021, 11:50:20 PM »
Mr Homn is outstanding. My dad is absolutely convinced that he's played by a strategically shaved Mick Fleetwood, despite concrete evidence to the contrary.

I presume he’s aware that Fleetwood does make an appearance in one episode - “Lonely Among Us,” I think?

Re: Star Trek: The Next Generation Rewatch (oh god no)
« Reply #149 on: May 25, 2021, 12:45:28 AM »
I presume he’s aware that Fleetwood does make an appearance in one episode - “Lonely Among Us,” I think?

"Manhunt". He's unrecognisable.

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