Healthy skepticism or close-minded? (Reiki)

[JaDanketies]

The other day, someone on the internet told me that Reiki is peer-reviewed and evidence-based, and I asked them for something to back up their claim. They sent me a three links, one was obvious bullshit, one didn't come to the conclusion they pretended it did, but there was one link that appeared to be a literature review in a peer-reviewed journal, and that came to the conclusion that Reiki is 'better than placebo' and has 'broad potential'. Here's the link.

Now I'm just a layperson, but I like to think I'm open-minded. My initial thoughts upon seeing that link was that there must be something up, because Reiki goes against everything we know about everything. So I read the review and thought that it came to a conclusion that was not backed up by the preceding evidence, that it appeared to be authored by a biased person, and that the journal it's in isn't worth a heap of shit. In fact I even found out that the journal has a so-called SJR score of 0.39, which suggests it is a low-quality journal.

However, maybe I don't know what I'm talking about, and because it's impossible for me to understand how Reiki is supposed to work, I might have just been dismissing a peer-reviewed study in a reputable journal that people way smarter than me have already agreed is not bogus. That I'm a layperson dismissing good-quality evidence because I don't understand it. I know some of you on here are scientific people so I wanted to know what you think of the link and if my dismissal was justified. Frankly this was the first time I'd ever heard of SJR scores.

The person who I was talking to got abusive and insulting with me shortly afterwards; there was probably something up with their chakras

[Zetetic]

Better than placebo at what?

What is the placebo - what does "sham Reiki" look like?

What effect size? (Preferably expressed something interpretable by a human being, even if they have to use a tool to do so.)

The usual link about epistemic helplessness.

because it's impossible for me to understand how Reiki is supposed to work

This isn't unimportant. Without a proposed mechanism of action that vaguely fits into our current understanding of physics, anatomy and pain perception and all that, the bar for believing in it is higher.

Also relevant - what's the decision being made on the basis of this? You need less evidence to believe in something if it's cheap and risk free, and you don't have a better alternative.

[Claude the Racecar Driving Rockstar Super Sleuth]

Someone did some reiki on my dog when she had cancer and, sure enough, she didn't die from the cancer.

She was put down.

[Gurke and Hare]

Better than placebo at what?

What is the placebo - what does "sham Reiki" look like?

I had the same question about studies of acupuncture, and could only assume that in that case it's putting the pins in random places rather than in the acupunture proscribed places. So for Reiki, I guess it would be waving your hands around at random rather than waving them around in the specific way.

[MojoJojo]

Reiki believers believe that to perform reiki, you have to be "attuned" by a reiki master to open the energy channels in your body. Sham reiki is done by someone doing the same actions as Reiki master, but they haven't been attuned. Still means the trials aren't really double blind.

I looked at one of the studies on cancer patients. Weirdly, 16 of the patients in the control group died before the study ended, but they don't comment on this beyond mentioning it and just focus on the QoL improvements reiki apparently provided.

[Elderly Sumo Prophecy]

Reiki Martin?

[phantom_power]

People do online Reiki sessions. How does that work?

[Video Game Fan 2000]

[Shoulders?-Stomach!]

People do online Reiki sessions. How does that work?

You have to be logged onto the internet and it happens there

[JaDanketies]

I'm interested in this Journal of Evidence-Based Complementary and Alternative Medicine. Is getting something published in this as good as getting something published in Nature? I couldn't find any criticism of it - do some journals fly under the radar? Or is it actually decent? It's got an Impact Factor of 2.064 compared with Nature's 42.778 - but perhaps this is because it's niche? And why would you publish something in the Journal of Evidence-Based Complementary and Alternative Medicine when you could publish it in something like Nature?

[Al Tha Funkee Homosapien]

Load of bollocks like most alternative therapies, but if people find it beneficial then it is surely a good thing. Needs to be taken on a case-by-case and personal level.

[Buelligan]

People do online Reiki sessions. How does that work?

I've been doing online Reiki on Keith recently.  I think it's working.

[Zetetic]

I couldn't find any criticism of it - do some journals fly under the radar?

Yes.

[Icehaven]

In one of the shitty call centre jobs I had about 20 years ago one of the senior managers was really into Reiki to the point where she was so convinced it could enhance our lives and productivity that she tried to arrange day long workshops to teach staff the basics. Despite the fact our jobs largely involved sitting on the phone all day being yelled at by customers she still struggled to get even the minimum number of participants needed to sign up (think it was about 6) so it didn't happen. In a call centre with hundreds of staff there wasn't even 5 other people who'd rather listen to a day of woo-woo than moany customers. Or maybe they were scared of it being witchcraft, it was Coventry in the late 90s.

[Claude the Racecar Driving Rockstar Super Sleuth]

I once heard something that said the one proven benefit of alternative medicine is that the charlatans practitioners can have more one-to-one time with their marks patients than doctors can.

[JaDanketies]

I guess you've just got to accept you're not an expert in all fields, and when it comes to 'whether or not Reiki works', you've gotta go with what makes sense to your understanding of the world, rather than what the most convincing website you can find says.

Although I gotta say, the first link that she shared had a lot more of the ring of truth about it than the one in the OP and seemed like it was decent. (The third link - a copy of a Hubpages page written by someone called Green Lotus - was eye-rollingly bad). Obvious why I would discount the third link, but I just kinda felt intrinsically that the first link was better. It just read better and seemed more unbiased. But then we're talking about gut instincts.

Usually I'd say 'defer to experts', but the 'Reiki experts' would all say that Reiki works, so who is an expert? Some materialist physician? And maybe you don't need to have an opinion on everything, but the idea of being a Reiki-agnostic is embarrassing.

[Zetetic]

A lot of that is why I found this so powerful more than a few years ago:

The usual link about epistemic helplessness.

Spoiler alert

Even if it now proves that the the author has not been protected from believing silly and unpleasant things.

[close]

[JaDanketies]

A lot of that is why I found this so powerful more than a few years ago:

Spoiler alert

Even if it now proves that the the author has not been protected from believing silly and unpleasant things.

[close]

Yeah, I read that, it was good. The other link you sent with all the formulae went a little over my head.

[bgmnts]

I personally dont like the derisory, mocking tone when people talk about holistic medicine like there is absolutely nothing in it and its crackpottery on the level of moon landing denial or something.

People were using these ancient forms of medicines for millennia, and yes its not as effective as our modern medical breakthroughs and such - aromatherapy won't cure your cancer - but there is a lot of value in it to me.

[JaDanketies]

I personally dont like the derisory, mocking tone

I wrote more than half of this encyclopedia dramatica page on alternative medicine back in the 00s when it was okay to say offensive things about minorities and I was working to become a failed comedy writer.

[Captain Z]

Reiki is great, I have a little set on my desk.

[Mr_Simnock]

I'm interested in this Journal of Evidence-Based Complementary and Alternative Medicine. Is getting something published in this as good as getting something published in Nature? I couldn't find any criticism of it - do some journals fly under the radar? Or is it actually decent? It's got an Impact Factor of 2.064 compared with Nature's 42.778 - but perhaps this is because it's niche? And why would you publish something in the Journal of Evidence-Based Complementary and Alternative Medicine when you could publish it in something like Nature?

stealth fighter weekly

[steve98]

Reiki is great, I have a little set on my desk.

That's just a rake, not reiki. Raking mash potatoes.

[Elderly Sumo Prophecy]

I wrote more than half of this encyclopedia dramatica page on alternative medicine back in the 00s when it was okay to say offensive things about minorities and I was working to become a failed comedy writer.

Are there any more ED articles you'll admit to writing?

[JaDanketies]

Are there any more ED articles you'll admit to writing?

This one on wet and messy fetishism was all me. This one about forum veterans was 99% me. I did a good handful, once I doxed a pedo but I can't admit to which page it was publicly in case he finds it and sues me / makes a police report about me hacking his emails.

I was 21 years old; 12 years ago. I condemn my use of homophobic or ableist language and would distance myself from it as far as possible nowadays. There's no excuse. In fact there's not really any excuse for participating in ED, in retrospect.

[Gurke and Hare]

People were using these ancient forms of medicines for millennia, and yes its not as effective as our modern medical breakthroughs and such

That's a massive understatement though. In these millennia when reiki was the state of the art, anyone living to the age of 40 was revered as an elder.

If reiki is effective, then there is magic in the world.

[JaDanketies]

 Reiki was invented in 1922.

[Poirots BigGarlickyCorpse]

OR A BIG FAT PLACEBO, IT'S ALL THE SAME CRAP

[earl_sleek]

Strongly believe all cunts that believe this shit should be killed prohibited from voting or holding public office.

[bgmnts]

If reiki is effective, then there is magic in the world.

Well no its a placebo?