Author Topic: Different versions of same album  (Read 4688 times)

Re: Different versions of same album
« Reply #30 on: May 18, 2021, 10:55:54 AM »
Most of New Order's Factory albums differed for their US cassette and CD releases, and sometimes for the UK cassette releases too.

I bought Transformer on cassette, and then when I was rich enough to own a CD player I bought it again, and realised they completely changed the running order for the cassette to even out the length of the sides and minimise the amount of tape used.

Substance is different for each of the formats it was released on. The double LP only collects the A-sides of the singles (but omits Murder). The double cassette includes Murder and all the B-sides (minus Perfect Pit, which wasn't included on any version). The double CD was limited by running time of a disc, and so the A-sides disc doesn't include Murder and The Perfect Kiss is edited by 45 seconds. The B-side disc includes Murder but omits Shellcock and True Dub. Basically the cassette version was the one to go for if you wanted everything, but not in the US where it was cut down to a single cassette with just the A-sides (minus Murder again - it was basically the LP master used for the cassette release). All versions also replaced the original 12" versions of Temptation and Confusion with 1987 re-recordings as Bernard didn't like his vocals on the originals (this was after John Robie had taught him about singing in his natural key).

And this explains why I seem to own this in all three formats (and has nothing to do with my adolescent FAC(T) obsession).

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Re: Different versions of same album
« Reply #31 on: May 18, 2021, 10:58:22 AM »
Low Life is unusual as the UK cassette version was different to the LP and CD releases - it used the full length single version of The Perfect Kiss instead of the album edit, and also included the B-sides The Kiss Of Death and Perfect Pit. The US cassette release used the normal LP/CD version of the album.

This prompted me to see if I still had this on cassette (and I do). My favourite New Order album. A quick check on Discogs tells me it's worth about £70 too (not that I have any plans to sell it).

buzby

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Re: Different versions of same album
« Reply #32 on: May 18, 2021, 11:41:15 AM »
And this explains why I seem to own this in all three formats (and has nothing to do with my adolescent FAC(T) obsession).
And in all that I missed out the most notorious difference between the versions of Substance - the B-sides to the Factory Benelux 12" release of Everything's Gone Green. On the B-side label of the 12" single the titles of Mesh and Cries And Whispers are the correct way round, but on the rear of the sleeve they were transposed. When Substance was being put together they used the sleeve as the title reference, so on the cassette inlay (which is the only version to feature both tracks) the mistake was continued (Disc 2 of the CD release only got Cries And Whispers, incorrectly titled as Mesh).

It it wasn't until the 2002 release of the Retro box set that Cries And Whispers was released under it's correct title, and for the bonus disc of the 2008 Collector's Edition of Movement for Mesh to get it's correct title.

Re: Different versions of same album
« Reply #33 on: May 18, 2021, 11:47:22 AM »
The Manics have form for this for all sorts of different reasons. The US version of Generation Terrorists didn't include five (!) of the tracks on the UK release, but they also swapped some of the big hitters for remixes that sounded a bit more Guns N' Roses and featured a session musician on drums (rather than the drum machine Sean Moore used on the original). Here's the remixed You Love Us, which sounds really different if you're familiar with the original: https://youtu.be/-Ae_j2evUEY

The whole of The Holy Bible was remixed for the USA too, but the changes are a bit more subtle than the Generation Terrorists remixes. Here's the mix of Faster, which sounds a little less aggressive than the original: https://youtu.be/Na0ZcY28XkQ

I suppose that sort of thing doesn't happen any more now that everything's available at the same time to everyone online. Though you still see bonus tracks tagged on the end of Japanese releases.

But the weirdest thing they've done is change the tracklists on the re-released versions of This Is My Truth, Tell Me Yours and Send Away The Tigers. On This Is My Truth... they removed Nobody Loved You and swapped it for b-side Prologue To History, and on Send Away The Tigers they removed Underdogs and added Welcome To The Dead Zone. Adding a bonus track or two at the end is fine. Whacking a hit non-album single in the middle is acceptable. But swapping some songs completely really changes the trajectory of an album and just seems like a really odd thing to do.

Re: Different versions of same album
« Reply #34 on: May 18, 2021, 12:34:04 PM »
The recent re-issue of Fin De Siècle by The Divine Comedy contains new samples, the Jerry Springer-esque intro from Generation Sex is gone, replaced by a sample of an Italian man talking which I'm sure is from some very well revered Italian neo-realist film that I can't look up at the moment.

Same thing with The Certainty Of Chance. The ending with Neil reading a speech from La Dolce Vita, has now been replaced with the actual clip from said film. I imagine clearance issues may have prevented them from being included on the original 1998 pressing? Neil alludes to this in the sleeve notes, stating that the samples were his original intention for the songs.

Re: Different versions of same album
« Reply #35 on: May 18, 2021, 02:39:51 PM »
There is an extra 30 second track at the end of the vinyl version of REMs Reckoning that isn't on any other format (though it might have been reinstated on the re-issues)

"Foggy Notion" on the vinyl version of "VU" has a 4 note guitar thing before the song starts that's not on the CD or any subsequent issue of the song (I think...).

Re: Different versions of same album
« Reply #36 on: May 18, 2021, 02:55:22 PM »
Frank Zappa spent his last days replacing the bass and drums on his 60s albums and making other 'improvements' to his old records.

I can't remember if I mentioned my theory that this was an attempt to gib them of their preforming royalties, and that the tapes had all gone funny was a bare face lie.


Mind you, I don't know what the bass player would do with all that money waiting for him when he got out at the age of 132 or whatever it was.

Re: Different versions of same album
« Reply #37 on: May 18, 2021, 03:08:00 PM »
Frank Zappa spent his last days replacing the bass and drums on his 60s albums and making other 'improvements' to his old records.

I can't remember if I mentioned my theory that this was an attempt to gib them of their preforming royalties, and that the tapes had all gone funny was a bare face lie.


Mind you, I don't know what the bass player would do with all that money waiting for him when he got out at the age of 132 or whatever it was.

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kngen

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Re: Different versions of same album
« Reply #38 on: May 18, 2021, 03:27:09 PM »
The 8-track version of Never Mind the Bollocks has a slightly different mix (louder guitars) and is sped up (by a semitone, apparently). Could be just a mastering thing, but it sounds fucking great, nonetheless.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TP6LrjpoI6Q&t=239s

Re: Different versions of same album
« Reply #39 on: May 18, 2021, 04:08:48 PM »
I have the original Mo Wax edition of the first Dr Octagon album and was confused when a mate played me the more common later version. Not only was it rejigged and had a live track added ('1977') but it was missing two of my favourite tracks, 'On Production' and 'Biology 101'. I'm sure there was a reason these were dropped and not the nasty skit 'A Trip To The Gynecologyst', but it wouldn't be good enough to satisfy me.

Woah. The version I have ends on "halfsharkalligatorhalfman" and "Elective Surgery", then has "Waiting List", "1977" and "Blue Flowers Remix" as bonus tracks.

This is cool. Never even heard "Biology 101" before! Great track.

PaulTMA

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Re: Different versions of same album
« Reply #40 on: May 18, 2021, 04:12:01 PM »
Shania Twain's Up! album from 2002 was released in pop, country and Bollywood versions:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Up!_(album)

Re: Different versions of same album
« Reply #41 on: May 18, 2021, 04:25:24 PM »
Frank Zappa spent his last days replacing the bass and drums on his 60s albums and making other 'improvements' to his old records.

I can't remember if I mentioned my theory that this was an attempt to gib them of their preforming royalties, and that the tapes had all gone funny was a bare face lie.


Mind you, I don't know what the bass player would do with all that money waiting for him when he got out at the age of 132 or whatever it was.

Ozzy did the same with drums and bass from his early solo records too.

SHARON! presumably decided to do it after the original musos sued for royalties. Think it's Diary of a Madman and Blizzard of Oz. Both with a new rhythm section of Bordin and Trujilo.

niat

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Re: Different versions of same album
« Reply #42 on: May 18, 2021, 04:32:56 PM »
N.E.R.D.'s debut album In Search Of... was released in an electronic version in Europe, then re-recorded as a "rock" version for release in the US.

I think it's only the latter that's available on Spotify etc. I way prefer the original version.

Living Colour released some versions of Stain with completely different guitar solos on three tracks: Leave It Alone, Ignorance is Bliss and Bi. 25,000 copies of the alternative version were pressed, and it seems to have been randomly distributed so some people got the normal version and others got the alternative. I only found out about this a couple of years ago and hearing the alternative versions is very strange when you know the originals well.

Re: Different versions of same album
« Reply #43 on: May 18, 2021, 05:42:35 PM »
N.E.R.D.'s debut album In Search Of... was released in an electronic version in Europe, then re-recorded as a "rock" version for release in the US.

I think it's only the latter that's available on Spotify etc. I way prefer the original version.

Both versions were included in a recent reissue. I way prefer the original version too. They were right to drop the skits and I thought some of the weaker tracks were slightly improved, but they ruined all my favourite tracks, especially 'Stay Together' and 'Bobby James'.

purlieu

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Re: Different versions of same album
« Reply #44 on: May 18, 2021, 07:45:55 PM »
But the weirdest thing they've done is change the tracklists on the re-released versions of This Is My Truth, Tell Me Yours and Send Away The Tigers. On This Is My Truth... they removed Nobody Loved You and swapped it for b-side Prologue To History, and on Send Away The Tigers they removed Underdogs and added Welcome To The Dead Zone. Adding a bonus track or two at the end is fine. Whacking a hit non-album single in the middle is acceptable. But swapping some songs completely really changes the trajectory of an album and just seems like a really odd thing to do.
Underdogs was largely down to nobody liking it, especially the really shit editing where you hear the start of a word before it's cut. Nobody Loved You, I think Nicky's uncomfortable with some of the lyrics, and they've always regretted Prologue to History being a b-side, what with it being one of their best songs. These replacements don't bother me too much, because they're on the deluxe editions only, they haven't replaced the original versions which are still easily available, physically and digitally. There's still the chance that when they do the Know Your Enemy deluxe edition (probably late this year), Nicky will have arranged it as two separate albums as originally planned.

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Re: Different versions of same album
« Reply #45 on: May 18, 2021, 07:58:05 PM »
There is an extra 30 second track at the end of the vinyl version of REMs Reckoning that isn't on any other format (though it might have been reinstated on the re-issues)

I'm 99% sure it was present on the cassette as well as vinyl, but not on the (original) CD version.

I bought Transformer on cassette, and then when I was rich enough to own a CD player I bought it again, and realised they completely changed the running order for the cassette to even out the length of the sides and minimise the amount of tape used.

Ha, me too. My hat was fucked when I realised I'd been listening to it in the 'wrong' order all those years. I think I actually prefer the cassette running order, even though they really just switched the sides around and then swapped the final song on each side.

Not really on topic but for years I thought side B of Zooropa was actually side A, thanks to the way a buddy had mistakenly labelled a taped copy. It actually works better this way around, beginning with the static and soviet march of Daddy's Gonna Pay For Your Crashed Car, and closing with the triangle 'ding' from Stay (Faraway, So Close!). The title track kinda becomes the centrepiece of the album rather than the overlong introduction that it is.

Re: Different versions of same album
« Reply #46 on: May 18, 2021, 08:04:38 PM »
Ozzy Osbourne re-released his first two solo albums (the classic Randy Rhoads ones) with new bass/drum tracks done by his current band because the original bassist and drummer were wanting more credit for their large song-writing contributions.

if we're talking changed covers there's also this classic soul album which was changed to a plain shot of the singer for the 90s cd


Re: Different versions of same album
« Reply #47 on: May 18, 2021, 09:36:30 PM »
Apparently there's a Quad mix of "Pussy Cats" by Nilsson that has different ("better") vocals done during mixing. I would like to hear this.

Re: Different versions of same album
« Reply #48 on: May 18, 2021, 11:21:10 PM »
Drum were sweetened with electronics and reverb. I think some of the bass was re-recorded too. The shitty electronic drum versions of "Waitin' For the Bus" and "La Grange" you sometimes hear on dadrock and supermarket radio are from this. Yuck.

Thanks (magnum too). I only have the early albums on vinyl that I bought over thirty years ago, but i do remember now listening to them on youtube and having to look for "original versions" as the first ones I found were fucking awful.

Re: Different versions of same album
« Reply #49 on: May 19, 2021, 01:15:11 AM »
I didn't know about this. Is it an improvement?

RE: Bobby Conn's first album. The only track that's the same on the CD and vinyl is Never Get Ahead, the rest is either different mixes, different recordings or different songs. The only thing the vinyl trumps the CD version on is that it contains Who's The Paul at regular speed.

famethrowa

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Re: Different versions of same album
« Reply #50 on: May 19, 2021, 03:52:03 AM »

Brothers In Arms, I had the vinyl (or cassette?) and the songs are short versions, on the CD there's a big trumpet solo, and a long long rambling end to side 1. Or is it the other way around?


Frank Zappa spent his last days replacing the bass and drums on his 60s albums and making other 'improvements' to his old records.

I was fooled by this, I had In It For The Money on a 90s CD which I listened to for years and years. Then in the youtube era I decided to have a listen, and it was a whole new world... all the 80s deadness and compression was gone, and it sounded like a bunch of 60s freaks actually playing it together. Not sure which one is best now.

buzby

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Re: Different versions of same album
« Reply #51 on: May 19, 2021, 08:27:26 AM »
Brothers In Arms, I had the vinyl (or cassette?) and the songs are short versions, on the CD there's a big trumpet solo, and a long long rambling end to side 1. Or is it the other way around?
The CD and cassette version is about 4:30 longer than the LP version, which had to be cut down due to running time limitations. All the edits were done on the tracks on Side A of the LP, with only Walk Of Life being the same length as on the CD and cassette version. The issue was finally rectified in 2006 when it was released as a double LP in the US, which took until 2014 to be released in Europe.

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Re: Different versions of same album
« Reply #52 on: May 19, 2021, 11:17:46 AM »
Bob Dylan’s Street-Legal was remixed something like twenty years ago. It was recorded in 1978 in a warehouse turned studio which had poor acoustics. The original version was muddy and lacked energy. The remix doesn’t make it great, but it’s an improvement. The first version is still available on the complete albums box set.
There are three or four different mixes of Blonde on Blonde in circulation. Stick with the mono or with the stereo mix from the remasters, which is much more balanced than previous versions.

The first Crosby, Stills and Nash album had an unlisted interlude with Crosby singing a few bars from a Robert Johnson blues. It was removed from the latest remaster because it was originally considered as public domain then they didn’t want to pay rights to his estate.

A few late fifties Sinatra albums were recorded simultaneously in mono and stereo by two different crews using different sets of mics and different control rooms. The stereo versions, which were originally regarded as an experiment, became standard for decades, but the mono version of Only the Lonely, which is superior to the stereo recording, has been lately more commonly available. The mono versions of Where Are You? and Come Fly with Me are harder to track, but they’re also superior to the stereo versions.

purlieu

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Re: Different versions of same album
« Reply #53 on: May 19, 2021, 04:08:38 PM »
Speaking of remixes, Mike Oldfield's Hergest Ridge was remixed for quadrophonic sound in 1978, for the next 31 years, a stereo mixdown of that version was the only version in print. Then he did a new (horrible) mix in 2009, with the original 1974 mix on the bonus disc, and the quad mix has been out of print since.

Re: Different versions of same album
« Reply #54 on: May 19, 2021, 04:42:17 PM »
I guess this usually happens when bands are rumbled for using unauthorised samples. I really like Wild Nothing's Gemini album and have only just learned that my favourite track on it - Chinatown - has been changed on later pressings, presumably to remove the Chantal Goya sample. Similarly, The Go! Team's debut is now different to when initially released (or had a different release somewhere down the line) due to uncleared samples being removed.

I used to have a promo of Spiritualized's LAGWAFIS which had a bit of an Elvis song playing through it and that was removed from the actual release.

Any other examples, especially for other reasons?

AH THANK GOD, I wondered what the fuck was going on with Chinatown, love that song, just wasn't the same after they messed around with it

Re: Different versions of same album
« Reply #55 on: May 19, 2021, 04:47:37 PM »
Not quite the same thing but the original version of Jimmy James by the Beastie Boys used a Hendrix sample, they couldn't clear it or whatever so they used something else for the final album version and blow me if it didn't turn out to be superior!

Original
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vw5i7TPkYfI

This next one is the first song on their new album
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3NMb4CkoZys

Re: Different versions of same album
« Reply #56 on: May 19, 2021, 06:55:12 PM »
The original "Jimmy James" sounds so corny after Pauls Boutique singles. They lucked out.

non capisco

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Re: Different versions of same album
« Reply #57 on: May 19, 2021, 07:09:03 PM »
Not quite the same thing but the original version of Jimmy James by the Beastie Boys used a Hendrix sample, they couldn't clear it or whatever so they used something else for the final album version and blow me if it didn't turn out to be superior!

Original
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vw5i7TPkYfI

This next one is the first song on their new album
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3NMb4CkoZys

Ooh, you're not wrong, the released version is tons better. They still sneaked in a tiny bit of Hendrix at the end on that one as well.

Oh man I get such a Proustian rush off Check Your Head and Paul's Boutique. Those lads and Prince were such obsessions for me at various stages in my adolescence, the Beasties especially were a gateway to a lot of other amazing music as well. Yauch dying was one of the few times I've cried at a celebrity shuffling off.
 

Re: Different versions of same album
« Reply #58 on: May 19, 2021, 08:00:22 PM »
I bought Transformer on cassette, and then when I was rich enough to own a CD player I bought it again, and realised they completely changed the running order for the cassette to even out the length of the sides and minimise the amount of tape used.

Definitely a common issue, especially, it would seem, with RCA releases. I'll actually go so far as to say that the US cassette running order of Ziggy Stardust (which puts "Lady Stardust" after "Moonage Daydream" and shifts "Starman" to the top of side two) is the definitive version to my ears.

Re: Different versions of same album
« Reply #59 on: May 19, 2021, 09:28:07 PM »
Definitely a common issue, especially, it would seem, with RCA releases. I'll actually go so far as to say that the US cassette running order of Ziggy Stardust (which puts "Lady Stardust" after "Moonage Daydream" and shifts "Starman" to the top of side two) is the definitive version to my ears.

That must be the version I first heard. Got it out from the library at Brunel and Bowie finally clicked with me. Liked the odd song before that, but I wasn't that arsed entirely until I popped that in my walkman on my way to the shops. It was rewound to the start of side 2 and fuck. That explody bit before the chorus properly went off in my ears and that was it for me. Loved him from that second. When I got it on CD that bit was shit. From an explosion to a fizz, a wet fart. It's just not on. It doesn't sound so bad on that backwards hits comp, but it's never sounded as good as that tape did. I prefer that running order too. 'Lady Stardust' is a very good fourth song on an album.

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