The Abyss

[bgmnts]

Funnily enough, it seems this film has slipped into it's namesake. I cannot find it on any uk streaming service anywhere.

Why in god's name is this film not available? It's so bizarre in this day and age.

[El Unicornio, mang]

Seems to be a James Cameron thing, it's not available on Blu-Ray and neither is True Lies (aside from a Spanish release).

There is an Amazon 1080p version of it available though, and an Open Matte version, if you have a Mega account and want the links let me know.

[greenman]

Seems to be a James Cameron thing

I'm guessing a product of him having a high degree of control but never actually getting around to doing anything with his old films.

[bgmnts]

Seems to be a James Cameron thing, it's not available on Blu-Ray and neither is True Lies (aside from a Spanish release).

There is an Amazon 1080p version of it available though, and an Open Matte version, if you have a Mega account and want the links let me know.

Oh it said not available in this country, is it a US version?

[El Unicornio, mang]

Oh it said not available in this country, is it a US version?

Possibly, or maybe they just had it up temporarily.

I'm guessing a product of him having a high degree of control but never actually getting around to doing anything with his old films.

Yeah. Also a bit disappointing that we've been waiting 13 years for a new James Cameron film and it's going to be Avatar 2...followed by Avatar 3.

[greenman]

Aliens is sposed to be getting a 4K/UHD release next year at least, hopefully not as badly mangled as T2.

[El Unicornio, mang]

I watched that new remaster recently. Some excellent detail and colours but definitely went overboard with the DNR.

[St_Eddie]

A poster I mocked up after having a dream about it back when I was suffering from dental pain.

I'm guessing a product of him having a high degree of control but never actually getting around to doing anything with his old films.

Pretty much this.  According to this article a new transfer was being worked on a couple of years back at least.  It's possible that these things just take that long to complete, or that the pandemic halted the process.

I watched that new remaster recently. Some excellent detail and colours but definitely went overboard with the DNR.

Eh, the colour grading on the new transfer for T2 is awful.  Yet another movie which has been retroactively regraded to follow the hideous modern trend for teal and orange (whilst also removing the deep blacks and therefore depth of image) - comparisons between the original release and the new 4k transfer (I suggest playing the video back at x2 speed).

[El Unicornio, mang]

Hmm, looks a lot worse there. Is the 4k remaster different to the blu-ray remaster? (the one I watched)

There is also a third version which is apparently quite hard to find which is better than both the Skynet and Remastered. Doesn't have a load of DNR like they both have.

[greenman]

Pretty much this.  According to this article a new transfer was being worked on a couple of years back at least.  It's possible that these things just take that long to complete, or that the pandemic halted the process.

I'm guessing Disney's takeover of Fox held it up, luckly we got Alien before that happened which is I'd say one of the best looking UHD's yet released.

It does often seem to be the case that its actually when the director has close control that you get significant alternations being made whilst 3rd parties often do a better job of retaining the look of the original. That said I think its a mistake to always take the look of an earlier DVD release as a set standard, often a lot of them were not done that well and a product of their era in the late 90's/early 00's with a bias towards washed out colours and blue.

[An tSaoi]

Aliens always looked shit. They used crappy film stock. The DVD was like a VHS at times, and the Blu-ray is all waxy.

[greenman]

Aliens always looked shit. They used crappy film stock. The DVD was like a VHS at times, and the Blu-ray is all waxy.

Probably the result of trying to remove the grain.

Before the Disney takeover though Fox had actually put out some very good UHD's in Alien, Die Hard and Predator which used very little noise/grain reduction, the latter far better than the previous waxy bluray. Hopefully they stick to that or Aliens had already had the work done on it before the takeover.

Modern scanning and UHD can I think make grainy stock look much better, more natural and less blocky.

[St_Eddie]

...the Blu-ray is all waxy.

Probably shouldn't have left the disc next to a burning candle then, mate.  Arf arf.

Seriously though...

The DVD was like a VHS at times, and the Blu-ray is all waxy.

Probably the result of trying to remove the grain.

Correct.  The waxy look present in certain HD releases is due to excessive DNR.

[Chedney Honks]

An tSaoi may well be talking shit. It depends which BD release of Aliens he's referring to.

[greenman]

Again though the Fox releases pre Disney on UHD were actually some of the best for big mainstream studio films in terms of not fucking around with them so hopefully Aliens was actually done back then and just held up by the takeover.

[El Unicornio, mang]

Aliens looked pretty decent to me, although it does have that slightly garish 80s look to it

Cameron has a pretty strange view on what makes a good remaster though

"It's spectacular. We went in and completely de-noised it, de-grained it, up-rezzed, color-corrected every frame, and it looks amazing. It looks better that it looked in the theaters originally. Because it was shot on a high-speed negative that was a new negative that didn't pan out too well and got replaced the following year. So it's pretty grainy. We got rid of all the grain. It's sharper and clearer and more beautiful than it's ever looked."

[popcorn]

I've always felt this was a really strange film. Never seemed to be talked about or seen much despite it being another scifi film by the Terminator/Aliens guy. When I finally watched it I found it slightly boring.

[mothman]

I guess at the time he only had two decent/'big' films under his belt (Terminator and Aliens). It's possible it derailed his career a bit - he makes Terminator, then gets the Alien sequel gig, thst may comes out two years later.

Then... he spends three years making this passion project under very difficult circumstances, and it bombs. After that he rushes to make T2, then True Lies over the next five years. And then... FOUR years making another passion project. You don't have to look hard to find articles from back then about how Titanic would be his Heaven's Gate, his Waterworld (I'm sure there were articles after The Abyss suggesting the wonder-boy's career was over). And then eleven years to make Avatar. And how many will it be for A2, A3 etc.?

[Dusty Substance]

Ask Ed Harris about The Abyss if you ever bump into him. He absolutely adores talking about working on The Abyss, the easy going, laugh-a-minute chuckle clown that he is.

[bgmnts]

Ask Ed Harris about The Abyss if you ever bump into him. He absolutely adores talking about working on The Abyss, the easy going, laugh-a-minute chuckle clown that he is.

I read that he almost drowned. That would probably piss me off too.

I get the impression james cameron would be a twat to work for.

[mothman]

The crew had t-shirts made that had Life's Abyss And Then You Dive printed on the front. Presumably For God's Sake You Intermittently-Bearded Tosspot, Will You Please Just Get On With It, Not Every Frame Has To Be Perfect wouldn't fit.

[kngen]

I saw this at the cinema, and the bit where they revive the drownded person after about half an hour of CPR caused most of the audience to burst out laughing at how ridiculous it was. Someone told me that the special edition includes scenes where the alien fish beasties are actually responsible for that person [nb]Ed Harris? His wife? I can't fucking remember. It was ages ago[/nb] coming back to life. Seems like a really weird thing to cut out of your film if you don't want people to laugh at it. Did Carpenter have the film cut from under him then? (I guess he did with everything else at that point, so probably not surprising).

[bgmnts]

I saw this at the cinema, and the bit where they revive the drownded person after about half an hour of CPR caused most of the audience to burst out laughing at how ridiculous it was. Someone told me that the special edition includes scenes where the alien fish beasties are actually responsible for that person [nb]Ed Harris? His wife? I can't fucking remember. It was ages ago[/nb] coming back to life. Seems like a really weird thing to cut out of your film if you don't want people to laugh at it. Did Carpenter have the film cut from under him then? (I guess he did with everything else at that point, so probably not surprising).

If Carpenter directed it would have had an amazing soundtrack at least.

[Dusty Substance]

I read that he almost drowned. That would probably piss me off too.

I get the impression james cameron would be a twat to work for.

Almost drowned a couple of times IIRC. In one of the few interviews Ed Harris gave about working on The Abyss, he said he was driving home one night after a day's filming, pulled the car over and wept non stop for about half an hour.

Cameron's clearly a difficult a man to work for, but the guy's a perfectionist who has directed the two biggest films of all time.

In many ways, The Abyss is Cameron's most personal film, with Ed Harris playing Cameron (JC would later become an real-life underwater explorer) and Mary Elizabeth Mastrantonio playing Gale Anne Hurd. Cameron and Gale Anne Hurd were going through a divorce during the making of The Abyss, and Cameron would marry Kathryn Bigelow later the same year.

If Carpenter directed it would have had an amazing soundtrack at least.

You raise a good point here. The Abyss lacks a decent score. His two Terminators, Aliens, Titanic and Avatar all have pretty memorable and effective themes, but Alan Silvestri's score for The Abyss is totally forgettable.

[crankshaft]

The crew had t-shirts made that had Life's Abyss And Then You Dive printed on the front. Presumably For God's Sake You Intermittently-Bearded Tosspot, Will You Please Just Get On With It, Not Every Frame Has To Be Perfect wouldn't fit.

The Terminator 2 crew had t-shirts that said "Terminator 3? Not with me."

[Dusty Substance]

Seems to be a James Cameron thing, it's not available on Blu-Ray and neither is True Lies (aside from a Spanish release).

See also Strange Days, which he co-wrote and produced. Last time I checked there's no Blu-Ray release, which is a shame as it's one of my favourite 90s tech thrillers.

[Glebe]

Had the 'Special Edition' on DVD but it wasn't proper 'anamorphic' widescreen, I think it was like 4:3 letterbox, like setting your TV to widescreen made it 'artificially' stretch.

Didn't this come in for accusations of animal mistreatment, RE: the rat scene?

It has been broadcast in 1080p in the past, and preparations have been made for standard Blu-ray and possible 4K releases, according to Wiki:

In 2014 the pay cable channels Cinemax and HBO began broadcasting both versions of the film in 1080p. Netflix's UK service began offering the theatrical version in 1080p in 2017. At an October, 2014 event James Cameron and Gale Anne Hurd were asked about a future Blu-ray release for the film. Cameron gestured to the head of Fox Home Entertainment, implying the decision lay with the studio. Five months later another article suggested a spat between Cameron and 20th Century Fox Home Entertainment was responsible for the delay. While promoting the upcoming 30th-anniversary Blu-ray release of Aliens at Comic-Con in San Diego July 2016 James Cameron confirmed that he was working on a remastered 4K transfer of The Abyss and that it would be released on Blu-ray for the first time in early 2017. Cameron added, "We've done a wet-gate 4K scan of the original negative, and it's going to look insanely good. We're going to do an authoring pass in the DI for Blu-ray and HDR at the same time."

In March 2019 digital intermediate colourist Skip Kimball posted a photo to his Instagram suggesting that he was working on the film. In November 2018 Cameron told Empire magazine that a Blu-ray transfer was "complete for my review" and he hoped it would be ready before 2019. This was however before Disney's acquisition of Fox, so as of 2020, there has been no information about the Blu-Ray release.

[kngen]

If Carpenter directed it would have had an amazing soundtrack at least.

Ha! And Kurt Russell.

I blame watching Army of the Dead for my Aliens/Escape from New York directorial confusion.

[JesusAndYourBush]

Didn't this come in for accusations of animal mistreatment, RE: the rat scene?

The film was on just a couple of weeks ago and I noticed they cut a lot from the rat scene so you barely saw it in the water.

And it got me wondering if that whole breathing  oxygen-rich water into your lungs thing is in any way scientifically valid or is it BS?  I do know that if just one drop of water goes down the wrong way it makes me cough like buggery so I'm calling BS.

[St_Eddie]

...it got me wondering if that whole breathing  oxygen-rich water into your lungs thing is in any way scientifically valid or is it BS?  I do know that if just one drop of water goes down the wrong way it makes me cough like buggery so I'm calling BS.

It's not BS, at least not fully.  The fluid is known as Perfluorocarbon and it has an extraordinary capacity of retaining the oxygen diluted within its compound structure.  In fact the scene with the rat breathing Perfluorocarbon liquid was filmed for real, using the actual scientific methods.

However, it should be noted that The Abyss takes the real technology and adds a theoretically possible expansion for it during the scenes where Bud is able to breathe the liquid within in his diving suit for extended periods (in reality actor Ed Harris had to hold his breath for those shots).  The tech in real life is not that advanced, it's too dangerous for practical use in regards to human deep dives.  In reality, such dives would require the diver to have a total liquid ventilation tube inserted down their throat to assist with their breathing.  However, it is theoretically plausible within the realm of a science fiction movie and does absolutely have a basis within scientific reality as it stands today.