Glin's Slide No. 9: TransIXclusionary

[Milo]

Noting that's not quite the case in The Culture (since physiological reconfiguration isn't an instant process), I don't think that the issue would have the same weight, no. Arguably The Culture doesn't have gender, as something tied up with and derived from sex, in the way that we do.

True, although the gender change would be immediate. I suppose there's less scope for body dysphoria too as the changes would be visibly happening over the year or so (IIRC) it takes. And could presumably get put to sleep for the duration if it was too distressing - I'd assume the standard storage options would put the physical changes on hold.

It's never gone into but I wonder if the Culture might also have spontaneous sex changes, particularly in the young. It happened with

Spoiler alert

Genar Hofoen

[close]

after trauma so could see it if a nascent gender dysphoria was setting in.

[chveik]

countries hungry for medals

fucking lol

[Cuellar]

Graham's hot take:
Ten quid says he hasn't watched a single other womens olympic event.

Countries hungry for medals? The cis-gender Chinese woman absolutely destroyed everyone else in this event and she's 21. Are countries really going to spend their sports budgets forcing young lads to transition in the faint hope they might win a women's event? What sort of scenario is he imagining here: a 10 year old lad takes up weightlifting and shows promise, so his coaches force him to transition?

And besides, Britain WON a medal in the event that Hubbard competed in!

[JaDanketies]

I cried watching a British woman win the gold in the trick BMX category. How weird is that? She tried to do some never-before-seen-in-the-olympics trick on her first go and crashed out, got fuck all points. Then tried again on her second go and she nailed it! Can't believe I could ever give a shit about someone doing tricks on a bike. #truefeminist

[Kankurette]

Mumsnet are obsessed with Laurel Hubbard. There's three threads on her in AIBU. Apparently a trans woman competing means the death of women's sports and our daughters will never be able to do sports now. Even though most of the female athletes are cis.

It's pretty telling how TERFs are focusing on Hubbard but barely give a damn about other female athletes. Cis or otherwise. Fucking perspective, how does it work.

[TommyTurnips]

So these people warn of men taking part in women's sport so that they can net an easy win, but when one enters the women's Olympics and loses they get to gloat and say that this person lost to a bunch of women?

J.K. Rowling

[Cuellar]

It's pivoted to 'the very fact that Hubbard was even there means a woman was denied a place'

[Kankurette]

Oh, and the MN TERF contingent don't care about Caster Semenya because she's black. Simple as.

They're oh so concerned about this one female athlete who didn't get in, like they would have cared about her otherwise. And GCs are full of it. One of them called the Daily Mail GC. I'm pretty sure the Daily Mail is very keen on enforcing gender roles, not criticising them.

[Zetetic]

True, although the gender change would be immediate. I suppose there's less scope for body dysphoria too as the changes would be visibly happening over the year or so (IIRC) it takes. And could presumably get put to sleep for the duration if it was too distressing - I'd assume the standard storage options would put the physical changes on hold.

It's never gone into but I wonder if the Culture might also have spontaneous sex changes, particularly in the young. It happened with

Spoiler alert

Genar Hofoen

[close]

after trauma so could see it if a nascent gender dysphoria was setting in.

I suppose I think an awful lot of this simply wouldn't make sense in the Culture, much as all sorts of aspects of our identity that are tied up with but somewhat distinct from our bodies wouldn't. (Not least because any citizen of the Culture has a relationship with any affect that's largely at their own discretion.)

Interesting to think about this alongside thinking about Isobel Fall's I Sexually Identify as an Attack Helicopter, actually, and how that tries to set out a very different vision of detaching some of these things from (human) bodies.

[Zetetic]

They're all defined by the concept of fertility, though, and frame a woman as a physical entity whose development is marked by heterosexual sex: a fertile virgin, a mother and a barren "crone". There isn't a lot of room there for, say, sexually active young women who have no intention of becoming mothers.

Using that as a key part of female magic on the Disc is, as they say, problematic in some ways, and doesn't fit comfortably with ostensible second-wave TERF mores.

I think I'm prepared to be (over?)generous to Pratchett here. Sex (as in the act) and child-bearing and so on are important to the members of Discworld covens and their roles, but in large part because these things (or their privation) are still important in a life to most people. Ogg and Weatherwax are both post-menopausal, but one is still the mother and the other is the "... Other One" - yeah, that's tied up with literal children but it's also tied up with how they relate to the world, other people and death.

In Carpe Jugulum, witches explicitly shift roles because of the demands of the situation more than because they tripped a sexual or physiological boundary, although they mostly don't like it. (This is interesting for other reasons, maybe.)

[Kankurette]

I googled Emily Campbell and Mumsnet to see if they were saying anything about her. If they did, it was only in the context of Laurel Hubbard. Who apparently threw the weightlifting because she proved her point, and if she'd been serious then Campbell would have come third. Which is a bit insulting to Campbell, frankly, and Sarah Robles (who actually did get bronze).

TERFs are ridiculous. If Hubbard had won, they'd be saying 'see, this MAN is beating female athletes and now nobody is going to want to compete'. Hubbard came last and now they're claiming she deliberately lost just to make a point and that next Olympics there would be even more trans women entering and stealing medals.

How fucking petty and small-minded can you get?

[wrec]

How fucking petty and small-minded can you get?

If only THAT was an Olympic event

[idunnosomename]

So if you don't pay your license fee, you may end up in prison, where you could be sexually assaulted by a man who identifies as a woman.

[Poirots BigGarlickyCorpse]

I'm beginning to suspect that Glinner thought Brass Eye was a real documentary series.

[GoblinAhFuckScary]

went to a fuckin gig the other night in south london and just being out and about in public and not realising the worst of mental glinner adjacent behaviour is entirely online and by and large most people are a bit more decent is such a reassuring feeling

sincerely hope none of them sneery perma-miserable bleak fuckers ever leave their homes again

on a half-related note i've pretty much scrubbed all social media (in addition to avoiding news in its entirety) from my life and it's remarkable how more positive my outlook has become lol

[Cuellar]

Big Partridge pointing and ranting at Peter Baxendale-Thomas energy from this

[idunnosomename]

Theres another fucking post already. Fucksake

[phantom_power]

I googled Emily Campbell and Mumsnet to see if they were saying anything about her. If they did, it was only in the context of Laurel Hubbard. Who apparently threw the weightlifting because she proved her point, and if she'd been serious then Campbell would have come third. Which is a bit insulting to Campbell, frankly, and Sarah Robles (who actually did get bronze).

TERFs are ridiculous. If Hubbard had won, they'd be saying 'see, this MAN is beating female athletes and now nobody is going to want to compete'. Hubbard came last and now they're claiming she deliberately lost just to make a point and that next Olympics there would be even more trans women entering and stealing medals.

How fucking petty and small-minded can you get?

It's like anti-vaxers and all the other internet "experts" that know fuck all but think they are more clued up than professionals. Do they really think they know more about the competitive advantages or otherwise in a sport than the governing bodies that represent that sport? But no, they've all been watching sissy hypno porn and are in the thrall of the TRA brigade. The same fuckers who think they know more about biology than biologists and so go on about how "the science is on our side" despite the opposite being true

[Dr Rock]

On the topic of how many tervs there are in the UK, Helen Hatstand was kind enough to boast that the 60k raised for hatemonger Maya Firestarter came from average donations of £27. This fuzzy maths, but that could be roughly 2000 people. Some terfs might have been out that day, but most seem to get to mumsnet or twitter at least once a day. And to make up for any that missed out, bear in mind there would have been irish donations, possibly US and Canada too.

I reckon there's about 2k maybe up to 3k active terfs in the UK. A country of 70 million, 50 million of voting age. most terfs are women, so halve that and add a little extra cos there are more women than men = 28m potential UK terfs.

Unless I fucked up, seems like terfs makeup less than 1% of the number of women eligible to vote. And they're all old and just scared of this new-fangled gender-fluidity.

[JamesTC]

You forgot the 100 billion dead people in human history. They were all definitely TERFs.

[DreadedScotsman]

It's pivoted to 'the very fact that Hubbard was even there means a woman was denied a place'

They claim that, but then that person that was supposedly denied a place wasn't good enough to beat Hubbard and qualify, so surely then  they'd have done worse in the Olympics than Hubbard did. Or is it just going to the Olympics enough they'd be happy being another Eddie the Eagle laughing stock?[nb]no shade on Eddie the Eagle guys a legend but you get my point[/nb]

[greencalx]

So if you don't pay your license fee, you may end up in prison, where you could be sexually assaulted by a man who identifies as a woman.

Ha. Can probably guess who wrote that. Part of the reason why I left the site.

[chveik]

is biggy on mumsnet now?

[idunnosomename]

can we not enjoy silly young man with saucepan on his head jpeg on its own merits.

sigh. alas.

[Small Potatoes]

Doubling down on the Pratchett-was-gender-critical-actually-even-though-his-daughter-and-close-friend-say-quite-the-opposite, is it. (With bonus Karen White photo and another dig at Jon Ronson.)

Is there no level of bananas this cunt won't go?

[thr0b]

He's also angry at a tweet from the BBC Sport account which essentially says "we'll block and report anyone replying to this account with abuse, and suggest you do to."

He takes this as the BBC asking people to report WIMMINS to the polis.

[Kankurette]

From Mumsnet's thread about holding a vigil for all the cis woman who were denied a place by trans athletes:

It's just bloody heartbreaking.

Made even worse by the fact it's becoming so common place if it's allowed to continue it's going to become a regular experience for any girl or woman that has sporting ambitions.

Yes, the world of athletics is just OVERFLOWING with trans women and there can't possibly be other factors that might discourage women and girls from playing sports. Like girls being shunted away from sports like football, or lack of funding, or women being sexually harassed/having things thrown at them/attacked while jogging. It's all the trans' fault.

I wonder how Roviel Detenamo feels being the poster girl for TERFs who wouldn't have given two shits about her if she'd competed.

[Poirots BigGarlickyCorpse]

Well I for one am glad we've discovered the reason teenage girls drop out of sports. The only reason. The single reason. No other reason at all, that might involve doing actual feminism, or the hard work of getting involved with your local sports club, or even just attending your daughter's sarcastoball matches and telling off your son and husband when they chuckle at her uncoordinated flailing.

And did any of these Mumsnet shits say a single word about the cis women barred from the Olympics because their biological testosterone levels were too high?

They're so FUCKING lazy it's unbelievable. If they'd lived in suffragette times they'd be blaming the weather or feathery hats or some shit for the reason women didn't have the vote.

[PlanktonSideburns]

I cried watching a British woman win the gold in the trick BMX category. How weird is that? She tried to do some never-before-seen-in-the-olympics trick on her first go and crashed out, got fuck all points. Then tried again on her second go and she nailed it! Can't believe I could ever give a shit about someone doing tricks on a bike. #truefeminist

Yea it was brilliant

I loved the bit where she was asked about it and she said she couldn't have done it with her American contemporary inspiring her to go harder, and the American one said she was proud to be second to her because she was so great

[idunnosomename]

mentioned but it is telling that for all his ranting about the Olympics, he didn't touch on how a UK woman won a weightlifting medal for the first time today. if you care so much about women's sports???? and countries hungry for medals??? maybe say well done?!?!?

oh god the cunts written another fucking blog about terry pratchett. jesus christ