Misogynistic artwork

[Paul Calf]

[popcorn]

nothing else needs saying when abuse is being dignified as art

wrong.




ha ha how do you like it?

[Brundle-Fly]

It seems a very route one pathetic idea. How old is this artist? Fifteen?  People say, well at least it's getting a reaction, which is a lame boast because taking an individual dump in 5000 saucepans would get a reaction too. That's given me an idea.

[Buelligan]

nothing else needs saying when abuse is being dignified as art

Absolutely.  The dog thing or Thomas' rat thing or anything like that - people who make Art like that need a taste of their own medicine.  It's an obscenity of evil and tolerance or entertainment of it or its perpetrators in any way at all is an offence.

[Zetetic]

I didn't think popcorn was aiming to lend these things any dignity or argue for their tolerance as acts, by admitting them as art (which seem to have implicitly endorsed).

I'm not really sure what the point of the category is, and without that it's hard to decide or care about deciding whether stuff does or doesn't belong in it.

[Zetetic]

because taking an individual dump in 5000 saucepans would get a reaction too. That's given me an idea.

I'd get some assistants to execute that one, personally.

[popcorn]

I'm not really sure what the point of the category is, and without that it's hard to decide or care about deciding whether stuff does or doesn't belong in it.

Prezacto. "But is it art" is a pointless consideration when trying to determine if something is moral. It's just a confusion.

[Johnny Yesno]

I'm not really sure what the point of the category is, and without that it's hard to decide or care about deciding whether stuff does or doesn't belong in it.

Art is everything that you don't have to do.

[Johnny Yesno]

But is it any different from the PHWOAR! thread?!?!

That thread wasn't a ranking thread despite what you might have thought you heard.

[Dr Rock]

Art is everything that you don't have to do.

What like helping an old lady across the road?

[Johnny Yesno]

What like helping an old lady across the road?

Perhaps.

[Sebastian Cobb]

It seems a very route one pathetic idea. How old is this artist? Fifteen?  People say, well at least it's getting a reaction, which is a lame boast because taking an individual dump in 5000 saucepans would get a reaction too. That's given me an idea.

An individual dump across 5000 saucepans is more of a feat, when you think about it.

[Kelvin]

Is it art? That's the discussion!?

It's suitably prosaic for the subject, I suppose.

[Sebastian Cobb]

Is it art? That's the discussion!?

Presumably everyone agrees it's shit and not on? Do you NEED several pages of people saying that just to counteract its existence?

[GoblinAhFuckScary]

'but is it art' discussion demeans us all

[Shit Good Nose]

It's like that art installation a few years ago that was (IIRC) just someone letting a dog starve to death slowly. Is it art? Sure why not. Is it animal cruelty that should be illegal? Yes.

Without defending the guy at all, the reality is that he took a stray dog off the street, tied it up in an exhibition room for a few hours and then untied it at which point it bolted.  Workers at the museum confirmed this and said that the dog was fed and watered before and during (when the room was empty) the time it was tied up.  I believe PETA investigated and also confirmed the same.  So in that case it was almost certainly bad publicity (which the "artist" encouraged) being good publicity (and, from memory, the title of the "installation" was even something along the lines of 'People Believe What They Read').  A few years later the same guy took another stray off the street and took a photo of it each day until it had become fully "domesticated" and groomed, and then showed the photos in reverse at another installation.  Is it art?  Almost as bad as Mark Rothko's Dulux swatches.

[popcorn]

My ass is immoral - but is it art?

Butt is it arse?

[Sebastian Cobb]

'but is it art' discussion demeans us all

15+ pages I reckon.

[Shit Good Nose]

My ass is immoral - but is it art?

Butt is it arse?

Looks like a (ahem)................................BOTTYCELLI!!!!!!!!

[Fambo Number Mive]

It says a lot about this bloke that he's happy to exhibit to the world what an unpleasant misogynistic prick he is. It also says a lot about society that he not only felt comfortable doing this but that art galleries were happy to give him a platform for this hateful bullshit. According to the BBC story, the artwork "has appeared in several shows" so its not just OCAT Shanghai, which issued this statement:

"After receiving criticism, we re-evaluated the content of this artwork and the artist's explanation, we found it disrespected women, and the way it was shot has copyright infringement issues," the museum said on China's Weibo social media platform.

"As a museum that supports diversity, we will take this as a warning, improve our services and treat everyone with empathy."

So you didn't realise this piece disrespected women when you first looked at it prior to exhibiting? I wonder how female staff at the galleries that exhibited the piece feel about working at those places. Or female visitors to these art galleries.

From the South China Morning Post:

In 2019, Song was at the centre of controversy after an interview with the Chinese-language Vice magazine, where he rated the reporter's looks "277" out of 5,000.

He said he had hired three assistants for the project, carefully sorting out the 5,000 women, when they got to the "ugly" parts, they named the folders "forgivably ugly" and "unforgivably ugly".

"In the end, it was scary ... they were normal people, not missing an arm or an ear or an eye, but just so ugly that it made people uncomfortable," he told Vice.

Since the 2013 Uglier and Uglier exhibit, he had planned another one called One Worse than the Other, where he had 44 female volunteers walk on stage, from most beautiful to ugliest

https://www.scmp.com/news/people-culture/gender-diversity/article/3137871/chinese-art-museum-shanghai-apologises-and

Why should anyone feel the way someone else feels they look is "forgivable" or "unforgivable"?

I can imagine Song Ma would fit in well writing for the Daily Mail.

[Kankurette]

How can you forgive someone for how they look?

[bgmnts]

'but is it art' discussion demeans us all

Is this discussion art?

[Fambo Number Mive]

Is this discussion art?

Who would be the artist in this case? If I say it is art, as the thread starter, is it art?

[Johnny Yesno]

How can you forgive someone for how they look?

That's the spirit. I know I can't.

[Johnny Yesno]

Who would be the artist in this case? If I say it is art, as the thread starter, is it art?

Don't try and claim all the credit for yourself. Perhaps it's a collaborative work.

[Chedney Honks]

Inadvertently, I think this has cultural merit.

Modern Chinese society is crassly misogynistic, materialistic and superficial. There's a base and dehumanising element to being surrounded by so many people and there's an acute understanding of the mediocrity of the mass. People are dryly aware of the insignificance and ordinariness of the 'average person' and they prize celebrity, egregiousness and talent in a different way to the West, in my experience. My Indian mate says the same about India. There's an unimaginable reverence and awareness of the risen cream. It's 'the numbers game' and it's almost impossible to appreciate it unless you've lived with it. I found that quite fascinating compared to this country where we seek comfort in the illusion of potential and the special status of the individual, while trying to emphasise the ordinariness of the exceptional and try to bring them down to size.

I love the irreverence and disrespect of this country, but I also find the dispassionate matter-of-factness of Chinese society quite refreshing and sometimes funny. People can be self-deprecating to the point that you wince but they will also turn that critical gaze on you.

On that basis, I think this 'work' does have something to say about the society in which it was borne.

[Johnny Yesno]

He is a right Barley, though, isn't he?

[Mr Banlon]

Already done

[Johnny Yesno]

Already done

Damn you. I wanted to applaud your comment on the nature of plagiarism.

[thenoise]

An individual dump across 5000 saucepans is more of a feat, when you think about it.

What if they were really tiny saucepans?