Yay Capitalism?

[Blumf]

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-davos-meeting-trust-idUSKBN1ZJ0CW

Capitalism seen doing 'more harm than good' in global survey

LONDON (Reuters) - A majority of people around the world believe capitalism in its current form is doing more harm than good, a survey found ahead of this week's Davos meeting of business and political leaders.

...

The poll contacted over 34,000 people in 28 countries, from Western liberal democracies like the United States and France to those based on a different model such as China and Russia, with 56% agreeing that "capitalism as it exists today does more harm than good in the world".

Well, that's not good.

Of possible interest to corporate leaders gathering in Davos this week was the finding that trust in business outweighed that in governments and that 92% of employees said CEOs should speak out on the social and ethical issues of the day.

"Business has leapt into the void left by populist and partisan government," said Edelman CEO Richard Edelman. "It can no longer be business as usual, with an exclusive focus on shareholder returns."

But that sounds even worse!!

[Shoulders?-Stomach!]

Shush, let's not let the public know that government is routinely that shit precisely because it is under the thumb of private business interests.

[Video Game Fan 2000]

Lads you better not be doing class reductionisms in here again. Just try to artificially inflate the price of soybeans in a less normative way.

[Kelvin]

The problem is that if you asked the public about the alternatives, a huge number would say they're even worse. It's not enough for people to hate capitalism, they have to understand there's a viable alternative that would be better. It's in that area that people need convincing.

[Sebastian Cobb]

"yes it's bad but change is worse", the core credo of the centrist.

[Petey Pate]

The problem is that if you asked the public about the alternatives, a huge number would say they're even worse. It's not enough for people to hate capitalism, they have to understand there's a viable alternative that would be better. It's in that area that people need convincing.

I'm not sure that the survey results suggest that people are opposed to any form of change, as the phrase "capitalism as it exists today" implies that those who agreed believe that a different version of capitalism would be preferable.  That was what Corbyn and Sanders were proposing in the UK and US, the problem (well one of their problems) was in the perception that they were far more radical and anti-capitalism than they actually were.

[Retinend]

I think this is a problem with the word "capitalism" (an international word). For a long time we had a distinction between two very real poles of military power, and in that geopolitical framework people had a clear idea of which side they were on. Now that communism limps on only in a few remaining countries, capitalism loses the différance that gave it the clear-cut meaning it had during the cold war. The majority of people around the world polled today will therefore be de facto pro capitalism. Answering to the contrary might seem merely contrarian, to the average person, even if they have severe concerns about the way capitalism influences policy in their country. I think people might have answered "yes" in the spirit that many non-religious people call themselves Christian in polls.

[Kankurette]

Water is wet.

[bakabaka]

I think this is a problem with the word "capitalism" (an international word). For a long time we had a distinction between two very real poles of military power, and in that geopolitical framework people had a clear idea of which side they were on. Now that communism limps on only in a few remaining countries, capitalism loses the différance that gave it the clear-cut meaning it had during the cold war. The majority of people around the world polled today will therefore be de facto pro capitalism. Answering to the contrary might seem merely contrarian, to the average person, even if they have severe concerns about the way capitalism influences policy in their country. I think people might have answered "yes" in the spirit that many non-religious people call themselves Christian in polls.

While teaching kids and councillors about climate change, we found that substituting the word 'consumerism' for 'capitalism' made a lot of the discussion less contentious. The form of capitalism that people generally seem to want is one without the consumerism. Shame it doesn't/can't exist.

[Retinend]

That's a great point. I would wager that most people are against "consumerism", even if most aren't against "capitalism". But the difference between the two is just a change of perspective.

[Gurke and Hare]

I think "corporatism" is also a useful word to distinguish the capitalism of, say, a nice little cake shop you might go to (which could be a workers' co-op, but probably isn't) and Amazon.

[Pijlstaart]

I would like to formally rescind my british citizenship, I'm a company man, I pledge my loyalty to Clinton Cards and shall fly their card flag to new lands, to battle, and in death I shall be steam-pressed, folded into an immense bereavement card and kept on the mantelpiece longer than is tasteful. The nation state is sessile and ossified, it gives me the right to live and work in humberside, never been and never will, it gives the people of humberside a say in how I live my life, and I pay taxes for this?

What about something I want, what about a card for all occasions, bespoke stationary and drinkware, gifts you say, a range of gifts, an exclusive branding partnership with Boofle^Tm,  UK government NEVER partnered with Boofle^Tm, it lacks the dynamism, and that's why Clinton Cards will outlive it. When London goes full Dunwich the UK power structure will dissipate, not so with Clinton Cards, they're formless, shapeless, like Al Qaeda, up they pop in a regional airport, could be big stuff happening behind the scenes in Nigeria, maybe they'll sell pots, people always need pots, and cards, that's how you thrive in the modern world.

[chveik]

That's a great point. I would wager that most people are against "consumerism", even if most aren't against "capitalism". But the difference between the two is just a change of perspective.

not really, one is caused by the other