Alec Baldwin kills crew member, wounds another.

[Chedney Honks]

Hehehe

[Blue Jam]

Elsewhere in New Mexico, Chuck McGill does not approve:

https://mobile.twitter.com/MJMcKean/status/1451446234397360129

[Neomod]

That Guardian headline is one of the clunkiest I've ever seen. Like it was written by an embittered child.

Blimey, the gun apparently had a live round in it. The Armourer's gonna get it.

[bgmnts]

Elsewhere in New Mexico, Chuck McGill does not approve:

https://mobile.twitter.com/MJMcKean/status/1451446234397360129

David St Hubbins!

Jesus christ, live ammo. Someone's getting jail time.

[Alberon]

Why would you have live ammo anyway? It makes absolutely no sense. What the hell was going on?

Baldwin might not be culpable from pulling the trigger, but I believe he is a producer on the film so he might be responsible that way.

[rue the polywhirl]

Elsewhere in New Mexico, Chuck McGill does not approve:

https://mobile.twitter.com/MJMcKean/status/1451446234397360129

Seems to have aged quite a lot since Season 3. :(

[kngen]

The Guardian's coverage seems to be assuming Baldwin was actually shooting at multiple people on the set, rather than any possibility a gun exploded or misfired. Saying "Alec Baldwin kills woman" may be one way of looking at it, but if the cinematographer was killed by a negligently-installed light falling on her, I doubt the same language would be used no matter how negligent safety standards were.

Fucking hell, a potentially libelous sub judice headline and a pap shot of him after the incident. I know the Graun has been going downhill for a while, but this is both shameful and incredibly poor journalism.

[peanutbutter]

Why would you have live ammo anyway? It makes absolutely no sense. What the hell was going on?

Baldwin might not be culpable from pulling the trigger, but I believe he is a producer on the film so he might be responsible that way.

Twitter seems to be saying they hired non-union people on the set due to the strike (same one that BCS was impacted by) and they didn't have a clue what they were at

[McChesney Duntz]

Waitwaitwaitwait, now - who says it was a live round? Do we have any verification on that? I find that hard to believe, particularly since AB is a well-known anti-gun activist.

[Alberon]

Seeing there's no logic to having live ammo a misfiring blank like the one that killed Brandon Lee makes more sense but I dunno what really was going on.

Maybe it's time to ban blanks from film sets and just CGI gunshots.

[peanutbutter]

Waitwaitwaitwait, now - who says it was a live round? Do we have any verification on that? I find that hard to believe, particularly since AB is a well-known anti-gun activist.

https://twitter.com/IndieWire/status/1451539334142779396
Local 44, although that seems to be in dispute too from some stuff I'm reading, definitely not hard to see how the strike could tie into things though

[beanheadmcginty]

I read recently that the Radio Times has a rule that no one featured on the cover is allowed to be pointing a gun directly at the camera, with the exception of James Bond. I now realise this must have saved the lives of countless Radio Times staff over the years.

[QDRPHNC]

I read recently that the Radio Times has a rule that no one featured on the cover is allowed to be pointing a gun directly at the camera, with the exception of James Bond.

That might be the most gammon thing I have ever heard.

[idunnosomename]

Seeing there's no logic to having live ammo a misfiring blank like the one that killed Brandon Lee makes more sense but I dunno what really was going on.

Maybe it's time to ban blanks from film sets and just CGI gunshots.

Brandon Lee was killed by a bullet that had become lodged in the barrel after using lives for close up shots as far as I understand. So he basically was shot with a live round i think?

[QDRPHNC]

It happened to this guy in the 80s too. My mum used to watch this terrible show called Cover Up, and I can still remember her explaining to the 7 or 8 year old me that the guy who starred in it accidentally shot himself when they were making it.

[buzby]

Brandon Lee was killed by a bullet that had become lodged in the barrel after using lives for close up shots as far as I understand. So he basically was shot with a live round i think?

Not quite -the director apparently wanted a close-up of Funboy pointing his revolver into the camera which either wasn't in that day's shooting schedule or the armourer had  forgot to bring a set of dummy rounds to put in the gun (as a revolver has open ended chambers in it's cylinder, leaving it empty would be noticable and it is forbidden to even put blanks in a gun pointed directly at the camera without a bulletproof screen in the way).  Rather than go back to his workshop to get a set of dummy rounds (solid repilca cartridges made of cast or machined metal or resin), the armourer brought some live ammunition from his truck and improvised a set of dummy rounds by removing the bullet, emptying out the powder and pressing the bullet back into the now-empty case. The primer (effectively like a powerful cap from a cap gun) was left in place, and during the scene the actor pulled the trigger, detonating the primer of one of the empty cartridges which generated enough gas pressure to push the bullet out of the case and into the end of the barrel [nb]known as a 'squib' in the firearms world, usually as a result of an underweight powder load or powder deterioration  and usually noticable when the trigger is pulled by hoing 'phut' rather than 'bang'.[/nb]

After the scene the gun was unloaded (with the missing bullet going unnoticed, stuck in the barrel) and it wasn't used again until the stunt scene 2 weeks later, when it was loaded with blanks. Blanks for film use are generally loaded quite 'hot' to produce a bright muzzle flash (and on automatics to generate enough gas/recoil to get the gun to cycle) The first blank that was fired in the stunt scene then blew the bullet that was lodged in the barrel out and it shot the unfortunate Mr. Lee.

It was a gross breach of on-set safety protocols by the armourer. You should never use deactivated unfired cartridges (i.e. the powder removed and an unfired primer left in place) as dummy rounds as there is no way to tell them apart from a real live round (if the primer has been fired the firing pin leaves a dent in the centre of it). Live ammunition should never be anywhere near a movie set either, for obvious reasons. It should also be standard practice on film sets and firing ranges to store functional weapons unloaded with a Clear Barrel Indicator fitted (a long yellow or orange plastic rod with a flag on the end that is fitted though the empty chamber and the entire length of the barrel on pistols) to make it obvious that the chamber is empty and the barrel is clear.

Given that the film in the current incident was a western, the guns involved were almost certainly revolvers, and it's unfortunarely quite likely this may be a repeat of the The Crow incident.

it was quite common for heavy machine guns to be converted for prop use to use propane gas to provide a muzzle flash and sound. It's impractical for smaller machine guns, rifles and pistols though. Instead, they are converted into blank firing guns by having the barrel partially plugged with a restrictor[nb]Unfotrunately this cannot really be done with revolvers, as if you restrict the barrel the gas will follow the path of least resistance and mostly vent out of the gap between the cylinder and barrel, which would also risk burning the actor's hand.[/nb] (which both builds up gas pressure to cycle the action, and prevents a bullet being fired down it without it exploding) and on automatics the locking lugs from the bolt or barrel are reduced or removed, also to make it easier for the lower pressure of a blank cartridge to cycle the action (it was also common to convert guns in other calibres such as .45 to 9mm as part of the process, as 9mm blank rounds were the most reliable and easiest to source).

Nowadays they tend to use airsoft replica guns with cycle their actions electrically or pneumatically and add the muzzle flash and spent cartridges with CGI.

[Mister Six]

Fucking hell, a potentially libelous sub judice headline and a pap shot of him after the incident.

It's in the US so sub judice not a concern (US laws are insane on this, as well as many other issues) and AFAIK the hed is factually correct. Not saying it's a good hed, mind you, or that the pap shot is at all pleasant or appropriate to use. I guess it's been done with SEO in mind (all key words/phrases present in the minimum amount of space).

[phantom_power]

It happened to this guy in the 80s too. My mum used to watch this terrible show called Cover Up, and I can still remember her explaining to the 7 or 8 year old me that the guy who starred in it accidentally shot himself when they were making it.

Yeah I remember that. I was confused about the change of character until a while later when I heard the sorry story. Wasn't the theme tune Holding Out For a Hero?

[QDRPHNC]

Yeah I remember that. I was confused about the change of character until a while later when I heard the sorry story. Wasn't the theme tune Holding Out For a Hero?

Yes, I think it was! For some reason the part in the opening credits where the guy eats beans with a knife got imprinted forever onto my blossoming consciousness. Some piece of shit TV show my mum made me watch for like 6 episodes. The mind is a strange and wonderful thing.

[idunnosomename]

that's a bit different though because that was an actor who was unaware how dangerous blanks be close range. lee was shot because of pure negligence of who prepared the firearm for the actor to use.

the settlement terms of the negligence case for whose fault it was are undisclosed. I recall seeing speculation the financial loss from it caused the Weinsteins to sell Miramax to Disney? is that bollocks? it may very well be.

[Goldentony]

the entire Crow production sounded like a disaster, two of the crew got badly electrocuted too.

[idunnosomename]

https://www.latimes.com/entertainment-arts/business/story/2021-10-22/alec-baldwin-rust-camera-crew-walked-off-set

Seems live round means blank in this case

[mothman]

"Guns don't kill people, Alec Baldwin does!"

Charlton Heston, 1986

"From my cold, dead cinematographer's hand!"

[kngen]

It's in the US so sub judice not a concern (US laws are insane on this, as well as many other issues) and AFAIK the hed is factually correct. Not saying it's a good hed, mind you, or that the pap shot is at all pleasant or appropriate to use. I guess it's been done with SEO in mind (all key words/phrases present in the minimum amount of space).

Oh aye, well aware of the difference between UK and US libel laws, but were Baldwin of the mind to sue, he could easily do it in the UK as the Guardian US is owned by GNM Ltd (and the story is the same in the UK version). It's incredibly reckless for a UK news site to write something like that, even if it is under the shell of their US operation. The one difference is that The Guardian US couldn't be held in contempt of court like they could in the UK.

Of course, there are no chief subs anymore (or subs in general), but, in my day, you'd get your baws toed for writing 'Baldwin kills woman' even if it is entirely factually correct. Baldwin admits involvement in 'accidental death' of crew member is about as close to the wind as you should be sailing as a broadsheet (when your HQ is in London).

Edit: I see they've updated story to include 'accidental' in the sub. The thundering noise from the feet of the lawyers running down from the third floor to the Culture Desk must have been something to behold. Original story with offending heady is still up though, even though its orphaned on the site. Shoddy.

[Alberon]

https://www.latimes.com/entertainment-arts/business/story/2021-10-22/alec-baldwin-rust-camera-crew-walked-off-set

Seems live round means blank in this case

Yeah, another Brandon Lee most likely. Goes without saying that shouldn't be possible on an American film set. If that is the case I hope they throw the book at those responsible.

[mothman]

This is an awful mess. It's a perfect storm of cutting corners and playing fast and loose with the rules. Worst of all there will be no one single thing that will be pointed at as the sole cause - apart from the armoury "mishap" which will be shrugged off as a tragic one-in-a-million happenstance.

[idunnosomename]

I was going to say im no fan of Alec Baldwin but he didn't kill this poor woman, but if he was running and cutting corners on the workforce for this project, well, maybe he did

fucking hell. it really is upsetting she died just because they wouldn't pay someone to look down the barrel

[Mister Six]

Oh aye, well aware of the difference between UK and US libel laws, but were Baldwin of the mind to sue, he could easily do it in the UK as the Guardian US is owned by GNM Ltd (and the story is the same in the UK version). It's incredibly reckless for a UK news site to write something like that, even if it is under the shell of their US operation. The one difference is that The Guardian US couldn't be held in contempt of court like they could in the UK.

Ah, I thought they'd geo-locked it or something.

[Butchers Blind]

I wonder if this film was going to be any good? Guess we'll never know now.

[H-O-W-L]

The mention in several articles that Baldwin only cocked the gun make me wonder if it was a Single Action Army with a faulty dropping hammer as well. I've heard of it before.