More trouble in Iraq- 140people killed, 400 wounded

[Vermschneid Mehearties]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/3524589.stm

More than 140 people have been killed in blasts targeting Iraqi Shias as they celebrated the climax of a holy ritual in the cities of Karbala and Baghdad. US military officials say 400 were hurt in the near-simultaneous attacks of the bloodiest day since the war began.

The carnage was soon blamed on a man accused of links to al-Qaeda.

A sorry state of affairs indeed if something so serious is allowed to happen. The U.S seems to be prioritising the reconstruction of Iraq over finding and destroying al-qaeda, though unfortunately the two seem to be linked this time round, so they'll have an even bigger task on their hands trying to free Iraq from terrorism, as well as finding the groups responsible. This sort of attack may happen again.

[gazzyk1ns]

A sorry state of affairs indeed if something so serious is allowed to happen. The U.S seems to be prioritising the reconstruction of Iraq over finding and destroying al-qaeda

Hmmm yeah but when the war started (and before it actually) all you lot were saying was that "Well if the war is inevitable then the least they can do is swiftly rebuild Iraq and return power to them"...

Still, it is getting ridiculous over there now, I'm 'fed up' of hearing "X killed and X wounded in Iraq" because it happens practically every day.

[Vermschneid Mehearties]

I hope it's a 'stop the dying' sort of 'fed-up' rather than a 'this death bores me' sort of 'fed-up' anyhow.

Hmmm yeah but when the war started (and before it actually) all you lot were saying was that "Well if the war is inevitable then the least they can do is swiftly rebuilt Iraq and return power to them"...

Perhaps the tension is being caused by the U.S stll effectively occupying Iraq. That is bound to attract Al-Qaeda, and some other groups wanting to grab a share of the glory.

What we've seen so far is that the U.S have had to defend the cities from attack, and haven't prioritised restoring infrastructure because they are still under attack. So do they rebuild, and leave at once, or stay there to defend the Iraqis? At the moment, I'm in two minds, though I recognise that it's important that the US stay to ensure that stability returns to the region, though their very presence could also be causing the hostility.

[gazzyk1ns]

I didn't really think it was sensible to 'compare' the progress of rebuilding Iraq with the persuit of Al Quaida? i.e. the Iraq rebuild is going on now and must be completed ASAP (and there will also be a definite goal)... whereas the persuit of Al Quaida is going to be an ongoing thing and something which will change greatly over time and/or as a result of action taken.

[Vermschneid Mehearties]

I wasn't comparing them. They're two completely different 'tasks'. I disagree that the Iraq construction must be completed ASAP. Why? So the allies can be shipped back to the homelands to save their own hides? It should take as long as they need, though I'm sure they won't finish the job properly before flying back to the U.S.

[gazzyk1ns]

Dunno, I thought the line of most US-bashers was that one of the main reasons the Iraq war was so bad was because they'd probably up and leave the country in a terrible state as soon as they'd bombed the hell out of it.

I don't know or care much though, I've not read enough about it and I don't have strong enough political views to debate it, sorry. Jutl? Pinball?

[Vermschneid Mehearties]

It was one of a number of reasons- I'm not sure it was a main reason, but rather a concern. The US have shown a bit of resilience by staying put, but I'm not sure whether I'm more inclined to believe that it's because the region is still extremely dangerous. As soon as the attacks stopped, I think they'd be making tracks, and not worrying too much about water/electricity/socioeconomic issues.

[Dangermouse]

I disagree that the Iraq construction must be completed ASAP. Why?

Probably because they don't have the basic needs to survive. People need clean water and medical supplies or do you think this isn't important?

I wasn't comparing them. They're two completely different 'tasks'.

Discussing the merits of one over the other would be comparing them.

A sorry state of affairs indeed if something so serious is allowed to happen. The U.S seems to be prioritising the reconstruction of Iraq over finding and destroying al-qaeda, though unfortunately the two seem to be linked this time round, so they'll have an even bigger task on their hands trying to free Iraq from terrorism, as well as finding the groups responsible. This sort of attack may happen again.

It's not just about al-qaeda but in-fighting between religious sections and general criminal gangs

[Vermschneid Mehearties]

Probably because they don't have the basic needs to survive. People need clean water and medical supplies or do you think this isn't important?

It was implied that it should be completed in order to get 'us' out of there, which I'd disagree with. Plus, as I've said, it's about priority. Safety and basic human needs first- infrastructure and government later. That's not something you can rush into.

Discussing the merits of one over the other would be comparing them.

I'm glad I didn't discuss the merits of one over the other then.

It's not just about al-qaeda but in-fighting between religious sections and general criminal gangs

Which is what I've stated below that.

[Bilko]

Bringing the tone down a bit. Jon Snow on Channel 4 news last night referred to the attacks as a split between sunni and shai. He was making that phrase sound like Sonny and Cher. A bit rough of Sonny seen as he died in a skiing accident four years ago. Snow just can't let the rivalary between the two go. At least he never got on the shi'ites.

[Evil Knevil]

Hammill, not that shitty old joke *again*.

Yeah, well Iraq is fucked if the Sunni minority really is pissed off enough to do such a thing on the Shi'ites holy day.
Even 30 years ago none of this would have seemed possible.

I saw an interesting periodical article about al-Q as an extension of Saudi internal politics. The Wahabi fundamentalists in Saudi really despise the Shi'tes (who make up an extremely oppressed 15% of the pop)  and it is these Wahabi groups who have been 'educating' the young many Arabic countries. This action just goes to show how widespread their batshit insane teaching have become.