ZEITGEIST: Paul Smith and the Hot Water Club

[sevendaughters]

Dunno if you have been to Liverpool or seen any algorithm-pushed comedy on youtube, instagram, or TikTok, but Paul Smith is currently absolutely fecking massive.

I've not seen him live but I have seen the crowds lined down Hardman St for the sold out early show on a weekend. The current venue, formerly the Magnet rock club, has two rooms but they're moving to a bigger purpose-built gaff over near Vauxhall. Hot Water are also promoting all over the shop, and the fortunes of each are intertwined.

Here's a sampling of Smith. I'm no fan of crowd-work style perma-Comedy Store types, but I can't deny he has a way with the locals and is no holds barred in a fairly egalitarian way. Every night is like the stag night of your dreams.

Can't deny that Smith is working his sack off too. Here's his obligations for the coming months, and what this misses is that he pops back to Liverpool to do spots at HWC to keep the crowds coming.



The slate of non-Smith comics is pretty much a massive sausage party - https://www.hotwatercomedy.co.uk/events/ - but they really are packing them in.

Anyone been to these shows? Thoughts? Is it just Liverpool experiencing a huge comedy boom? Do you mind that it isn't in the theatrical and 'deeper' vein of quality Fringe comedy?

We've also got Frankie Allen, self-branded 'Britain's most feared comedian' because he looks like a gangland figure. He probably doesn't deserve his own thread, but fits here as he seems to be doing well for himself after years of swimming along unnoticed: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x3X34Nn2GgU

[BritishHobo]

I do really enjoy the clips I see of Paul, although I'm so awkward I'd have to sit near the back if I went in person. He does seem properly affable, and does crowd work with a lot more charm than the robotic preprogrammed comeback feel that you get from people like Jimmy Carr. He just seems like he's having a great time, which he must be to handle a tour schedule like that.

[mrspangles]

I remember the founders of Hot Water, Paul and Michael, started out as open spots doing the circuit before going into the club game. Have to credit that a lot of their success is how they've built their brand in-house - the video clips have actually had some thought into making them look professional and decent quality, many other clubs have gone for a pisspoor video on a tripod with little thought. Plus incorporating a podcast studio in your build gives you a lot more scope with the premises beyond just evening shows. Liverpool and Hot Water are probably the biggest example of regional growth beyond mainstream recognition, some individuals like Gary Powndland have managed similar in the West Midlands, but they have actually managed to firmly implant themselves into the algorithm. Great acumen.

[MigraineBoy]

Having seen Paul Smith's set I'm not a fan of his actual routines, but it's hard not to like him cos he's so comfortable & funny working crowds.

Frankie Allen is shit - however the YouTube vid of his Cribs style look around his house is unintentionally hilarious.

[famethrowa]

Going to assume that clip was entirely fabricated in his front room with a few friends and a laugh track, what with the absence of crowd shots, lighting, ambience etc

[Tony Yeboah]

The Hot Water promoters have done a fantastic job in building up the brand and comics like Paul Smith and Adam Rowe have really grafted and are reaping the rewards. I tend to avoid the Friday/Saturday night bills now because they do attract quite a drunken crowd but Liverpool is a huge draw for stag nights so it is to be expected. They still host a lot of solo shows with good touring comics, one night in November for example they have got Harriet Kemsley in one room and Lauren Pattison in the other.

They must be turning over some serious cash on Friday/Saturday nights, they will sometimes have five sold-out shows at £15 per person with almost everyone knocking back the booze. I think they have a reputation for generally treating the comics well, although there is maybe too much of a laddish atmosphere that might put off some acts and there is a lack of diversity on some of the line-ups.

The success of Smith and Rowe will inevitably lead to plenty of sub-par blokes trying to replicate them, but overall the quality control at Hot Water is pretty good and a poor act will not last long there. The Blairs do also make sure the rooms are properly set up for comedy with quality sound, lighting and layout - which are often substandard even in some established comedy clubs.

[sevendaughters]

A mate of mine was saying that the podcast that HWC publish featuring Rowe is pure drenge, a bit on the dodgier side of things. If anyone can confirm I'd be interested. They're clearly pushing for that market though, the new comedy space has a podcasting studio.

[Utter Shit]

I'm not sure exactly how it all ties into the Hot Water network, but the clips I've seen of Jamie Hutchinson and Tony Carroll from their podcast are brilliant. Jamie Hutchinson is one of those people who just has funny bones, basically anything he talks about cracks me up. His story about when his house flooded shouldn't be as funny as it is, but the way he delivers it has me dying every time, especially when he's talking about the photo he took. His life sounds like an absolute car crash but it produces some great material.

https://twitter.com/hwgreenroompod/status/1532997197641416704

[Tony Yeboah]

Adam Rowe's stand-up act does tread a fine line and may tip over into outright sexism at times but at least he seems to have plenty of self awareness and does put thought into it. On Stuart Goldsmith's podcast he was questioned about a transphobic line and whilst I thought Rowe was wrong he was at least was prepared to discuss it in detail and show he had properly considered it. Whereas Jimmy Carr had been on the podcast a few weeks before and was not challenged at all about his material.

From the few clips I've seen of the Have a Word podcast it does not appeal to me and I have not listened to it.

[Levi]

The figures for the HAVEAWORD podcast are huge aren't they? Over 16,000 patrons paying up to £10 a month for the same one-note scouse effing and jeffing. They did a gig a the 10,000 capacity arena in Liverpool as well. There is some serious wealth being created. Occasionally Adam Rowe will post a pic of the gang out on the town and it reeks of that cokey Peaky Blinders aesthetic that ruins town centre weekends.

Agree with Utter Shit about Jamie Hutchinson's likability - I think there's a comedic tragedy about him that softens the laddishness.
 

[Schnapple]

Despite originally being from the area myself, I had no idea this scene was so huge. I don't think I'd enjoy a Friday or Saturday at HWCC myself these days, but as far as contemporary laddishness goes, none of this strikes me as too abrasive compared to the not-so-far reaches of the scene a decade or so ago. That Martin Hutchinson clip shared above really made me laugh.

[Utter Shit]

Agree with Utter Shit about Jamie Hutchinson's likability - I think there's a comedic tragedy about him that softens the laddishness.

That's spot on. He is a bit of a lad, and plays up to it, but he is ALWAYS the loser in every story he tells.

[Lisa Jesusandmarychain]

Is anyone you g to join me in pointing out that Paul Smith isn't all that funny?

[sevendaughters]

Is anyone you g to join me in pointing out that Paul Smith isn't all that funny?

here's the thing - in about 30 videos I have seen of him via viral means, none of it has been 'planned routine' (although I am sure he has some comebacks and patter in reserve) so I don't know if he is funny in his 'regular' work. but he is very good at handling crowds and appealing to regular folk without being part of some culture war and has built up a bit of an empire outside of the Fringe and Avalon and weak drink panel games.

[Levi]

here's the thing - in about 30 videos I have seen of him via viral means, none of it has been 'planned routine' (although I am sure he has some comebacks and patter in reserve) so I don't know if he is funny in his 'regular' work. but he is very good at handling crowds and appealing to regular folk without being part of some culture war and has built up a bit of an empire outside of the Fringe and Avalon and weak drink panel games.

Yes, the only planned routine of his I've seen was about the way his non-verbal daughter is still a very effective communicator - more of an observation than a joke, but some of my friends thought it was funny enough to send to me multiple times.
Don't get it myself, but as a compere he's very effective - confident, friendly, and of course amusingly incredulous even when asking yet another front row punter "..and what do you do for a living mate?...Butcher?.....Fuckin' 'ell! Sausages and that? etc etc.." to huge laughter.

Frankie Allen is a different proposition -very old school (even appeared on the rebooted 'The Comedians' ITV show). His increased popularity/notoriety is down to his son, who now manages him and has successfully marketed him as a sort of Frankie Boyle without the annoying Palestine stuff. There was a few viral clips floating about called things like "MOST BRUTAL COMEDIAN EVER!!!", of him on a tiny stage in a shithole pub where it looks like it's going to kick off. On the clip I saw, he even cracked a  P**i joke, which got a huge laugh from the gathered simpletons.

[dr beat]

Can't see the fuss about Paul Smith. Good crowd work, but toned down a bit it wouldn't be far off the kind of thing you'd hear on Billy Butler and Wally Scott's Hold Your Plums back on Radio Merseyside in the 80s/90s.

I did like Jamie Huchinson though.

[mrspangles]

Adam Rowe really does seem quite unpleasant and up his own arse. Yet he seems to get a free pass from the wider comedy community for his casual misogyny.

[Famous Mortimer]

How has it affected other comedy clubs in Liverpool? Is it a rising tide raises all boats thing, or have other places been swallowed up?

[Tony Yeboah]

How has it affected other comedy clubs in Liverpool? Is it a rising tide raises all boats thing, or have other places been swallowed up?

Laughterhouse is still doing fine on weekends. Baby Blue has closed but that had terrible reputation amongst comics anyway for the very worst type of drunken crowds.

Rawhide Comedy seems to have disappeared from the Royal Court but some pubs have been experimenting with comedy nights post-pandemic, such as Shenanigans, The Angus and The Denbigh Castle.

The new location for Hot Water will be slightly out of town, whereas it is currently in the heart of the main City Centre drinking area, but I don't know if that will have much effect on the audience demographic. Probably not.

[Joe Oakes]

Is anyone you g to join me in pointing out that Paul Smith isn't all that funny?

Judging his entire career by that single clip, I'd go further. I appreciate that he seems to be enjoying himself and has an accent, but that was pure shit.

Wasn't even good crowd work, just his stock responses to a copper, which is one of the easiest and most common professions to have prepared lines for. The reason he can't stop laughing at his own material isn't because he's being tickled by his own improvisation, it's because he can't believe his luck at how easy it is to trick people into thinking that he's doing comedy.

Write some material, other than what you might say if there's a dental fucking hygienist in the front row.

Sorry for the rant, I know nothing about this guy, he might be amazing, but sometimes it's good to go with your gut and ask questions later.

So fuck Paul Smith, nondescript name motherfucker.

[Utter Shit]

Don't have any particular issue with anything you've said, but it's quite funny that you're calling him a nondescript name motherfucker on a comedy forum where, despite the near-infinite options available to you, you've gone with the handle Joe Oakes. Say what you want about Paul Smith, but he is at least somewhat constrained in terms of the names available to him. Being announced on stage as Tony Yeboah would be very risky.

[sevendaughters]

I have a theory that people increasingly love crowdwork (especially when it works) more than actual material because they want to be included on the act, and that the idea of a person up there doing prepared comedy in a maquette of theatre or television is increasingly old hat in a media panorama that demands your input and energy. Even if Smith has done the same old bizzies/student putdowns a million times to the extent it constitutes his entire act now, he hasn't revealed the trick to the world, so you will still get people queuing down the road for his three Saturday spots for quite some time now.

[Lisa Jesusandmarychain]

Judging his entire career by that single clip, I'd go further. I appreciate that he seems to be enjoying himself and has an accent, but that was pure shit.

Wasn't even good crowd work, just his stock responses to a copper, which is one of the easiest and most common professions to have prepared lines for. The reason he can't stop laughing at his own material isn't because he's being tickled by his own improvisation, it's because he can't believe his luck at how easy it is to trick people into thinking that he's doing comedy.

Write some material, other than what you might say if there's a dental fucking hygienist in the front row.

Sorry for the rant, I know nothing about this guy, he might be amazing, but sometimes it's good to go with your gut and ask questions later.

So fuck Paul Smith, nondescript name motherfucker.

This seems a *little* harsh, but I agree overall with the sentiment. Saying things in a thick Scouse accent does not make those statements automatically hilarious ( see also John Bishop). Also the, I've only seen clips where he's talking to the audience ( that seems to be the bulk of clips featuring yer man online), but none of them seem all that great. Maybe his actual routines are brilliant, I dunno, but I sort of doubt it. Will have to try and watch one of his actual routines, in the interests of fairness.

[tinner777]

I'm not sure exactly how it all ties into the Hot Water network, but the clips I've seen of Jamie Hutchinson and Tony Carroll from their podcast are brilliant. Jamie Hutchinson is one of those people who just has funny bones, basically anything he talks about cracks me up. His story about when his house flooded shouldn't be as funny as it is, but the way he delivers it has me dying every time, especially when he's talking about the photo he took. His life sounds like an absolute car crash but it produces some great material.

https://twitter.com/hwgreenroompod/status/1532997197641416704

Love them two on the podcast. A particular highlight was Adam Rowe stating that these two are the future of HWC.
I enjoy Have a Word, yes it's defo a bit laddish, but Dan keeps Adam under check most of the time and they've introduced me to a lot of comedians, Jamie H, included.

[Tony Yeboah]

Dave Chappelle and Jeff Ross did a gig there last night. 

[Joe Oakes]

Dave Chappelle and Jeff Ross did a gig there last night. 

This is the first time I've hated a comedy club. Hating comedians comes naturally, but despising a venue feels new to me. And dare I say it, invigorating.

We all know how painfully rubbish and lazy Chappelle has become over the years, but I guess they felt that they couldn't turn down such a big name.

But Jeff fucking Ross? He was exposed for sexually abusing underage girls only a year or two ago.

Although he admittedly now has some hot competition, I'd guess that the worse comedian to have performed there is still Paul Smith.

[BritishHobo]

Yeah that sounds like a fucking grim evening.

[Dr Marbles]

OK, necro bump but meh.

This evening I was just having a scoot through the What's On page for the 3Arena in Dublin and in amongst yer Eric Claptons, Bryan Adams and Stevie Nicks (cheapest ticket €139!!) I saw two nights listed for something called Paul Smith:Pablo.

Having never heard of this guy, assuming some rapper I'm unaware of, I Google him and find no, he's a comedian and the subject of this thread.

He seems to have gone stratospheric - two nights at the 10,000 seater 3Arena (the same as Take That, and one more than the aforementioned Clapton/Adams/Nicks) is only the start.

On the tour he's playing arenas all over the place including FOUR nights at the 21,000 seater Manchester Arena.

I have no knowledge of his act other than a quick watch of that Youtube clip up thread and, in terms of material it's pretty thin, but he's clearly found a way to connect with audiences.

It's notable that of the over 150 dates on his tour only 2 are in London (albeit Wembley Arena), an area that is 1/7 of the population of the country. As has been noted, he's done this entirely outside of the usual panel show/Edinburgh/Guardian review path.

I know Tiktok/Instagram/podcasts have a way of sending someone to huge levels of fame within their fanbase without causing a ripple outside of it due to the power of the algorithm, but this is crazy. Even Michael McIntyre only played two nights at the Manchester Arena on his tour and he's never off the telly.

[BritishHobo]

Those venues seem a really odd fit. I quite like what I've seen of him, but it all seems very reliant on building an affable back-and-forth with the audience. Can you really do that in arenas? Does it not become a bit faceless and separated?

[OpenMikeKnight]

I think this sort of thing is happening a fair bit in the north of England - The Courteeners recently sold out arena shows purely because of local interest, for example.

It's quite nice it still happens in a globalised internet age.

On the basis of that video, Paul Smith looks really shit though. Average pub banter with people laughing along through fear he might turn and get nasty.