least funny python to make shit documentary not worth watching

[Autopsy Turvey]

Parts of Norwich are given over to these things without even needing the expats.

There are neighbourhoods in Norwich given over to American culture and religiosity? Not just the odd burger bar that does peanut butter and bacon in the same bun?

Aside from a lack of 'certain folk', what identifiable traits give Norwich it's Englishness?

This is a massive question, books could be written. To play along with the provocative spirit of the question, maybe it is the lack of non-English people.

Do you have a handy map of these zones?

Yeah https://www.kulturevulturez.com/map-london-hoods/

Does the presence of other cultures actively destroy Englishness or is it possible for an area to exhibit multiple cultural identities at once?

Massive question again, more books could be written, but let's say perhaps sometimes it can do, just as there are parts of Spain whose Spanishness has been destroyed by the proliferation of British ex-pats and holidaymakers. And yes it certainly is possible for an area to exhibit multiple cultural identities at once, but the result of that might not be a city that looks/feels/sounds English, for what that's worth (visitors from overseas are often more concerned about this than the English).

If we're talking about parts of the city being handed over, would it not be more worthwhile to look at the dodgy planning deals, the desirable areas being sold off as investments rather than homes, the empty decaying mansions and the encroaching privatisation of public areas?

Absolutely, such factors are especially relevant to Cleese's point as these very often benefit the Russians and the Chinese. Let's hope they've been reconciled c/o How To Do It!

[Gurke and Hare]

https://twitter.com/JohnCleese/status/1499466371784134658

As part of the research I'm doing for the programme on woke attitudes, I'd like to ask this:

Are wokes bothered by the lack of diversity in Putin's army ?

Fucking hell John, keep up, all the other edgelord boomers did this one a week ago.

[dissolute ocelot]

It's weird because if you read Cleese's Twitter, a lot of it is about how awful the Tories are, and attacking right-wing Christian hypocrites and anti-abortionists, but then he just turns into Sid The Sexist when anything involving women, LGBT people, or racism turns up. Is he scared that the wokerati will take him outside and shoot him, or does he really not know what he's complaining about?

[Pavlov`s Dog`s Dad`s Dead]

https://twitter.com/JohnCleese/status/1499466371784134658

Fucking hell John, keep up, all the other edgelord boomers did this one a week ago.

Not to mention the blindingly obvious fact that there will be similar proportions of LGBTQ folks in Putin's army as in society as a whole, only they understand all too well that their actual physical survival depends on their ability to keep that aspect of themselves concealed.

Perhaps less obviously, the Russian armed forces are not manned exclusively by ethnic Russians. Given that non-Russian ethnicities in Russia often have considerably less social capital than ethnic Russians, I'd assume they are disproportionately represented in the ranks. I'm too tired to Google stats, though, but I'll still wager I'm less wrong than Cleese. Frankly, if I'm not, just take me round the back and shoot me.*

*Edit: I'm a little bit spooked that Dissolute Ocelot used similar imagery.

[evilcommiedictator]

This seems like stuff for the TV show, surely? I posted this, and look at all the replies my staff put in complaining that I was old and racist with horrible language

[Poirots BigGarlickyCorpse]

John the "wokes" want there to be no fucking war or fucking armies, especially not armies that conscript young people (or entice them into enlisting with the promise of an education their parents can't possibly afford, America) only to throw them into a meatgrinder and forget about them, their severed limbs, and their mental illnesses once they come home.

[Ferris]

Not even internally consistent with the fiction he's made up to score twitter points. If you accept his bad and wrong premise, then Putin's lot are the oppressors so why would anyone give a shit about their demographic makeup?

It's sub-daily mail comments section stuff; you'd expect a cab driver in a Stewart Lee routine from 20 years ago to have fresher material. Embarrassing that he used to be an incisive anti-establishment comedian (albeit with his last relevant or interesting work half a century ago).

[Menu]

Anti-establishment? When?

[Ferris]

Anti-establishment? When?

Circa 1968.

[Kankurette]

'Wokes' are more bothered by the fact that there's a war on, John.

John the "wokes" want there to be no fucking war or fucking armies, especially not armies that conscript young people (or entice them into enlisting with the promise of an education their parents can't possibly afford, America) only to throw them into a meatgrinder and forget about them, their severed limbs, and their mental illnesses once they come home.

Yeah, seeing all those terrified Russian teenage conscripts who had no idea what they were getting into makes me glad we don't have it here. I'm sure John would prefer it if we did, not like he'd have to worry about getting shot at.

Rudyard Kipling might have been racist, imperialist etc. but that poem about Tommys was bang on. For a country that supposedly loves soldiers, we treat them like shit.

[Poirots BigGarlickyCorpse]

Rudyard Kipling might have been racist, imperialist etc. but that poem about Tommys was bang on. For a country that supposedly loves soldiers, we treat them like shit.

A couple of years ago the US Army's official Twitter account tweeted some heartwarming propaganda about a young soldier who had gone on to go to college on the GI Bill or whatever its equivalent is now. They asked others to share their stories of how the army changed their lives.

It did not go well.

[mippy]

This thread has reminded me of the massive fuck-off Mormon chapel near Chorley.

[Menu]

Circa 1968.

Interesting. I've never thought of him or Python in those terms. A bit like Beyond The Fringe, it just felt like a younger part of the establishment having a pop at an older part of the establishment. And BTF were far more political than Cleese ever has been. That's not a criticism btw, but I didn't think either group was in any way politically radical.

[Ferris]

Well 1968's anti-establishment satirist is going to become laughably dated if they don't update their stances, material, or targets. Exhibit A: Mr Cleese.

[neveragain]

Python is anti-establishment because it portrays those in power (e.g. the church, police, army, bankers, politicians, newsreaders) as ridiculous and not beyond reproach.

Life of Brian is the biggest example with its considered knocking of organised religion and political in-fighting, but my favourite piece would be the school sketch from Meaning of Life - there's an anger there that is completely against the status quo, that wants to look forward past these meaningless rituals and the recited drivel... and it's somewhat heartbreaking that the Cleese of today is so backward-looking.

[Menu]

The one where he has sex with his wife? God even thinking about that sketch gives me an immediate rush of Proustian fear. My dad was absolutely fuming when he found us and our mum(HIS WIFE!) watching that one afternoon. I mean it really was the rudest thing I'd ever seen.

Actually same thing happened when we rented Coming To America. My dad raced into the room after 5 minutes and turned it off.

[Menu]

Python is anti-establishment because it portrays those in power (e.g. the church, police, army, bankers, politicians, newsreaders) as ridiculous and not beyond reproach.

Isn't the portrayal too surreal to be political though?

[Ballad of Ballard Berkley]

No. Python is utterly contemptuous of authority/pompous conservative hypocrisy. The absurdist tone doesn't undermine that message, it's absolutely key.

If they had a message (and they'd be the last people to claim that they did), it's this: society is governed by an awful bunch of fuckwits. We're all doomed.

As neveragain says, so much of their work was fuelled by anger and despair directed at deserving targets. They weren't just a bunch of silly men titting about (not that there's anything wrong with that). And that's why people are so disappointed in the Cleese of today. He's become the very thing he used to rage against: an out-of-touch old fool moaning about a world he doesn't understand.

[imitationleather]

No. Python is utterly contemptuous of authority/pompous conservative hypocrisy. The absurdist tone doesn't undermine that message, it's absolutely key.

If they had a message (and they'd be the last people to claim that they did), it's this: society is governed by an awful bunch of fuckwits. We're all doomed.

As neveragain says, so much of their work was fuelled by anger and despair directed at deserving targets. They weren't just a bunch of silly men titting about (not that there's anything wrong with that). And that's why people are so disappointed in the Cleese of today. He's become the very thing he used to rage against: an out-of-touch old fool railing against a world he doesn't understand.

I agree with this.

[neveragain]

That's it. Personally it's the mix of anger and silliness that makes Python magic for me. As an original advert prior to the first series said, it's a 'new comedy to subdue the violence in us all.
And I was thinking of the Chapel section of the school sketch, before the sex, that's where all the good stuff is.

[Menu]

No. Python is utterly contemptuous of authority/pompous conservative hypocrisy. The absurdist tone doesn't undermine that message, it's absolutely key.

If they had a message (and they'd be the last people to claim that they did), it's this: society is governed by an awful bunch of fuckwits. We're all doomed.

Could you give some examples. I accept that Brian is a satire on organised religion but what are the angry digs at other parts of the establishment? I guess the Upper Class Twit of the Year is clearly directed at idiots that they've encountered throughout their lives. But Palin for example seems to have quite an affectionate take on British imperialism and public school etc.

Also at one point in his diaries doesn't Palin vote Tory(or at least he's very tempted to) and Cleese was Liberal/SDP wasn't he? Nothing wrong with that but he was no leftwinger.

You probably know far more about it than I do though. Been ages since I saw the TV shows.

[Menu]

That's it. Personally it's the mix of anger and silliness that makes Python magic for me. As an original advert prior to the first series said, it's a 'new comedy to subdue the violence in us all.
And I was thinking of the Chapel section of the school sketch, before the sex, that's where all the good stuff is.

Ah can't remember that. I must have erased it because of the horror of what came next.

[neveragain]

Ah can't remember that. I must have erased it because of the horror of what came next.

Here it is: https://youtu.be/eBqe5xvYnNc although that cuts off before the wonderful "move your coat onto the lower peg" school ritual stuff.

I'll think of some other examples...

[Menu]

Here it is: https://youtu.be/eBqe5xvYnNc although that cuts off before the wonderful "move your coat onto the lower peg" school ritual stuff.

I'll think of some other examples...

Loved that, thank you! No memory of it whatsoever so it's like new Python for me.

[Ferris]

No. Python is utterly contemptuous of authority/pompous conservative hypocrisy. The absurdist tone doesn't undermine that message, it's absolutely key.

If they had a message (and they'd be the last people to claim that they did), it's this: society is governed by an awful bunch of fuckwits. We're all doomed.

As neveragain says, so much of their work was fuelled by anger and despair directed at deserving targets. They weren't just a bunch of silly men titting about (not that there's anything wrong with that). And that's why people are so disappointed in the Cleese of today. He's become the very thing he used to rage against: an out-of-touch old fool moaning about a world he doesn't understand.

Bang on the money.

I really have nothing else to add, except that Cleese doing the "school cormorant is out of bounds!" slayed me because i saw it at the time while attending a school that aspired to that type of nonsense. It was brilliant and angry and silly and skewering. MPython was one of those things that is largely responsible for my sense of humour and who I am today. Still is.

To have him be such a tedious walloper now is sad, but having boomers disappoint me is very much in line with my life experience so whatever.

[Endicott]

Also at one point in his diaries doesn't Palin vote Tory(or at least he's very tempted to) and Cleese was Liberal/SDP wasn't he? Nothing wrong with that but he was no leftwinger.

These are all more reasons for current day disappointment.

Someone more knowledgeable will hopefully clarify but I recall in the very early 70s they were doing the odd TV spot for Labour. Google isn't coming up with much, something about a doc on canvassing from 1970.

[Gurke and Hare]

These are all more reasons for current day disappointment.

Someone more knowledgeable will hopefully clarify but I recall in the very early 70s they were doing the odd TV spot for Labour. Google isn't coming up with much, something about a doc on canvassing from 1970.

It was a training film for canvassers, it was linked here on Youtube a while back, but I can't find it now. And I'm pretty sure Palin never mentioned voting Tory in the diaries.

[McChesney Duntz]

Here 'tis: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6do95qglvvw

[Alternative Carpark]

To have him be such a tedious walloper now is sad, but having boomers disappoint me is very much in line with my life experience so whatever.

He's too old to qualify as one really. Born in 1939. That's the equivalent of someone born in 1886 when Python got going...

[BJBMK2]

Meaning Of Life is easily the most angry Python project, in terms of the material and overall darkness of tone. I don't know if it was just age, if it was there "jaded, video-sated public", or if it was a sort of Abbey Road type situation, where they all collectively knew it was the last hurrah, and just said fuck it?

There's the pointed digs at the education system mentioned above. There's also jabs at the financial mismanagement of the NHS, organised religion and it's obsession with any and all matters sexual, the "honour" and jingoistic bollocks that surrounds war, upper class greed, the commercialisation of Christmas. All delivered in a more pointed and direct way then the TV show, or even Life Of Brian.